Preach drops some unexpected and well-articulated truth bombs

[rohoz]

Because there is no choice? There are still BIS lists, it's just so riddled behind RNG you'll basically never get it unless you win the lotto. So you sim every little ilvl upgrade to see if it's worth it. Still ultimately no choice if you're chasing top performance.

Also, I don't ever recall a time where, once you got back to full clearing the highest difficulty you typically do, any current tier set wasn't utilized by everyone.
Would people upgrade from their mythic tier set from a previous tier with the LFR versions of a new tier? Not necessarily. But they would still switch from mythic versions between the two.

Also, you mean archaic.

You can attain everything at base itemlevel with zero additional rng.

You wore the tier set because you had no choice. Now you do.

[Kralljin]

It's their game too. It's time they stood up for it.

Good luck with that.

People who only engage with this game on a rather superficial level in terms of actual gameplay aren't going to give a shit about the most recent expansion, they have their niche, they play in it, that's it.

On top of that, if you aren't that engaged with the game, you're less likely to even make a push for it, as long as their niche remains, they're fine with it.
It's not like removing collectibles is something of a popular demand, as this is a supposedly popular thing among the casual audience.

I think this this part of the casual audience is rather simple to please, so what's the fuss about them?

Why would i design the game around an audience who (seemingly) doesn't even have high standards towards gameplay than other audiences?
You yourself said it, to you, BfA is an okay expansion, so why can't we have an expansion that also meets the demands of an audience that has a bit higher demands?
The more casual oriented audience is also seemingly fine with less than optimal expansion, so, there you go i guess.

That aside, games aren't democracies, the only way to get this type of WoW, is to get these people quit en masse, which they aren't, because by the standards set by you, BfA was still okay.
WoW now looks towards the players they've lost, not new audiences, saying these ranks are filled with people who aren't giving a crap about character progression (in relation to character power) would be a big statement.

As a matter of fact, the major point in this Video of Preach, which i fully agree, is in fact that said character progression is too random and too complicated for the sake of being it.
This just doesn't screw with hardcore players, but especially the casual audience who still cares about character progression, because Blizzard changes the rules each patch and adds new systems that require additional reading (because Blizzard NEVER properly explains things ingame) on third party website.

[KaiynGains1337]

SOrry, I am not going to bother watching what your hero puts out because he is doing nothing more than saying what you want to hear to get clicks on his video and money in his pocket. The fanboys aren't smart enough to realize that they are a means to and end for goofs like him. And that goes for all Youtube streamers.

Then you don't get an opinion here. Sorry, you need to know what is being talked about, to get an opinion on it, particularly if you want it taken seriously. I've seen no constructive argument from you, just claims that anything is said by streamers is for clicks. You sound more like a troll

[Fullmetal89]

Just got a chance to watch this video today. I agree with him 100%. The game needs to cut 90% of the system bloat. Sadly, I think Blizzard will double down at Blizzcon. They seem to be content just retaining a small number of people and feeding them cosmetics.

[Monoxide]

In addition, while people meme on CoD, clearly all that a game with good gameplay needs is a bunch of new areas and environments to experience that same gameplay loop in, and some updates to graphics/ui when it becomes necessary. Don't fix what ain't broken.

Shhh, get out of here with that logic. It would be inconvenient for people to have to consider that with regard to their beloved Blizzard.

I also hear CS:GO is a really bad game too. They should change it up.

[Kickbuttmario]

What he and you who blindly defend him continually fail to grasp is that you are not the only people who play the game. Ther aere peope that disagree with you and like things as is, or want changes that are different from the one you want.

Look man, idk if you even watched the video but he more or less just want things to be more simpler again. There are reasons why game has gone downhill for a while, so it has to be stated.

- - - Updated - - -

How I see it, isn't it great for preach that he does what he needs to do to get views? Even if WoW sub-numbers goes down, his sub-number goes up

I don't think Preach is silly, I have enjoyed his movies the last few years. After he said that classic is so good because it is so slow that you could see what each ability did to the target, but then just before made a video on how BfA is bad because gameplay is too slow(when its much faster and got more pace than in classic) he just lost all credibility to me.

