Ny'alotha, The Waking City World First Race

[Azolluh]

difference is one is a misdemeanor one is a felony. or one is a slap on the wrist one is jail-time.

I wouldnt even classify what limit did as a mouse more like 50 cent bubble gum stealing since DH's do that daily in M+ and MDI

But some of them are not are under US jurisdiction. So you can slash the misdemeanor and felony thing. Costco's have different managers who will decide if they call the police or not for shoplifting that 50 cent bubble gum, 4 dollar chocolate, or $138 mouse. Are you the police officer, judge, or juror who decides what the conviction will be? Maybe they're having a bad day and decide to arrest you for the 50penny gum. I don't think you would see shit like that happen around the majority of Europe...or even Asia.

How do you know the strict conviction will be per charge? You don't!

[Xath]

People actually root for certain guilds?

Would be nice to see NA win a tier but more importantly it's good for the race's viability for Method to lose a major tier Crucible was not a major tier.

[Addict]

I haven't seen Invective on the rankings this teir, still waiting for them to just swoop in and dominate the race.

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People actually root for certain guilds?

Got friends in some guilds from way back that are still playing, rooting more for them than the guilds.

Go Revvez! \o/

[js3915]

Would be nice to see NA win a tier but more importantly it's good for the race's viability for Method to lose a major tier Crucible was not a major tier.

This i can agree with... There will be less interest over time if only 1 team wins

[Onikaroshi]

Even if Limit finish 1st and Method 2nd, Paragon & Ensidia(Nihilum) are better guilds than Limit lol.

Nihilum/Ensidia doesn't even deserve to be mentioned next to Paragon IMO, they dominated ONE expansion and the fights in that expansion were arguably easier than any expansion to come.

Really the reigns of wow raid rest solely on the shoulders of Method and Paragon.

[Dracian]

Nihilum/Ensidia doesn't even deserve to be mentioned next to Paragon IMO, they dominated ONE expansion and the fights in that expansion were arguably easier than any expansion to come.

Really the reigns of wow raid rest solely on the shoulders of Method and Paragon.

Nihilum/Ensidia dominated from C'thun through Wrath. Their world first end boss kills included: C'thun, Kel'thuzad, Gruul, Magtheridon, Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Illidan, Kel'thuzad (again), Sartharion, Malygos, Algalon. If you count SK (since they became part of Ensidia), you can add in Kil'jaeden. I definitely feel they should be mentioned alongside Paragon.

The raiding today is definitely more demanding, but for their time Nihilum/Ensidia was extremely dominant for several years.

[Stormbreed]

Cheated on stream?

When/how?

The RaDen encounter was bugged and they could pull-reset-pull-reset then Pull so their stacked group of warlocks had huge damage buffs, all bosses take 30 seconds to reset, on purpose, however on the PTR bosses reset faster....

Blatant as fuck cheating. Ban the fucking cheaters,

[Onikaroshi]

Nihilum/Ensidia dominated from C'thun through Wrath. They're world first end boss kills included: C'thun, Kel'thuzad, Gruul, Magtheridon, Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Illidan, Kel'thuzad (again), Sartharion, Malygos, Algalon. If you count SK (since they became part of Ensidia), you can add in Kil'jaeden. I definitely feel they should be mentioned alongside Paragon.

The raiding today is definitely more demanding, but for their time Nihilum/Ensidia was extremely dominant for several years.

they have a place in history, but not amongst the greats imo, they killed a bunch of much easier bosses and had fallen off by mid wrath when paragon took over, only one of the wrath kills really even counted for anything (Alagon) because we know how big of a joke Naxx in wrath was.

[Dracian]

they have a place in history, but not amongst the greats imo, they killed a bunch of much easier bosses and had fallen off by mid wrath when paragon took over, only one of the wrath kills really even counted for anything (Alagon) because we know how big of a joke Naxx in wrath was.

That's like arguing that the 1991-1998 Chicago Bulls aren't as important as the top current teams because the players today are far more athletic. Of course the players today are, but that doesn't change the fact that most people agree that the 90's Bulls were one of the best teams of all time. Across almost all sports, there are older dynasties that are still considered all-time greats. It's no different here, in my opinion.

[Onikaroshi]

That's like arguing that the 1991-1998 Chicago Bulls aren't as important as the top current teams because the players today are far more athletic. Of course the players today are, but that doesn't change the fact that most people agree that the 90's Bulls were one of the best teams of all time. Across almost all sports, there are older dynasties that are still considered all-time greats. It's no different here, in my opinion.

Doubt sports have changed as drastically as WoW raid fights.

[Xath]

Nihilum/Ensidia dominated from C'thun through Wrath. Their world first end boss kills included: C'thun, Kel'thuzad, Gruul, Magtheridon, Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Illidan, Kel'thuzad (again), Sartharion, Malygos, Algalon. If you count SK (since they became part of Ensidia), you can add in Kil'jaeden. I definitely feel they should be mentioned alongside Paragon.

The raiding today is definitely more demanding, but for their time Nihilum/Ensidia was extremely dominant for several years.

Nihilum only got Cthun and KT first because the hotfixes were pushed to EU first. SK wrecked them in sunwell. Their period of dominance that wasn't just due to hotfixes was BC from the start through BT. Even then there was some shady shit with the bugged Lady V kill. Ensidia was basically nothing they got the first tier that was a complete joke in Wrath then lost to Stars in Uld then Paragon took over who were the first truly dominant guild. If it wasn't for hotfix timings Nihilum would have been remembered as the class of BC and DnT as the class of vanilla.

