PvP Normalization is an RPG, and Game Design Failure

[Deleted]

Is this an RPG or isn't it?

Blizzard doesn't seem to be entirely sure.

GEAR SHOULD MATTER IN PVP

If you want to play chess, play chess - for everyone else, the players that work harder deserve better better gear, better stats, and increased power in PVP.

That doesn't mean make everything gear dependent - NO, there is such a thing as a balance, but if you want to motivate players to PLAY your game, you need to make it worthwhile to farm the gear.

IN NATURE, THE MAN THAT HAD THE MOST SKILL AQUIRED MORE FOOD AND GOT MORE POWERFUL, THE ALPHA MALE IS STRONGER BECAUSE OF THE FOOD (GEAR) THAT HE HAS BULKED WITH AS WELL AS HIS SKILLS.

Reflect reality in your game or see it die even more.

[Harry Botter]

Is this an RPG or isn't it?

Blizzard doesn't seem to be entirely sure.

If you want to play chess, play chess - for everyone else, the players that work harder deserve better better gear, better stats, and increased power in PVP.

That doesn't mean make everything gear dependent - NO, there is such a thing as a balance, but if you want to motivate players to PLAY your game, you need to make it worthwhile to farm the gear.

IN NATURE, THE MAN THAT HAD THE MOST SKILL AQUIRED MORE FOOD AND GOT MORE POWERFUL, THE ALPHA MALE IS STRONGER BECAUSE OF THE FOOD (GEAR) THAT HE HAS BULKED WITH AS WELL AS HIS SKILLS.

Reflect reality in your game or see it die even more.

Didn't you have enough of people bashing you in you're shitty WoW is socialist thread? Or are you just a glutton for shit posting?

If you want to play a good pvp game I suggest you play a game designed with pvp as a main focus and not a game where pvp has always been kind of a side project.

[Deleted]

Didn't you have enough of people bashing you in you're shitty WoW is socialist thread? Or are you just a glutton for shit posting?

If you want to play a good pvp game I suggest you play a game designed with pvp as a main focus and not a game where pvp has always been kind of a side project.

Reported for being rude and not addressing my arguments

[Malothere]

Its already like this in game, the best players already get the best rewards. the arena mounts and titles as well as that E-sports thing were you can win money. They have also been moving away from gear giving you so much of your power. It now gives less power overall the higher up you go. This just means the players with the best skill(Which is what should matter in PVP, not gear) rise to the top. Gear should never of been a factor in determining someones skill when fighting against someone else.

[Harry Botter]

Reported for being rude and not addressing my arguments

Report all you want but I perfectly addressed your post. Go play a game designed for pvp so you can show off your mighty e-peen to all the plebs.

[Deleted]

Its already like this in game, the best players already get the best rewards. the arena mounts and titles as well as that E-sports thing were you can win money. They have also been moving away from gear giving you so much of your power. It now gives less power overall the higher up you go. This just means the players with the best skill(Which is what should matter in PVP, not gear) rise to the top. Gear should never of been a factor in determining someones skill when fighting against someone else.

You clearly didn't read my post.

Gear should ALWAYS be a factor in fights - just like in nature how how well fed a lion or bear is decides if it will win combat against another bear.

Skill plays a role, but the bear that has more skill tends to have more food (gear) and weighs heavier anyway, so its important

Authenticity is important in driving player fun

[Soon-TM]

WoW has little of RPG left as it is, PvP templates are just one more nail in the coffin.

[Lochton]

Authenticity

We're in a realm, created by living elements, magic, war and corruption. Its world is as authentic as it can be, doesn't have to match with ours.

[Swalload]

Is this an RPG or isn't it?

Blizzard doesn't seem to be entirely sure.

If you want to play chess, play chess - for everyone else, the players that work harder deserve better better gear, better stats, and increased power in PVP.

That doesn't mean make everything gear dependent - NO, there is such a thing as a balance, but if you want to motivate players to PLAY your game, you need to make it worthwhile to farm the gear.

IN NATURE, THE MAN THAT HAD THE MOST SKILL AQUIRED MORE FOOD AND GOT MORE POWERFUL, THE ALPHA MALE IS STRONGER BECAUSE OF THE FOOD (GEAR) THAT HE HAS BULKED WITH AS WELL AS HIS SKILLS.

Reflect reality in your game or see it die even more.

