Everyone Is Wrong

[Deleted]

Battle for Azeroth Launch:

• Mythic+ (10 dungeons)
• World Quests (6 WQ zones at cap)
• Artifact Necklace
• Scenarios (with scaling difficulty up to Mythic level)
• PVP Scenarios
• Global World PVP server flagging and World PVP sharding.
• War Fronts
• Raids
• Removal of Legendaries (The best announcement to date)
• Allied Race quests
• Zone scaling revamp.

Or - to remove duplicates, and things that are not part of BfA launch and to highlight the new features so we can separate the stuff that is carrying over from Legion and the "new features" stuff

Battle for Azeroth Launch:

• 10 dungeons
• World Quests (6 WQ zones at cap)
• Artifact Necklace (ok, so I was nice and put this down as a new feature, but really, just iteration of Legion system)
• Scenarios (and same here, old system, but I think there's enough new development to classify this as "new feature")
• Global World PVP server flagging and World PVP sharding.
• War Fronts
• Raid (just one)
• Allied Races

The feature list is kinda thin.. most of this is just filler fluff features... nothing that makes you super excited. On top of this, they seemed very scetchy about War Fronts, none of that stuff seemed to be ready at all.

But don't get me wrong - the core features like a new raid + 10 new dungeons would have been more than enough for me. I don't really care much about the rest - that's the core content we're all looking to run anyhow.

[WolfRider]

People are complaining about features that aren't fully developped yet.
People are saying that WoW is dead or Blizzard is joking.

You know what is really wrong in WoW?
Players

There was a new generation of players brought by Cataclysm, that changed the community and it slowly killed the game because these people couldn't stay in a guild and show patience in building a solid guild / raid core, so the endgame was just a way to please their little stinking ego.
It was "I pay a subscription, I only have 3 x 4 hours a week, I want to complete the endgame fast as possible and I'm skilled, so why would I stay in a guild where I have to carry other people?" and these players jumped from guild to guild, stopping game when they looted everything they wanted, until a new patch would be released.

These are WoW's cancer, not Blizzard's ideas.

Legion could have been the best MMO's content ever, if the majority of players wasn't playing the game like a stupid PS4 or Xbox game.

Battle For Azeroth development isn't done, we can only give our feedback on the story, what it brings and how/where it leads us.

And from my own feeling, I'm glad to see the Faction wars into the spotlight and how it unlocks other races.

[Makorus]

You mean the 20 Karazhan catacombs quests that were the exact same but you chased Worgen instead of Undead?

Oh yeah, god forbid.

There were only 30 Unique Quests then!

Doesn't really weaken the argument

[Trickname]

The majority MMO champ users are just blatant haters who decided the expansion sucked before it was even announced. No point trying to convince them otherwise. They'll still buy and play it no matter what they shit post on here.

[Myta]

Oh yeah, god forbid.

There were only 30 Unique Quests then!

Doesn't really weaken the argument

Naw, there were maybe 4-5 unique quests, the rest were basically the same 4 quests with small changes. Same with Mage Tower. The artifact quests weren't that great, sorry. And it was hardly content persay as you did it once ever, so most of the effort gone into making them were pointless very soon into the expansion.

The class order hall quest chains were good however.

[Makorus]

Naw, there were maybe 4-5 unique quests, the rest were basically the same 4 quests with small changes. Same with Mage Tower. The artifact quests weren't that great, sorry. And it was hardly content persay as you did it once ever, so most of the effort gone into making them were pointless very soon into the expansion.

The class order hall quest chains were good however.

Ok so why does that argument to dismiss Artifact quest work, but Island Scenarios are ALL TOTALLY UNIQUE according to you?

Ill agree that the Tyrs Tomb/Karazhan quests are literally the same thing, but the others? Yeah no.

[Myta]

Ok so why does that argument to dismiss Artifact quest work, but Island Scenarios are ALL TOTALLY UNIQUE according to you?

Ill agree that the Tyrs Tomb/Karazhan quests are literally the same thing, but the others? Yeah no.

Island Scenarios aren't a story, you're not following a human who in Darkshire who tells you the exact same thing every time, then you must do this one quest maybe every day for a year. The point with Islands is there are four of them, and they change each time you are there, from objectives to the setting and mood of the island. So the crafted experience is in the visuals, the procedural is in the unique experiences. We should be thinking if Blizzard is successful, than every time you queue it plays out differently. You may get Island with Spiders and webbed victims, but the objects will be different, and the NPCs will make it so that it never plays out the same way.

That is the danger we run into, the concept is good, it should be the execution we care about. Instead people are comparing it to artifact quests and Invasions which are always the same, and are never, ever different, it's silly.

[Makorus]

Island Scenarios aren't a story, you're not following a human who in Darkshire who tells you the exact same thing every time, then you must do this one quest maybe every day for a year. The point with Islands is there are four of them, and they change each time you are there, from objectives to the setting and mood of the island. So the crafted experience is in the visuals, the procedural is in the unique experiences. We should be thinking if Blizzard is successful, than every time you queue it plays out differently. You may get Island with Spiders and webbed victims, but the objects will be different, and the NPCs will make it so that it never plays out the same way.

That is the danger we run into, the concept is good, it should be the execution we care about. Instead people are comparing it to artifact quests and Invasions which are always the same, and are never, ever different, it's silly.

Except Invasions are different every single time my dude.

[Myta]

Except Invasions are different every single time my dude.

