Former Bliz CM...Tseric

[jkbostic]

Anyone know where Tseric went after his time with Bliz? We are talking a long time ago in "game years". I think Vanilla/BC timeframe. Really hope he found a niche because it takes are really specific personality to deal with the Blizzard WoW forums.

[Yarathir]

Oh, man. RIP Tseric.



Such a shame that the forums pretty much made him ragesplode. Funny, though, how what most of what he said in his rage-post was true. Sadly, no matter how painfully true it is, he'll be fired for it, because a business must act like its customers are angels, most of the time.

[jkbostic]

Totally agree....just ran across his final posts while randomly surfing. You're dead on....the dude could speak/write and what he wrote was on the mark.

[Bepples]

While I feel sorry for Tseric for having to deal with the forums, he did do a good job at fucking up the shaman class review patch partly by not listening to any of the forum suggestions (which was kind of his job at the time). Long story short: Eyeonix was meant to take the suggestions, he went on vacation so Tseric was to do it instead, Tseric thinks the suggestions are stupid, doesn't listen to them. Shaman review ends up being garbage, shamans get mad, Tseric can't take it and rages at/bans people on the Shaman forums, he gets (supposedly) fired.

[MrExcelion]

Tseric wouldn't have turned out the way he did if social media existed back then. It's pretty easy to stay bubbly and positive on twitter and facebook. With twitter, lead devs field questions directly from players. Now they can be more focused on fun stuff like building hype, working with twitch, and talking about how awesome their day is. The job description has certainly evolved and they can mostly just be like regular people in a public light now (as long as they're positive of course), instead of anonymous folks hiding behind an alias and custom avatar. Takes the strain off. They're not forced to deal with the forums as much anymore either since they're very busy with the social media sites, so they get to deal with good-natured folks on a daily basis.

[Peyj]

Tseric! I have one of his quotes in my signature - a quote that is still relevant to this day.

Anyway, I did a bit of quick Googling - read a rumor he was working with the Rift team? I have no idea how true this is, it was posted by someone on the WoW Forums back in 2011.

EDIT: Here is his full post... Amazing how relevant it still is:

When you can understand how a group of belligerent and angry posters can drive away people from this game with an uncrafted and improvisational campaign of misery and spin-doctoring, then perhaps, you can understand the decisions I make. Until you face mobs of psychology, you will not see my side.

Until you see some bright-eyed player coming onto the forums wanting to know what they should spec as this class, and see them shat on and driven away by petty and selfish people who are simply leveraging for game buffs, you will not understand.

You will not understand until you have to see it daily, for years...

Until you understand that many people will trod over you to get where they're going, or to get what they want.

Until you understand that so many people will agree, completely, 100% with a loud, vulgar and assertive individual, not because he is right, but because he is making a stand against "the Man"; to take no critical thought in what they say, but simply to hop on board.

Until you actually try to acknowledge those who do not speak on the forums, for whatever reason they have, you will not understand.

If you think an archaic business formula like "the customer is always right" works, you fail to understand customers, not a customer. It is a collective. No one person, even myself, is truly above the whole.

I simply have the unfortunate quality of being easily singled out.

SECOND POST

Can't help it.
Posting impassionately, they say you don't care.
Posting nothing, they say you ignore.
Posting with passion, you incite trolls.
Posting fluff, you say nonsense.
Post with what facts you have, they whittle down with rationale.
There is no win.
There is only slow degradation.
Take note. It is the first and only time you'll see someone in my position make that position.
You can be me when I'm gone.

It would be nice if people remembered that the people they are ranting at - blues, developers, designers, other players - are people too. All just trying to do our best.

Is raging over a video game really worth forgetting that?

[Jawless Jones]

wasn't he the guy that banned people for posting on the shammy forums? even if they weren't posting about the terrible state of shammys

and this is supposedly a reference to him

[xezar]

People miss this dude? Yeesh.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

While I feel sorry for Tseric for having to deal with the forums, he did do a good job at fucking up the shaman class review patch partly by not listening to any of the forum suggestions (which was kind of his job at the time). Long story short: Eyeonix was meant to take the suggestions, he went on vacation so Tseric was to do it instead, Tseric thinks the suggestions are stupid, doesn't listen to them. Shaman review ends up being garbage, shamans get mad, Tseric can't take it and rages at/bans people on the Shaman forums, he gets (supposedly) fired.

The shamans can get mad all they want. Doens't mean they're allowed to trash Tseric or be non constructive about it.

[Zechs-cenarius]

Unfortunately for Tseric or good thing for him he appears to have been fired from being a CM. I say fortunate because if you thought the community was shit back then with their class lobbying its even worse now. The WoW community seems almost on par with the LoL community when it comes to toxicity. Where ever he is hope he is a lot happier he was actually a pretty good CM.

[Peyj]

The shamans can get mad all they want. Doens't mean they're allowed to trash Tseric or be non constructive about it.

This is partly why Tseric's words are so powerful, I think. He dares, as an employee, to call bullsh!t on the "Customer is always right" line of thinking. Just because you're the customer and you're supposedly "right" doesn't mean you can just froth at the mouth and say whatever you want to gain some kind of leverage you feel entitled to, in game.

He says it really well here:

In fact, you are. Your self-entitlement blinds you to the real, collective understanding that is possible on these forums.

While you assert your own rights, some assert the rights of others, without considering themselves. Some make decisions based on their own wants and needs, some base them on what others may want and need.

You simply try to polarize the issue by saying you speak for all customers. The issue is not black and white, as you would portray it.

