WOLCEN : Lords of Mayhem (Indie ARPG)

[KrayZ33]

Sure, if I'm bored of it after ~1 month I'm at a loss.
If I'm not however and can endure it for 3 months, I'm not.
Since I've been using the same 3 since (1)BC-(2)WotlK-(3)Legion I'd have a net gain of several hundreds of $€.
The quality of armor would rise, because Blizzard wants to sell that stuff and I would most likely buy another 5-10 sets for 40€ each. But that would still be *way* cheaper than 10-13€ a month.

[Wildmoon]

Sure, if I'm bored of it after ~1 month I'm at a loss.
If I'm not however and can endure it for 3 months, I'm not.
Since I've been using the same 3 since (1)BC-(2)WotlK-(3)Legion I'd have a net gain of several hundreds of $€.
The quality of armor would rise, because Blizzard wants to sell that stuff and I would most likely buy another 5-10 sets for 40€ each. But that would still be *way* cheaper than 10-13€ a month.

40*10 is 400 dude. You can play WoW for 3 years with that.

[KrayZ33]

40*10 is 400 dude. You can play WoW for 3 years with that.

Yes? What's your point. Burning Crusade released 13 years ago.
I'm not even counting vanilla even though I played that too.

By now, my subscription time is way over 10 years. Not counting Vanilla.
It's not hard math, you can buy 1 set every 3-4 months for the same price (if they cost 40€, I'd bet they are cheaper though). I'd never do it that often because I'm not a fashionist.
At some point, you have more skins than you can use and every new skin is wasted.

[Wildmoon]

Yes? What's your point. Burning Crusade released 13 years ago.

Wait transmog didn't exist back then.

[KrayZ33]

Wait transmog didn't exist back then.

Yes, but how does that matter?
I'm using these 3 sets and they are from that era.
Every other set was forced onto me and I didn't choose the Icecrown set by choice for example.

I'm using the WotlK Version of T3
I'm using the PvP version of the Karazhan set
I'm using the Legion Artifact Weapons - of which I'm currently locked out off because I'm playing Beastmaster

Obviously, I wouldn't want the switch to happen NOW, after I already paid ~1800€ into the system.

[Wildmoon]

Yes, but how does that matter?
I'm using these 3 sets and they are from that era.
Every other set was forced onto me and I didn't choose the Icecrown set by choice for example.

I'm using the WotlK Version of T3
I'm using the PvP version of the Karazhan set
I'm using the Legion Artifact Weapons - of which I'm currently locked out on because I'm playing Beastmaster

Obviously, I wouldn't want the switch to happen NOW, after I already paid ~1800€ into the system.

What do you do when you play a new class?

[KrayZ33]

What do you do when you play a new class?

That doesn't matter to me in particular, because I've played the same class for all that time since BC.

But you could've easily paid for enough sets by now.
It depends on how much you'd use that system. So there is no "better/worse" in this scenario. For me, F2P WoW would be a significant upgrade. For someone with all classes on max level etc. probably not.

[Tang0]

I'm confused. Is this the norm now? Do people really expect and want the "perpetual" content design? I want or expect about 20 hours of real solid content from any game at this point. Double that if you're completionist. It's a good day when I get a game that has content on the level of something like mass effect, dragon age, skyrim, fallout 4, witcher 3, etc. Those games are obvious gold standards, but I'd rather have a game with more enjoyable content that wraps up in even 10 hours than some game that drones on with "repetitive' autogenerated garbage for 100.

That's my least favorite part about PoE. The combat is lacking for <reasons> compared to so many other games, so the only thing LEFT is to grind maps or delve in search of that 0.5% meaningless increase in damage.

You do understand that this is a Wolcen thread, right? It has the same auto generated garbage you talk about, but much less of it and of much lower quality. Also, 10 hours is not that bad for a good game, but 3 Wolcen acts don’t even take 10 hours, and let’s be totally frank, they are “ok, not really “good”.

Cosmetics is tied to progression. Imagine if you can play WoW for free but you don't get any of the cool armors/weapons looks and shiny mounts by playing the game. Each of them then is sold seperately for 40$+. I would take the current WoW over that shit.