You're really not seeing things the right way. Here is the right way you should see it, don't argue against it, learn from it and become a more intelligent person:

The game is in no way supposed to reflect the reality you are suggesting. The game is reflecting a reality of competition. In competitions, like hockey, football, MMA, whatever you name it, participants all have the same gear. The point of the competition is to see who is the best, not who has the best gear. In fact, PvP in any game should never have any gear difference at all to keep the aspect of competition to its purest form.
People become better, their character doesn't have to become better.

As for motivating players, the rewards can come in different forms because I understand that the game itself is not well made enough or entertaining enough to keep players PvPing just for the fun of it.

[Deleted]

You're really not seeing things the right way. Here is the right way you should see it, don't argue against it, learn from it and become a more intelligent person:

The game is in no way supposed to reflect the reality you are suggesting. The game is reflecting a reality of competition. In competitions, like hockey, football, MMA, whatever you name it, participants all have the same gear. t.

WRONGGGG

Players in sports weigh different amounts due to food, weight and strength - this is comparable to having gear in wow.

Next

[Lochton]

WRONGGGG

Players in sports weigh different amounts due to food, weight and strength - this is comparable to having gear in wow.

Next

Well, true but this ain't the real life, nor sports measuring for championship, now PvP is only built on 'skill'.

[MrCool]

Bring back WOD paradigm:
- Fairly small power difference between honor/conquest gear
- Hard cap on player power (ilvl ceiling in instanced PVP)
- Ability to customize secondary stats
- Templates removed. All balancing done by tweaking spells.

[Deleted]

Well, true but this ain't the real life, nor sports measuring for championship, now PvP is only built on 'skill'.

Yes and what a terrible decision that was - theres a very good reason all your dedicated pvpers quit wow

- - - Updated - - -

Bring back WOD paradigm:
- Fairly small power difference between honor/conquest gear
- Hard cap on player power (ilvl ceiling in instanced PVP)
- Ability to customize secondary stats
- Templates removed. All balancing done by tweaking spells.

WRONG

Bring back vanilla honor pvp hierachy system - the single best iteration of wow and the moment wow approached the pinnacle of mankinds immortal artworks

[Venziir]

Is this an RPG or isn't it?

Blizzard doesn't seem to be entirely sure.

GEAR SHOULD MATTER IN PVP

If you want to play chess, play chess - for everyone else, the players that work harder deserve better better gear, better stats, and increased power in PVP.

That doesn't mean make everything gear dependent - NO, there is such a thing as a balance, but if you want to motivate players to PLAY your game, you need to make it worthwhile to farm the gear.

IN NATURE, THE MAN THAT HAD THE MOST SKILL AQUIRED MORE FOOD AND GOT MORE POWERFUL, THE ALPHA MALE IS STRONGER BECAUSE OF THE FOOD (GEAR) THAT HE HAS BULKED WITH AS WELL AS HIS SKILLS.

Reflect reality in your game or see it die even more.

.... You clearly don't know what an RPG actually is, but then again, you didn't know what socialism was either.

[Lochton]

Yes and what a terrible decision that was - theres a very good reason all your dedicated pvpers quit wow

But they didn't all quit. Stop believing that because you think so, it is so. There's still a lot of PvP going on among the realms I am on at least. And no, it wasn't really overly bad, unless you are one of the few who complains that you can't overgear some poor rookie anymore.

[bshoults]

WRONGGGG

Players in sports weigh different amounts due to food, weight and strength - this is comparable to having gear in wow.

Next

Yeah, except in boxing and MMA they have weight classes. AKA, equal footing within the constraints of your weight. Put a heavy and a feather in the ring together, much less of the fight will be about skill and more about POWER (see what I did there?).

[Lochton]

Yeah, except in boxing and MMA they have weight classes. AKA, equal footing within the constraints of your weight. Put a heavy and a feather in the ring together, much less of the fight will be about skill and more about POWER (see what I did there?).

That is actually a good point.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

As a casual PvP'er it's been a little nicer to be able to join a randos and not just get slaughtered by gear. But everything so baseline kind of makes healers feel invincible.

[Lochton]

As a casual PvP'er it's been a little nicer to be able to join a randos and not just get slaughtered by gear. But everything so baseline kind of makes healers feel invincible.

I hear the same from many new players, they feel it is easier to get into.

[Swalload]

WRONGGGG

Players in sports weigh different amounts due to food, weight and strength - this is comparable to having gear in wow.

Next

No, that's the different stats of your class which is tied to game balancing, progress through gear only creates problem in competitions, it's a secondary aspect, like using different equipment in a sports competition.
So you are wrong. Why are people doing this? Arguing against facts, like what the fuck, just stop doing that and learn instead.