Can you link the videos fren? If you can, I will change my mind too.

[Dakara]

Just got a chance to watch this video today. I agree with him 100%. The game needs to cut 90% of the system bloat. Sadly, I think Blizzard will double down at Blizzcon. They seem to be content just retaining a small number of people and feeding them cosmetics.

I've been saying it for a few expansions now. Less is more, the game is a bloated mess of mini-games and systems.

[schwank05]

then go play classic

I am, but I want eventual progression of the game. Unless they Release BC servers then Ill be happy to play that for the next 15 years.

[Otimus]

All I want is, as a casual, to feel like I have some form of meaningful progression again. I haven't had that since MoP. You outgear everything aimed at casuals before you're even able to do them as a casual, if you play even a little. Certain forms of content become too worthless too fast. LFR is basically not even worth running more than once (and people still complain about it! What world do they live in?) and heroic dungeons wear out their usefulness in like a matter of days. So... the game basically becomes nothing but world quests. Which is awful. Like, all the other problems people talk about are definitely problems too, but that's a pretty annoying problem too. I just don't see how anyone casual is really having much fun here, unless they really like leveling alts or only play like 1 hour a week or something.

As is, I think I'm basically done with WoW until there's a major course correction on how they design everything. (i.e. everything being pointless unless it's high end raiding or mythic+, and no one else having a progression path to speak of.)

Frankly, I just don't think MMORPGs are for me anymore. Maybe they never were? WoW was a fluke.

[Kickbuttmario]

What he and you who blindly defend him continually fail to grasp is that you are not the only people who play the game. Ther aere peope that disagree with you and like things as is, or want changes that are different from the one you want.

Don't be low iq. If people aren't enjoying the game, and the results are extremely evident, then something has to change. No matter who you are, I seriously doubt many like the systems bloat that are in the current games. This has been going on since WoD. Even for all the crap progression raiders get for liking Vanilla and TBC, the truth is we haven't had an actual TBC+ expansion ever. Wrath wasn't that, it was a different expansion that led to most of the issues we have today. You can say whatever you like but I like to think that many people liked those past games as shown by the recent success by classicwow.

Also you ignored how you were wrong about raidbots. I have doubts you even play in current game or care for your own dps performance.

[Doffen]

Can you link the videos fren? If you can, I will change my mind too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2C8lcUSQHjk&t

19.30+ you can see why its "fine" that classic got slow gameplay. I can't find the exact video about classes being slow in retail, but you know his overall idea about gameplay in BfA, let's take the GCD change for instance that made it slower. But then again that video is kind of old now. And in the video I linked here he has no issues with slow gcd or anything. I've heard some people arguing that slow gameplay in classic make sense, which is absurd because if you think slow gameplay is boring, then it would be boring in classic too.

[rohoz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2C8lcUSQHjk&t

19.30+ you can see why its "fine" that classic got slow gameplay. I can't find the exact video about classes being slow in retail, but you know his overall idea about gameplay in BfA, let's take the GCD change for instance that made it slower. But then again that video is kind of old now. And in the video I linked here he has no issues with slow gcd or anything. I've heard some people arguing that slow gameplay in classic make sense, which is absurd because if you think slow gameplay is boring, then it would be boring in classic too.

He's a hypocrite that says whatever it takes to get views. News at 10.

[Hinastorm]

Those points really make sense when applied to raid encounters.

Your typical raid encounter is a bloated abomination.

[Monoxide]

He's a hypocrite that says whatever it takes to get views. News at 10.

Still waiting for that retail video. Just gonna throw around insults or actually come with something meaningful?

[rohoz]

Still waiting for that retail video. Just gonna throw around insults or actually come with something meaningful?

You do realize you're talking to a different person, right? lmao

And, to be frank, if we're going by what he said in that video, the gcd change from legion to bfa would be a good thing, but he was caught up in the collective fauxrage when it was announced.
Every single wow content creator is a troll/hypocrite that does whatever it takes to get their views. But hey, it's their livelyhood so it's whatever.