Wait, what cool armors and weapons or shiny mounts are you talking about?) are there any?)

Free to play with mtx does not remove all visuals except the shop ones. Sure, there might be some better variety in the shop, but there is always something else to wear or something else to ride. Maybe not as cool, but you play for free. Sounds like a win for many people i’m sure.

[Wildmoon]

You do understand that this is a Wolcen thread, right? It has the same auto generated garbage you talk about, but much less of it and of much lower quality. Also, 10 hours is not that bad for a good game, but 3 Wolcen acts don’t even take 10 hours, and let’s be totally frank, they are “ok, not really “good”.


Wait, what cool armors and weapons or shiny mounts are you talking about?) are there any?)

Free to play with mtx does not remove all visuals except the shop ones. Sure, there might be some better variety in the shop, but there is always something else to wear or something else to ride. Maybe not as cool, but you play for free. Sounds like a win for many people i’m sure.

All of them are cool in some way. In PoE you look like a pleb.

[Coldkil]

So, skipping the whole xmog/mtx/whatever thing that is running, whare are you all in the game and which build are you using?

Despite knowing that there is OP stuff laying around, i'm running a toxic/rend dot plaguemancer. Having no issues so far. I rerolled a completely new char for online now that the servers seem to run as expected, only real issues i found were two, and all on the ACt 2 end boss. I did have hitbox issue that i didn't have at all in offline; the pet however still keeps ignoring him in both phases.

For the rest, excluding a oneshot death i don't really know where it came from, i was again next to do a deathless story run. I'm planning to do one up to lvl 90 for the achievements, but i'll probably do it offline so i'll avoid possible server issues.

[KrayZ33]

I'm doing the boring bleeding edge cookie cutter build, ever since I understood where that damage was coming from.
I believe the whirlwind ability has the same rune though.

Shield Charge has to be the most amazing mobility skill ever, dashing around with that is so much fun.

I don't like the range skills and since the Bleeding Edge builds use dots/ailments, I have what I want out of the mage abilities.
You basically get to do what mages do with dots, but you also have the 1M++ hits alongside that.

[Beastiel]

You are likely a fanboy of PoE. It's fine. They can coexist. He didnt say anything about D4 being good or bad. No one knows.

I mean yeah I am and i don't disagree that they can coexist, I'm looking forward to hopping back in the next d3 season just because it's been a while and the game is still enjoyable.

Presuming its going to be bad is stupid as there's not much info to gather on it so this post is stupid.

Here's the thing: We have plenty of information. We know that when blizzard was a trusted name with experienced developers in charge, all the time in the world, freedom of direction and no shortage of budget the best they could make was Diablo 3. A decent game.

But now that just about every experienced developer has left, that there is no creative freedom, that deadlines are pushed and enforced harder than ever before by activision, that resources are finite, that most of the people working at blizzard are getting their start and making about half a living wage, why on earth would you possibly think that this game would be better than the last one? That's just being hopelessly optimistic and setting yourself up for disappointment.

[kail]

I'm confused. Is this the norm now? Do people really expect and want the "perpetual" content design? I want or expect about 20 hours of real solid content from any game at this point. Double that if you're completionist. It's a good day when I get a game that has content on the level of something like mass effect, dragon age, skyrim, fallout 4, witcher 3, etc. Those games are obvious gold standards, but I'd rather have a game with more enjoyable content that wraps up in even 10 hours than some game that drones on with "repetitive' autogenerated garbage for 100.

That's my least favorite part about PoE. The combat is lacking for <reasons> compared to so many other games, so the only thing LEFT is to grind maps or delve in search of that 0.5% meaningless increase in damage.

Yes? What exactly is wrong with continual content? I would bet that the constant league updates is the biggest factor to POE's popularity.

[Kokolums]

Yes? What exactly is wrong with continual content? I would bet that the constant league updates is the biggest factor to POE's popularity.

You could absolutely say that the "value add" for Path of Exile is that they constantly release updates that people like AND at a faster pace than rivals. *glances at D3* GGG is doing something special. You cannot get that anywhere else. If you want the BEST updates and the FASTEST updates in your ARPG, you ONLY get them in PoE. Period. That qualifies as a value add.

