Are DHs overrated in m+?

[melzas]

Rigth now it seems the meta for melee dps is rogue, dh or gtfo.

I ubderstand why rogues are favoured, but what's so special about DHs (talking dps spex here)? Their dps seems to be on par with pretty much all melee, they have aoe stun, but so do enh and ww. Feral and DKs bring combat ress, rets can offheal pretty good. Enh has better interrupts and can purge without cd.

It's not a rant, I'm just trying to genuinely understand why DHs are conaider better picks for melee spots than everyone else (except rogues).

[Gaidax]

I'd imagine 5% magic debuff for one, which is irreplaceable.

[js3915]

They are quite mobile as well
I havent played Windwalker in awhile i dont know what their burst is like, DH seems like a quick burst versus having a rampup

[Tyrilion]

Dh burst is pretty powerful and tbh they are defo higher on dps than a feral or enhc especially when it comes to aoe, cooldowns are very short, its a very easy spec so hard to find a terrible DH. And ofc the 5% buff to magic dmg is non existent anywhere else

[Teaon]

Dh burst is pretty powerful and tbh they are defo higher on dps than a feral or enhc especially when it comes to aoe, cooldowns are very short, its a very easy spec so hard to find a terrible DH. And ofc the 5% buff to magic dmg is non existent anywhere else

you forgot they are hard to die.

[Tojara]

Who needs magic damage when you can just take three rogues?

All jokes aside DH is still solid in M+.

[Donimic]

Rogues = Gods of M+ we know this, lets move on.

The problem with your analysis is that you are comparing their utility and damage to independent specs but not both at the same time. The reason why DH is so sought after is because thy do everything extremely well, only behind rogues. Everyone else does something good, but also has extreme shortcomings in another component. You also have to remember that compared to other specs, their talent/azerite builds allow them to do AoE and single target damage without sacrificing too heavily for the others.

Is is particular to the examples you pointed out.

Enhance have good utility but shit damage, particularly AoE
Feral and DK have brez but so does the healer and their damage has a high ramp and forces their groups to play around their cooldowns.
Warrior has god-tier damage but poor disruptive utility
Ret is actually underrated when used to their full potential imo but generally lacks single target damage if talented for M+

Monks are actually considered about equal to DH and have VERY similar utility outside of the +5% damage to the prot-war/rogues in their group and RoP is awesome in S3. I think most people pushing high keys place them and DH as fairly interchangeable, and they will outtake DH in things like MDI where damage scaling is more important than defensive utility.

[Tyrilion]

you forgot they are hard to die.

True the self healing during grievous is a life saver

[Mardux]

True the self healing during grievous is a life saver

Is that with the meta talent that gives a miniscule amount of leech? Cuz without that, I haven't notice much in the way of self healing in m+ aside from dropping Nova on a pack (but that's mostly for the eyebeam cdr). We have bombass defensives though.

[Tyrilion]

Is that with the meta talent that gives a miniscule amount of leech? Cuz without that, I haven't notice much in the way of self healing in m+ aside from dropping Nova on a pack (but that's mostly for the eyebeam cdr). We have bombass defensives though.

It is by no means a small amount, the talent gives an extra 10% in meta on top of the standard 20% from the ability and a static 10% in normal form so your sitting on 40% leech. So eye beam a 4 mob pack and your at 100% in seconds.

Unless im interpreting it wrong but i feel like a god meta in M+

[Dizzeeyooo]

It is by no means a small amount, the talent gives an extra 10% in meta on top of the standard 20% from the ability and a static 10% in normal form so your sitting on 40% leech.

Almost - Meta gives 30% leech baseline, and the talent gives a flat 10% leech inside or outside of meta.

[Puri]

Dhs have good overall damage, excelling burst aoe, high self sufficiency over leech, good survival skills (practically without any real CD if you can time it right and meta which allows them even to tank bosses for a while in high m+), has soft CC and ranged imprisonment puts the enemy completely out, meaning you can even run through the CC'd mob without aggroing it. They have a ranged interrupt, they offer a unique magic damage debuff and can remove buffs from enemies.

They simply have everything you want for m+.

[Mardux]

Almost - Meta gives 30% leech baseline, and the talent gives a flat 10% leech inside or outside of meta.

Meta only gives 20% baseline.

And did they change the soul rending-demonic interaction? You used to not gain the leech from it until after eyebeam finished channeling and I haven't noticed a difference in the last year or so.

[Dizzeeyooo]

Meta only gives 20% baseline.

Wow, and so it does - you learn something every day x)

And did they change the soul rending-demonic interaction? You used to not gain the leech from it until after eyebeam finished channeling and I haven't noticed a difference in the last year or so.

No idea when they changed it, but you do seem to get all 20% of the talent leech now instantly after starting eyebeam.

[Laqweeta]

Rigth now it seems the meta for melee dps is rogue, dh or gtfo.

I ubderstand

:/ hellllllllllllp

[MechaCThun]

I wouldn't say overrated.


The issue isn't a misconception that DH do very well in M+ when in reality they do not.


I would say, if there is any issue, is that M+ groups are too focused on always having a DH in their group. Sure the 5% magic debuff is very good.


Also DH excel at burst and sustained AoE (with right talents + Essence set-up) and a lot of keystone affixes require decent AoE damage. It certainly doesn't harm groups not having a DH, but it certainly helps to have one.

[Playintrafic]

You can't be overrated if you actually do well.

A good DH can pull for the tank, cc, purge, cheese with immunity, all while having some baseline self heals amazing AOE, Amazing cleave, and good ST along with a strong DPS CD. Plus the 5% damage buff to magic is soo good.

[Samuraijake]

5% baby... self heals like a warlock.. have taunt with 50% dodge....

[Mardux]

You can't be overrated if you actually do well.

A good DH can pull for the tank, cc, purge, cheese with immunity, all while having some baseline self heals amazing AOE, Amazing cleave, and good ST along with a strong DPS CD. Plus the 5% damage buff to magic is soo good.

So nearly all things that can be done by other classes except the 5% magic debuff? Except most of classes get that "amazing aoe" for longer than 3 seconds (eyebeam channel time).

[Faesroll]

They require minimal effort to play effectively
Have a strong group CD with darkness
Can cheese mechanics with blade dance
Insane survivability with ridiculous self healing and a strong defensive on a short CD
High burst, decent sustain, both on AoE and ST
AoE stun
Single target stun
Imprison