Imagine what this game's community could achieve, if we all banded together and worked on a positive, constructive project/feedback. If solid, well thought out and researched feedback wasn't drowned out with hundreds of posts of "Nerf Warriors 'cos I can't beat them" and "This mount looks the same as my old mount!" or "This new feature is rehashed and just damage control for flailing sub numbers!"

Just imagine that. Imagine how great this community could be.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Admittingly it's a bit harsh. It's true but harsh. The customer is not always right. Companies can't always try and screw the customer over(Blizzard's CS is epic so yeah) and the Customer can't act like a brat to them.

[Peyj]

Definitely harsh. I think this is a rare instance where we got to see what happens when you push a company representative to the brink of just not having that "polite filter" on anymore.

People use the "I'm the customer so I'm right!" and see that as an excuse to be a jerk.

[laughtrey]

Definitely harsh. I think this is a rare instance where we got to see what happens when you push a company representative to the brink of just not having that "polite filter" on anymore.

People use the "I'm the customer so I'm right!" and see that as an excuse to be a jerk.

The trick is making people feel like they're heard, even if you think they're a dumb dipshit. Not just call them a dumb dipshit.

Ghostcrawler was fantastic at this, his job wasn't to engage with the community, but he did it anyway and it didn't affect him. He heard the ideas he liked, rightfully so, and implemented them as he thought he should.

In the end, it's our game to play, not make.

[Peyj]

Yes, agreed.

In the end it comes down to "how much is too much?" How rude, demanding and disrespectful can a customer be before enough is enough and they're no longer allowed to contribute or participate?

Blizzard and this game are so big - and were so big, even back then - that it doesn't matter what they do or say. Someone will be horrendously offended and take to the streets to let everyone know the 'injustice' they've suffered (in this case, the streets are the forums).

I can't blame Tseric. I'm actually surprised it hasn't happened more regularly with this community. I have never experienced so many people so willing to bitch about so many different things, no matter how insignificant. It's actually kind of awe-inspiring, in the all the wrong ways.

I have no idea how Ghostcrawler kept his cool all the time. Did he ever snap? It would certainly be very understandable if he did.

[laughtrey]

Because he knew, ultimately, that he was doing a good job, and he was.

It's not the rabble on the forums, it doesn't take a genius to figure out that people go out of their way to complain, not to compliment. The vocal minority may be there, but it's hard to look at being the most popular MMO on the market and take the negativity to true heart.

Tseric wasn't directly responsible for game development, so he didn't have that positive reinforcement to help him.

[Stonecloak]

Yes, agreed.

In the end it comes down to "how much is too much?" How rude, demanding and disrespectful can a customer be before enough is enough and they're no longer allowed to contribute or participate?

Blizzard and this game are so big - and were so big, even back then - that it doesn't matter what they do or say. Someone will be horrendously offended and take to the streets to let everyone know the 'injustice' they've suffered (in this case, the streets are the forums).

I can't blame Tseric. I'm actually surprised it hasn't happened more regularly with this community. I have never experienced so many people so willing to bitch about so many different things, no matter how insignificant. It's actually kind of awe-inspiring, in the all the wrong ways.

I have no idea how Ghostcrawler kept his cool all the time. Did he ever snap? It would certainly be very understandable if he did.

It helps to have an understanding of human nature. Which I believe Greg had, and I admired him for it. It's like anyone who has insight or deviates from common practices which are destructive, or unproductive. They are usually exiled, or just the focus of hate because people will go to many lengths to remain ignorant.

[Yig]

Unfortunately for Tseric or good thing for him he appears to have been fired from being a CM. I say fortunate because if you thought the community was shit back then with their class lobbying its even worse now. The WoW community seems almost on par with the LoL community when it comes to toxicity. Where ever he is hope he is a lot happier he was actually a pretty good CM.

Actually I would say by far the community is much better on forums and outside sites than what it used to be like in the first few years. It used to be overwhelmingly cynical and jaded, you used to barely see even one poster "white knighting" or being a "blizzard apologist" at all, now you will see a mix of people blindly supporting Blizzard, blindly bashing Blizzard, and multiple people also giving constructive criticism and people attempting to explain Blizzard's point of view without blindly supporting them. It's a lot more nuanced than it used to be. But the extremes have gotten more extreme.

- - - Updated - - -

Yes, agreed.

In the end it comes down to "how much is too much?" How rude, demanding and disrespectful can a customer be before enough is enough and they're no longer allowed to contribute or participate?

Blizzard and this game are so big - and were so big, even back then - that it doesn't matter what they do or say. Someone will be horrendously offended and take to the streets to let everyone know the 'injustice' they've suffered (in this case, the streets are the forums).

I can't blame Tseric. I'm actually surprised it hasn't happened more regularly with this community. I have never experienced so many people so willing to bitch about so many different things, no matter how insignificant. It's actually kind of awe-inspiring, in the all the wrong ways.

I have no idea how Ghostcrawler kept his cool all the time. Did he ever snap? It would certainly be very understandable if he did.

He drank a lot. And not just anything, but alcohol. And hopefully things that are even more fun.

[Mormolyce]

Considering a significant proportion of forum users spend all of their time and energy trying to bait, annoy, abuse, frustrate, catch out and generally be total dicks to the CMs (and indeed everyone) it's hardly surprising when one finally gets pissed off about it.

What's more surprising is how many of the other blues manage to put up with all that shit all the time.

[TheTaurenOrc]

The community may have been driving the metaphorical bus, but he jumped under it all on his own.