[Beastiel]

That's my least favorite part about PoE. The combat is lacking for <reasons> compared to so many other games, so the only thing LEFT is to grind maps or delve in search of that 0.5% meaningless increase in damage.

Doesn't sound like this genre is for you. It's supposed to feel like work sometimes. Your rewards are supposed to feel earned.

Where poe does it better than diablo, besides just having a strong currency system, is that it's a longass time before you're rewards shrink down to a mere 0.5% damage upgrade. You have a massive spike as your build comes together, another after your final labs, another after your 6 link weapon, another after your 6 link armor, then you can still sim gear upgrades for as much as 50% more damage, then upgrade to the new support gems, it basically feels never ending. but in a good way, rather than a shit way.

[kail]

You could absolutely say that the "value add" for Path of Exile is that they constantly release updates that people like AND at a faster pace than rivals. *glances at D3* GGG is doing something special. You cannot get that anywhere else. If you want the BEST updates and the FASTEST updates in your ARPG, you ONLY get them in PoE. Period. That qualifies as a value add.

Yes, 100% agree. I questioned BeepBoo that seemed to complain about continual content updates which has me scratching my head.

[BeepBoo]

Yes, 100% agree. I questioned BeepBoo that seemed to complain about continual content updates which has me scratching my head.

Continual content updates are fine. A new "thing" being added to the standard game every 3 months is cool, but they're not pushing the actual story much. They're tacking on sides to a meal in a way similar to d3 and releasing "seasons" whereby you... just grind the same content that you already did in the last non-standard league... again...

- - - Updated - - -

Doesn't sound like this genre is for you. It's supposed to feel like work sometimes. Your rewards are supposed to feel earned.

I prefer to earn things by flexing my skill. That boss in dark souls that took me 1 try while it took others 20 is more what I prefer. If I know what I'm doing, and I'm good, I can cut down on the time immensely. Doesn't happen too much in PoE because everything is huge RNG layers like it's some looter shooter.

Also, this genre is fine for me. I loved Victor Vran, Grim Dawn, and all those custom maps in WC3. What isn't for me are fucking looter-shooter style games that seem to be rearing their head into every genre as a means of artificially extending content past it's natural death bed. People need to learn... it's fine to put things down and wait for a FULL xpac or, gasp, a 2nd game in a series!

Where poe does it better than diablo, besides just having a strong currency system, is that it's a longass time before you're rewards shrink down to a mere 0.5% damage upgrade. You have a massive spike as your build comes together, another after your final labs, another after your 6 link weapon, another after your 6 link armor, then you can still sim gear upgrades for as much as 50% more damage, then upgrade to the new support gems, it basically feels never ending. but in a good way, rather than a shit way.

Idk what you're talking about, but at only 20 hours in I have all of that stuff, minus the final lab completion. I also refuse to indulge the RNG nature of the game and farm my life away on maps and delves, and luckily for me the game lets you trade all items so I can get what I want from other players.

The best parts of the game are the boss fights, and actually only a very limited number of them.

I'm not very far into wolcen yet, so I can't speak much to that, but I look forward to beating the game and uninstalling it like a normal single player game. The difference is, so far, combat is actually on point versus POE, which is the most important factor to me.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

We don't need every genre to turn into dark souls level of "challenge." But mk.

[BeepBoo]

We don't need every genre to turn into dark souls level of "challenge." But mk.

We have FAR FAR more games that have basically no appreciable combat depth than we do games like DS. Also, you can have depth while also not having it be incredibly hard. You just have to have fights that last a little longer than 1-2 seconds (even for most bosses) is all.

[Tang0]

I prefer to earn things by flexing my skill. That boss in dark souls that took me 1 try while it took others 20 is more what I prefer. If I know what I'm doing, and I'm good, I can cut down on the time immensely. Doesn't happen too much in PoE because everything is huge RNG layers like it's some looter shooter.

Fixed that for you. Had to be done, no hard feelings here. People who talk about flexing their skill are usually not very good.

Also you can actually flex some skill even in poe by doing the content at it's actual difficulty, without netdecking a god-tier build and buying some op bis items from other players Or play harcore. You can actually cut down on time immensely if you're good and if you know what you're doing