Dutch rape victim, 17, uses legal euthanasia to end life

[LiiLoSNK]

thats why the doctor also has to consider the likelihood if it getting better in the decision. which in this case wasn't deemed very stellar.

it's about minimizing suffering if you ask me. this girl has already suffered 6 years, and now she has to suffer another what? 8-13 years? before she is developed enough to be able to say she can cope or not?

where do you draw the line? when is there enough outlook to justify the suffering? when it is better to just stop the suffering? some people recover from stuff like this, some don't, it's all case by case.

i'm fine leaving that decision with a doctor. heck make it require 2 doctors to approve.

keep in mind these doctors have to administer the lethal drugs themselves, i don't think any of them would do that if they didn't believe it was the right thing.

Where do I draw the line? Peak brain development dude. If someone told me when I was a kid that I couldn't be a pokemon master I'd have tried to kill myself. How much would I have had to roll around and spit on people and cry and REEEEEEEEE before my mom was like, "aight kill this tard"???

If that ok for you? No it's not. This doctors decision was to kill a person. Many many many many many many many many other doctor's would've kept her alive, probably just for the money, but it could've given her time to get over it to the point where she didn't want to die.

Also just cause it's related to his own topic:

[Flurryfang]

this is where i think we can start to agree. i don't like the idea of forced anything. but i will go as far as heavily influencing someone by exhausting every option that I have at my expense. her want to die is equal to my want to see someone come out of their mental dungeon and live a happy life. i would feel compelled to try to stop her up until the very second the needle went in her arm.

BUT as far as her eating goes, after a week of not eating if you put a plate of her favorite food in front of her and walked away i bet she eats. that would take some serious mental fortitude to push the plate away.

There is a multitude of examples of people killing themselves by not eating, even though people have offered. I think her situation shows some sense of persistance, so im not sure your "favorite food" trick is gonna do much good.
Beside, it still does not solve the problem of her wanting to kill herself.

[zorkuus]

BUT as far as her eating goes, after a week of not eating if you put a plate of her favorite food in front of her and walked away i bet she eats. that would take some serious mental fortitude to push the plate away.

I don't know about that. She did try to commit suicide several times before. Sounds to me she had the mental fortitude to do something, rather than just throw out empty threats as a cry for help.

Okay so fuck the original article. The girl wasn't actually euthanized, but died as a result of refusing to eat or drink.

https://www.mtvuutiset.fi/artikkeli/...7050#gs.gyq2rv

The doctor's wouldn't euthanize her, but the parents and doctors agreed together that they won't force feed her, which lead to her death.

And there we go. Should've known better to not rely on foxnews.

[Rendark]

Man that sucks for everyone. Just have to hope her family can get back to a somewhat normal life.

[Vargulf the Happy Husky]

how many of these stupid decisions did you get locked up 6+ months for? how many of those did you repeat again afterwards?

well, my addiction to nicotine started around then. still dealing with that one. never got locked up, we never did anything super illegal.

[Flurryfang]

Where do I draw the line? Peak brain development dude. If someone told me when I was a kid that I couldn't be a pokemon master I'd have tried to kill myself. How much would I have had to roll around and spit on people and cry and REEEEEEEEE before my mom was like, "aight kill this tard"???

If that ok for you? No it's not. This doctors decision was to kill a person. Many many many many many many many many other doctor's would've kept her alive, probably just for the money, but it could've given her time to get over it to the point where she didn't want to die.

Also just cause it's related to his own topic:

So you believe that simply waiting would be the solution? To lock her up and wait for her suicidal thoughts to go away as we either drugged her up with pills or kept talking to her?

I think it is more likely that she will just lie that she is alright to get out of hospital and then kill herself in a violent way, than her actually getting better by keeping her alive against her will.

[LiiLoSNK]

Okay so fuck the original article. The girl wasn't actually euthanized, but died as a result of refusing to eat or drink.

https://www.mtvuutiset.fi/artikkeli/...7050#gs.gyq2rv

The doctor's wouldn't euthanize her, but the parents and doctors agreed together that they won't force feed her, which lead to her death.

This changes so much. I don't want to laugh at this girls death, but I do want to laugh at the amount of absolute idiots who were saying the doctors wanted to straight up kill her.

- - - Updated - - -

So you believe that simply waiting would be the solution? To lock her up and wait for her suicidal thoughts to go away as we either drugged her up with pills or kept talking to her?

I think it is more likely that she will just lie that she is alright to get out of hospital and then kill herself in a violent way, than her actually getting better by keeping her alive against her will.

Are you some sort of idiot? This logic is literally saying, "don't try to help anyone because they're just gonna lie! Don't put effort into someone's life if you care about them guys.".