[Otimus]

This sums up my feelings as well. I'm not into raiding or mythic+ so the game has pretty much become just world quests and the occasional warfront. I miss when it was worth running heroic dungeons (not that BfA dungeons are really any good IMO). I miss working through the questlines of the legendary cloak, or unlocking Isle of Thunder bit by bit and finding new and fun things to do in the new areas.

MoP was the last time I really loved the game. Legion was pretty decent as well.

I agree. The thing with Legion is that, while it has all the same problems, Legion at least had good content in it to go through (There was a lot of story stuffed into all sorts of things, it was full to the brim with content)

[rohoz]

This sums up my feelings as well. I'm not into raiding or mythic+ so the game has pretty much become just world quests and the occasional warfront. I miss when it was worth running heroic dungeons (not that BfA dungeons are really any good IMO). I miss working through the questlines of the legendary cloak, or unlocking Isle of Thunder bit by bit and finding new and fun things to do in the new areas.

MoP was the last time I really loved the game. Legion was pretty decent as well.

The last time a heroic was worth running was before SoO, and that was because welfare badges were tied to it.
BFA has more open world content than legion. Legion *did* have mage tower, though.

[MoanaLisa]

Look man, idk if you even watched the video but he more or less just want things to be more simpler again.

I've made a lot of posts this year about how the game is over-engineered. It's theory-crafting, spreadsheets and russian doll systems carried too far. There have been rumors that the next expansion may be a good entry point for new players so if true, I'm prepared for simpler to be equal to "dumbing down" and everyone else should be too. I think it's needed though.

[Kickbuttmario]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2C8lcUSQHjk&t

19.30+ you can see why its "fine" that classic got slow gameplay. I can't find the exact video about classes being slow in retail, but you know his overall idea about gameplay in BfA, let's take the GCD change for instance that made it slower. But then again that video is kind of old now. And in the video I linked here he has no issues with slow gcd or anything. I've heard some people arguing that slow gameplay in classic make sense, which is absurd because if you think slow gameplay is boring, then it would be boring in classic too.

Apologies, I thought you said he (Preach) said BFA combat was too slow which made no sense.

Okay, so the reasoning as to why classic combat being slow isn't something I can articulate well enough, but just know that it makes "sense" in how the RPG works as everything else in the game is slow. BFA combat is fast but for all of the wrong reasons and that's because you can't control on how it even goes fast. It just is. Like how leveling is fast, like how raiding is fast yet not really if you're mythic, yet how gearing is fast, and of course, the rush of getting gear isn't paying off like it is in the past since everything is fast.

The combat in retail just cannot be understood and the fact that it could be understood throughout Vanilla and TBC was what made it good. You could feel your "numbers" going up. All you see in retail is your dps going up, but the numbers are kinda all over the place as due its course.

- - - Updated - - -

I've made a lot of posts this year about how the game is over-engineered. It's theory-crafting, spreadsheets and russian doll systems carried too far. There have been rumors that the next expansion may be a good entry point for new players so if true, I'm prepared for simpler to be equal to "dumbing down" and everyone else should be too. I think it's needed though.

The pessimist in me thinks that Blizzard will just fuck it up somehow. They always do this. They're just too slow.

[rohoz]

Apologies, I thought you said he (Preach) said BFA combat was too slow which made no sense.

Okay, so the reasoning as to why classic combat being slow isn't something I can articulate well enough, but just know that it makes "sense" in how the RPG works as everything else in the game is slow. BFA combat is fast but for all of the wrong reasons and that's because you can't control on how it even goes fast. It just is. Like how leveling is fast, like how raiding is fast yet not really if you're mythic, yet how gearing is fast, and of course, the rush of getting gear isn't paying off like it is in the past since everything is fast.

The combat in retail just cannot be understood and the fact that it could be understood throughout Vanilla and TBC was what made it good. You could feel your "numbers" going up. All you see in retail is your dps going up, but the numbers are kinda all over the place as due its course.

- - - Updated - - -



The pessimist in me thinks that Blizzard will just fuck it up somehow. They always do this. They're just too slow.

lol what
Are you saying that going from 10k to 20k hits isn't noticeable, and you need an addon to tell you that? lmao