So, what will happen to Ner'Zhul?

[Explorer]

Fairly, I'm one of those who were perhaps outraged by Blizz decision to place Ner'Zhul into 5-man! By that, they show him to be the weakest of warlords? Him, the strongest shaman of Draenor? Really, there were tons of ways to show his alternate story than to just waste him in the very first tier!
Not even mentioning the nonsense: an armored orc with hammer and another one with scythe are strong enough to be dealt by 20 persons, and he's not!
Absolutely ridiculous, I assume.
He could've been an endboss for Shattrath raid (since they appear to be looking for some sources of magical power), or at least a boss in one of the final tiers...And now they only left Grom and Kilrogg standing in the Iron Horde, right at the start! And that's a "powerful army"? Not even funny.
Oh, well. I still have some hope at them. Perhaps Ner'Zhul won't be killed and play some lore role in future, or "the Burial Grounds were merely a setback", you know, that funny Anub'Arak stuff again...
Any thoughts?

[Auxis]

Unless I'm mistaken, we're not certain if we actually kill him in the Burial Grounds. We could just be going there to stop his plans.

[Restors]

He maybe were one of the wisest shamans back in the days, but weakest for sure (mentally and physically). Let him die off as of poor excuse of an orc he is.

[Nekovivie]

5 man or killed off screen

[RadiationWoW]

We "defeat" him in a dungeon and later fight again against him, kinda like Kael

[Deleted]

he will be last boss in expansion

kicking Ner'zhul off like this would be.... bad idea.

[Auxis]

Also, isn't he meant to be toying with the Void? What looks to be the last room in the maps of Shadowmoon Burial Grounds looks an awful lot like another realm entirely; so we could defeat him and seal him away in the Void, and then whatever happens happens. Void King!

[Deleted]

Sadly I think he'll just be killed off in the 5-man. There was an interview a little while back with Afrasiabi who said Ner'zhul would only be part of the Iron Horde "for a short while" in a very jokey and dismissive tone (a little chuckle and everything). Combined with the knowledge that we'll be fighting him in a 5-man it's pretty safe to say he'll be killed off.

I don't necessarily have a problem with killing him off in a 5-man, it's good to let more casual players see important bits of the story rather than having all the climaxes tied up in raids. My problem is killing him off after one zone, moreover one zone which seems like it will completely butcher his character. It seems such a colossal waste to introduce these characters and then kill them off so quickly.

Blackhand and Kargath are raid bosses, Ner'zhul is in a 5-man, I heard a rumour that Kilrogg would die in a scenario. That leaves Durotan, Grom and Gul'dan (and Garrosh) for the patch cycle. They've hinted very heavily that Grom will not be getting any sort of redemption so he's likely dead and Durotan staying alive is too easy a fix for Thrall's daddy issues. It looks like the only Warlord making it out alive will be Gul'dan.

[Restors]

It looks like the only Warlord making it out alive will be Gul'dan.

That's all I'm asking for!!! ^^

[Deleted]

My hopes are that Ner'Zhul will in some way get on our world after WoD kill Bolvar and become the LK as he should be.

Bolvar will never be the character that Ner'Zhul is and another human calling himself the LK is just to mutch.

[Tenjen]

My hopes are that Ner'Zhul will in some way get on our world after WoD kill Bolvar and become the LK as he should be.

Bolvar will never be the character that Ner'Zhul is and another human calling himself the LK is just to mutch.

that sounds like a horrible fanfic-level idea. the title of LK is not a factional war. Turn by turn makes for a piss poor sequence of story events. Any notion of faction or race halts when you become the Lich King. Irrelevant factors to the being who controls the undead.

The LK "as he should be" is dead, and then died again with Arthas. Bolvar will be his own kind of Lich King. Other than distant mystique in the story, we didn't get much of the original lich king. "never be" is a vast generalization and exaggeration. He's not intended to be the character that Ner'zhul is.


*************************as for the discussion at hand*****************************

Ner'zhuls entire life until he became the Lich King was where he meant well but had a character flaw inside him. It's even more subtle than Illidan (who only used "good" and even his devotion to Tyrande as a façade to himself to hide his hunger for power and magic. Deep inside Ner'zhul hungered for recognition and the love of his people. He had a greed for power. He had skills, talent, ability and cunning.

But the thing about ner'zhul is that he was outmatched at every turn by others. His greed and cunning did not match Guldan's. The horde fell apart when he did lead due to his warlords politics and his inability to hold them in line (when he wasn't a puppet leader in guldan and the legions pocket). He was nowhere near as noble as Duraton. And even as the lich king in the end, his powerful willforce and sense of self could not stand up to Arthas's own when they merged.

We're meeting him at a stage when he convinced the horde that this was the path they had to take (after being deceived) and when he realized who these "Ancestors" actually were, he was puppeted by Gul'dan and unable to stop the drinking of the blood (at which point no one would have cared for the old ways or the deception).