[DSRilk]

Fact: no life is worth more than another. Not yours, not mine, not the rapists, not the 17 year old girl's have more "priority".

That is not a fact, it's your opinion (worth being defined by humans, and thus axiomatically opinion). It's also not one I share, for the record. A 17 year old girl who has led a typical life is worth more than an adult who attempts to rape people until you put him in jail. Obviously this is only my opinion, so take it for what you will. The important thing here is that you learn the difference between an opinion and a fact.

[Vargulf the Happy Husky]

There is a multitude of examples of people killing themselves by not eating, even though people have offered. I think her situation shows some sense of persistance, so im not sure your "favorite food" trick is gonna do much good.
Beside, it still does not solve the problem of her wanting to kill herself.

were those people actually suicidal or were they anorexics? like did they set out and say "i'm going to kill myself by not eating." (no sarcasm, im asking)

[Machismo]

no, 18 is not the age either. i already said i think it should be reserved for people in constant, untreatable physical pain. never for a mental issue. society needs to do better at helping people like her (i know that's beating an old drum but its the truth).

Luckily, you shouldn't be able to control other people's bodies and actions so much.

[Vargulf the Happy Husky]

Okay so fuck the original article. The girl wasn't actually euthanized, but died as a result of refusing to eat or drink.

https://www.mtvuutiset.fi/artikkeli/...7050#gs.gyq2rv

The doctor's wouldn't euthanize her, but the parents and doctors agreed together that they won't force feed her, which lead to her death.

disregard my last comment lol

[vindicatorx]

A strong kid making a tough choice most people wouldn't be able to make, even if it was the best option.

Expect shallow comments from a certain kind of people who will deride this because they can't grasp the entire story.

No offense but, that's not the tough choice, she took the easy way out. Yeah, I'm sure she was having trouble coping with something like that but the tough choice would be to get past it and in spite of it to persevere. Giving up means the rapist won in the end. You can ad hominem all you like by calling it a shallow way of thinking. But, life is hard in general. She was still a child and decided to give up on life. I mean it's her choice but, I do not respect it.

[Kumorii]

Again, it's not an argument. I said it's not right to let people with underdeveloped brains kill themselves and you've yet to prove me wrong.

Clear proof you don't even read my posts since I never made the opposite claim.

You feel like summarize what you think my point and/or what I'm arguing for? Really curious what your head Canon is.

[Vargulf the Happy Husky]

Luckily, you shouldn't be able to control other people's bodies and actions so much.

ayyy there he is! hows it going man?

[Machismo]

ayyy there he is! hows it going man?

Life's good. I'm just over here, not trying to control the freedoms of others... you know, a pretty standard Wednesday.

[vindicatorx]

Yeah now after reading more on the subject, she went through with not eating or drinking and died of that. She was not euthanized.

Well shit. I guess my comment nor the person I quoted matters after reading this.

[zorkuus]

No offense but, that's not the tough choice, she took the easy way out. Yeah, I'm sure she was having trouble coping with something like that but the tough choice would be to get past it and in spite of it to persevere. Giving up means the rapist won in the end. You can ad hominem all you like by calling it a shallow way of thinking. But, life is hard in general. She was still a child and decided to give up on life. I mean it's her choice but, I do not respect it.

This isn't a game, with winners and losers.

[Puri]

Again, it's not an argument. I said it's not right to let people with underdeveloped brains kill themselves and you've yet to prove me wrong.

You do realize that claiming "it's not right to let people with underdeveloped brains kill themselves" is an opinion and no argument or even fact, so there is no way to prove you wrong?

What we can discuss is the fact that you are claiming the brain of a 17 year old is underdevelopped. Because there are 17 year olds that wet their bed when they have a dentist apppointment the next day, and there are 17 year old that act as CEO of a multi million dollar company.

So how can we tell which is which? Quite easy, we make a case to case examination with several professionals to tell if the 17 year old is mature enough to make that decision. And that's what happened here, and as I've already said I tend to rather believe those professionals who could have stopped the whole process anytime they felt it was right over someone who is making hypothetical arguments on the internet without having any actual knowledge of the person or the situation they are in.

[Vargulf the Happy Husky]

Life's good. I'm just over here, not trying to control the freedoms of others... you know, a pretty standard Wednesday.

balance brotha, i'm like the anti-Machismo. or do you want to be the anti-Vargulf. i'll give you this one shot to choose or else i'll make the decision for you

[Flurryfang]

were those people actually suicidal or were they anorexics? like did they set out and say "i'm going to kill myself by not eating." (no sarcasm, im asking)

I think there is a big difference between those. Anorexics are not trying to kill themselves. I am talking about people, who saw not eating as the easiest way out of life and kept to it until the end.