[Onikaroshi]

Nihilum only got Cthun and KT first because the hotfixes were pushed to EU first. SK wrecked them in sunwell. Their period of dominance that wasn't just due to hotfixes was BC from the start through BT. Even then there was some shady shit with the bugged Lady V kill.

And lets not forget getting suspended for bugging out NORMAL LK 25

[facefist]

Nihilum/Ensidia dominated from C'thun through Wrath. They're world first end boss kills included: C'thun, Kel'thuzad, Gruul, Magtheridon, Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Illidan, Kel'thuzad (again), Sartharion, Malygos, Algalon. If you count SK (since they became part of Ensidia), you can add in Kil'jaeden. I definitely feel they should be mentioned alongside Paragon.

The raiding today is definitely more demanding, but for their time Nihilum/Ensidia was extremely dominant for several years.

It's hard to say which guild is the best of all time. I would put it in this way:

Most dominant guild ever: Paragon by far, and not a single guild has come close to the domination they did during their time. The real race was for #2, because everyone expected Paragon to win by a decent margin anyway. Their reign was quite short though, which is understandable when you recruit only from a country with only 5 million inhabitants.

Most consistent top contender: Well obviously Method, they just haven't had real competition for a few expansion until now. They never were dominant though.

Pioneers of raiding: Well I guess this goes to Nihilum/Ensidia for dominating the early expansions, even though the competition wasn't that heavy back then. Paragon should probably be mentioned here too as they were the first to take it to the extreme level that it is currently at (split raids, 16h/day raiding etc.)

Limit is dominating Method so hard right now. At this rate it's safe to say Limit won this expac because this is the last tier.
If Method kill's N'zoth day after Limit Method will still be overall best guild of WoW's history.

Too obvious troll. As if Limit would even be in top 5 of all time if they won this tier. Then again, they look strong and if they dominate next expansion then they could be right there behind Method, Paragon and Ensidia/Nihilum.

[Dracian]

Doubt sports have changed as drastically as WoW raid fights.

American Football players used to wear leather helmets and smoked cigarettes on the sidelines. Times change. Games get tougher. That doesn't discount past accomplishments.

At the end of the day Nihilum/Ensidia has 12 World First kills on end bosses. Paragon had 7. They're second only to Method at this point. To this day Kungen is still mentioned and brought up during almost every world first race. That's pretty important in the history of WoW raiding.

[Mightytasty]

Nihilum/Ensidia dominated from C'thun through Wrath. Their world first end boss kills included: C'thun, Kel'thuzad, Gruul, Magtheridon, Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Illidan, Kel'thuzad (again), Sartharion, Malygos, Algalon. If you count SK (since they became part of Ensidia), you can add in Kil'jaeden. I definitely feel they should be mentioned alongside Paragon.

The raiding today is definitely more demanding, but for their time Nihilum/Ensidia was extremely dominant for several years.

Paragon is the best guild in WoW history and it’s not close. A guild only made up of players from a country with 5 million people dominated every US and EU sponsored super-guild for nearly 4 expansions.

[Onikaroshi]

At the end of the day Nihilum/Ensidia has 12 World First kills on end bosses. Paragon had 7.

That REALLY depends on how you count bosses, do you really count a 1 boss raided that wasn't intended to be as hard as a 5-10 boss raids end boss? If we go by actual raids N/E has 6, 7 if you count the joke that was Wrath naxx

To this day Kungen is still mentioned and brought up during almost every world first race. That's pretty important in the history of WoW raiding.

And almost never in a good way...

[Dracian]

Paragon is the best guild in WoW history and it’s not close. A guild only made up of players from a country with 5 million people dominated every US and EU sponsored super-guild for nearly 4 expansions.

4 Expansions? I mean they raided and were active, but they weren't dominant. They were dominant at the very end of Wrath and through Cata. Then it became the Method show.

They had 2 WF end bosses in Wrath, 4 in Cata, 0 in Mists, and 1 in WoD. They were very good, but nowhere near what I would call dominant.

[facefist]

That REALLY depends on how you count bosses, do you really count a 1 boss raided that wasn't intended to be as hard as a 5-10 boss raids end boss? If we go by actual raids N/E has 6, 7 if you count the joke that was Wrath naxx



And almost never in a good way...

Yeah Kungen is not much more than a joke now. He caused it himself though, claiming in every single stream how hard vanilla and tbc were and how modern guilds would not be able to compete there, because they were so hard. And how everything is just easy grind now and that's why he doesn't make a comeback and dominate again. Except when he tried to, and they ended up sucking hard so he quit (with excuses ofc.)

[Onikaroshi]

Yeah Kungen is not much more than a joke now. He caused it himself though, claiming in every single stream how hard vanilla and tbc were and how modern guilds would not be able to compete there, because they were so hard. And how everything is just easy grind now and that's why he doesn't make a comeback and dominate again. Except when he tried to, and they ended up sucking hard so he quit (with excuses ofc.)

He really did, he always talked big and was not able to back up it up lol.....

If you're going to rag on retail at least pick something true, and not that the raids are easier than TBC

[jsz]

obviously the streaming by every guild is great to see but part of me misses the mystique and mystery of the old races. a leaked screenshot of damage meters or a low wipe could fuel speculation and shitposting for days