They aren't? You do the exact same thing every Invasion. In Stormheim you free the 3 drakes, then you ride them into a bombing run, then you fly to the ship, kill the demons, kill the boss. It is the exact same Invasion every single time you do it.

4 invasions, the exact same thing is done for each one every time. Even the WQs there's maybe two that are different at a time.

Islands will have 4 scenarios too, but every objective will be different, the visuals will be different, the enemies different, you are competing over objectives vs NPCs or Players. Every aspect of it adds variability.

[Makorus]

They aren't? You do the exact same thing every Invasion. In Stormheim you free the 3 drakes, then you ride them into a bombing run, then you fly to the ship, kill the demons, kill the boss. It is the exact same Invasion every single time you do it.

4 invasions, the exact same thing is done for each one every time. Even the WQs there's maybe two that are different at a time.

Islands will have 4 scenarios too, but every objective will be different, the visuals will be different, the enemies different, you are competing over objectives vs NPCs or Players. Every aspect of it adds variability.

I mean Invasion Points, mind you. They are randomized.

[Myta]

I mean Invasion Points, mind you. They are randomized.

Even those are the same, it's just random which one you'll get and which random zone effect you'll have like the roots in the forest zone. This isn't the same thing, you may go to the same island but it's a different day, with different enemies, different mood, different objectives and enemy NPCs or Players you are fighting for over resources.

[Deleted]

It looks so far away from being finished its scary, its nowhere near done

[Nyel]

Even those are the same, it's just random which one you'll get and which random zone effect you'll have like the roots in the forest zone. This isn't the same thing, you may go to the same island but it's a different day, with different enemies, different mood, different objectives and enemy NPCs or Players you are fighting for over resources.

And that's not different with Island Expeditions as I already told you. Instead of having 5 or 6 premade settings we've got 20 or 30 different factors that randomly generate your setting. Does it really make a difference if island 1 is inhabited by Hozen or Murlocs? It's still the same island and we are still going to do the same every time: gathering Azerite.

- - - Updated - - -

People are complaining about features that aren't fully developped yet.

That's the point though. They aren't developed at all. Most of the features are concepts. And not very good ones.

[Deleted]

The entire Blizzcon was "uhm, maybe", "yeah we are thinking about that", "we haven't decided that yet", "possibly we are going to do this", "it looks like it will be like this" etc.

that was my impression as well.. probably not many things are implemented yet

[Myta]

And that's not different with Island Expeditions as I already told you. Instead of having 5 or 6 premade settings we've got 20 or 30 different factors that randomly generate your setting. Does it really make a difference if island 1 is inhabited by Hozen or Murlocs? It's still the same island and we are still going to do the same every time: gathering Azerite.

Same enemies, same zone, same objective, oh there are meteors this time.

Not the same, I assume you did not watch the presentation, and are unaware of what features are talked about. I'm seriously concerned that you don't fully understand what islands are if you think Argus invasions are the same feature.

[rda]

Same enemies, same zone, same objective, oh there are meteors this time.

Not the same, I assume you did not watch the presentation, and are unaware of what features are talked about. I'm seriously concerned that you don't fully understand what islands are if you think Argus invasions are the same feature.

The randomness is limited and you will see the components it consists of after you do these islands ten or so times.

Did you play Diablo 3? Saw rifts? They are also "random instances with tons of combinations of scenery, mobs, etc". Yet somehow you play them for an hour or two and then you stop talking about the novelty, and after another couple of hours you are noticing similarities between the current rift and the previous rift, and some time after you just go numb to all this supposed randomness forever. That's what those islands are.

Several islands * several enemy types * several cave layouts * several global items / events * several mob strategies. Bam, twenty sixtillion combinations. Except you play the first ten and you feel like you've seen most of it.

[Nathasil]

The feature i lolled the hardest about was "Warfronts, deciding as a team which upgrades to build!". What that means for 70-80% of the players is:
- Play it in LFR matchmade mode
- Get yelled at, insulted and kicked if you DARE to put resources into a non-optimal upgrade

For the remaining 20-30% of players:
- The RL will decide what upgrades to build
- Disagree and you will be kicked

But we certainly cannot have guild halls because only the GM would have choices there, right?

Great Humor from Blizzard.

Oh, and "For the HOOOOAAAAAAARD!" by Sylvanas in the cinematic. That actually made me spill my drink. But that's not a feature, it's just a very late (or early?) April's fools.

[Dangg]

You mean the 20 Karazhan catacombs quests that were the exact same but you chased Worgen instead of Undead?

No I mean the class hall campaigns.

[Nyel]

Same enemies, same zone, same objective, oh there are meteors this time.

Not the same, I assume you did not watch the presentation, and are unaware of what features are talked about. I'm seriously concerned that you don't fully understand what islands are if you think Argus invasions are the same feature.

I am concerned that you did not understand what the nice developer explained to you. I already gave you an example. You've got 4 dices and you roll them. That's your island 1. You roll them again, island 2. You roll a third time, island 3. Each dice has a set amount of possible options attached to it.

I did not say they're the same, did I? They are similar. There are X types of different invasions or invasions points (all of them do have a set setting and layout). Islands do have a set amount (!) of settings and layouts but are different every time you do them. But that difference is limited because the options are limited.

[anaxie]

of course you can do """""more"""""" when you aren't overhauling 36 specs and desigining 36 weapon spec trees and 36 questlines

infact they are doing minimal class changes which isn't particularly a good thing considering the disaster that is Legion.