Garrosh came around and brought everything into the open. Ner'zhul has lost all credit with the rest of horde (except most of his clan) for nearly damning the whole lot of them. Additionally, they've forsaken a lot of the mysticism that was his and his clans whole thing and taken up industry that Garrosh brought along to become the "Iron Horde".

He wants to do good for his people...but that hunger for power is still in him. That need to fulfill himself and be the one to guide the orcs to greatness. People like this who lose face, are dangerous. and god knows what powers he'll tap into to try and get what he wants.

[yetgdhfgh]

He will be asking Bolvar for a job and then he will betray him to become the next lich king.

[Explorer]

There was an interview a little while back with Afrasiabi who said Ner'zhul would only be part of the Iron Horde "for a short while" in a very jokey and dismissive tone (a little chuckle and everything).

Oh please, could you give any link to that interview??

He's not actually that powerful in this timeline. I think.

Well, even if not, I guess, at least stronger than Kargath Bladefist, who IS a raid boss.

[Mormolyce]

He's not actually that powerful in this timeline. I think.

Anyway, being in a 5man isn't some kind of indignity. You know lore-wise there's no such thing as dungeons and raids.

[Explorer]

So, what do you tink will happen to him? I see it that way: as you said (and I totally agree), there are 2 sides in him - the one willing to do best for his people and the one thirsting for power. So, I see 3 ways.

The "bad way" - he taps into the power of Void, empowers shamans with shadow\arcane energy, but gets stopped.
The "good way" - he realises the errors of his ways, leaves the IH and modestly asks Thrall to join our Horde. And ends the expansion as and NPC in Orgrimmar, replacing Drek'Thar as elder shaman.
The "middle way" - he goes bad, then we beat him, but not kill, then he turnts to good one.

My view: If he was to be killed, IMO, the story would be more epic - that'd be a raid in 6.2. - draining Void in Shattrath, standing against Velen, Velen sacrifices himself, and so, we have an epic raid at the level of Thunder King at least.
This way, he'd surely be dead\sucked into Void forever.

And we have a 5-man at the start of the expansion. 2 variants I see: 1) Blizzard have flushed a perfect character with story and charisma in a toilet.
2) Story goes the "middle way" I described above.
Ok, here I also have 2 variants - 1) Humble one and 2) Crazy one.

As I wrote before - after the defeat in the Burial Grounds he saidly goes home, and some time later contacted by Thrall. T. tells him about everything - that they are in altered time, that original Ner'Zhul was a murderer and Lich King, and well, Ner'Zhul is terrified and asks for a chance to repay for his sins. Thralls remembers that in original story Ner'Zhul warned his father so Thrall owes him. N. Joins us, and becomes an elder shaman of Azeroth.

Crazy variant is: what if we have - Hellscreams father and son vs Frostwolf father and son? Grom and Garrosh vs Thrall and Durothan? Hplefully, all the 4 orcs perish in the battle, somewhere around the final patch. Then, suddenly, orcs have no leader, all guys on Azeroth are too old, so Ner'Zhul becomes an orc race leader. Well...I really hope to see any of these variants come true....
And remember, when, at the end of WotLK Blizz were asked about Ner'zhul - they said - "if you mean, will he appear as an orc, he has an interesting story to tell yet". Being killed moments after appearing in the game is definetely not an epic story, right?

[Deleted]

Oh please, could you give any link to that interview??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8P4xSFOj0M - mentions Ner'zhul at 3:55. Not quite as dismissive as I remembered, but still a bit of a joky smile there.

[Explorer]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8P4xSFOj0M - mentions Ner'zhul at 3:55. Not quite as dismissive as I remembered, but still a bit of a joky smile there.

Oh, thanks a lot! Btw, do you anyhow see any chance for a better destiny I described a post above?

[Deleted]

Nothing will happen to him in 6.0 because 6.0 is the prepatch :P like 6.0.4 will be Warlords of dreanor :P

[The Flavour Cat]

I hope he dies in the SMV Burial Grounds. He will be part of the SMV questing experience, and then part of the dungeon. That's enough exposure for this measly Orc. That's enough for me to kill him off. What Blizzard need to do is give all the Warlords the right amount of screen time so that they don't feel under-utilised. Ner'zhul already has enough.

However, if he doesn't die, I'd like to see him take a background role. If the Alternate Legion does arrive on Draenor, that's more than an opportunity to kill Ner'zhul and Gul'dan off, providing the latter Orc hasn't been butchered already. Ner'zhul could open one portal instead of a few too many, and this ends up leading to Kil'jaeden again, and his body is torn into pieces, and he's sent to Alternate Azeroth. History repeats itself, blah blah blah.

[Mic_128]

Well, even if not, I guess, at least stronger than Kargath Bladefist, who IS a raid boss.

I wouldn't think so. Ner'zul never learned how to be a warlock (at least until he obtained the Skull of Gul'dan) and the elements have abandoned the Orcs. He's the one who had started leading the Orcs on the path to demonic enslavement.

He's not magically nor politically strong, so it makes sense he'd get shoved in some backwater job.