Senate Intelligence Committee Rport Details Russian Interference and Collussion

[Machismo]

Come on man, get yourself a t-shirt.

Nobody said anything about free t-shirts!!!!

That changes everything. Heil Trump!!!

[Breccia]

Please cite

For someone who's failed every single 24-hour challenge I've ever given, you sure seem adamant about asking for evidence you've already seen. You know there's one ongoing right now, right? Why don't you take a swing at that one before you even pretend to have the ethical high ground?

On topic: I think the real takeaway, oddly enough, isn't Roger Stone working, at Trump's request, directly with WikiLeaks, a thief working for Putin. Nor is it the "Manafort worked directly with an actual Russian spy" bit. Even the "Trump followed Russia's instructions to say it was Ukraine who attacked the election" condemnation isn't really the biggest part, although it's clearly big enough. Nor is it the "Manafort was deemed a Ukranian agent, meaning Trump admitted working with an agent from the country he claims attacked the election" but that part's fucking hilarious. No, it's the Trump Tower meeting. Everyone here, even those people who will pretend otherwise, knew that Team Trump intentionally met with people they thought worked with the Russian government, and it turns out, they did. So their excuse, "oh it was just some lobbyist talking about adoptions" is now retroactively dismissed.

By the Republican Party.

[DocSavageFan]

For someone who's failed every single 24-hour challenge I've ever given, you sure seem adamant about asking for evidence you've already seen. You know there's one ongoing right now, right? Why don't you take a swing at that one before you even pretend to have the ethical high ground?

On topic: I think the real takeaway, oddly enough, isn't Roger Stone working, at Trump's request, directly with WikiLeaks, a thief working for Putin. Nor is it the "Manafort worked directly with an actual Russian spy" bit. Even the "Trump followed Russia's instructions to say it was Ukraine who attacked the election" condemnation isn't really the biggest part, although it's clearly big enough. Nor is it the "Manafort was deemed a Ukranian agent, meaning Trump admitted working with an agent from the country he claims attacked the election" but that part's fucking hilarious. No, it's the Trump Tower meeting. Everyone here, even those people who will pretend otherwise, knew that Team Trump intentionally met with people they thought worked with the Russian government, and it turns out, they did. So their excuse, "oh it was just some lobbyist talking about adoptions" is now retroactively dismissed.

By the Republican Party.

Here's a chance for you to lead by example. Please cite that portion of the report that factually proves your conspiracy theory that "Trump was either a Russian asset or lobbying to become one". You have 24 hours.

[cubby]

Here's a chance for you to lead by example. Please cite that portion of the report that factually proves your conspiracy theory that "Trump was either a Russian asset or lobbying to become one". You have 24 hours.

I love how fast and far you've punted on this issue - the Army Corp of Engineers couldn't keep up with how quickly you move the goal posts.

The GOP has now told you that Trump and his campaign worked directly with Russia to subvert and influence the 2016 election. That is now a FACT. And you're still just playing your silly little games.

You and you ilk have denied for years that this was true - pushing your conspiracy theories, etc. And now that this basic tenet has been established, as FACT, you can't come to grips with the idea that your dear leader is essentially a russian stooge.

But please, go on with your uninformed and ridiculous notions - they are both adorable and good practice for the adult conversations.

[Felya]

Nobody said anything about free t-shirts!!!!

That changes everything. Heil Trump!!!

If it’s any consolation, they were portrayed as an example of “American idiots” by Russian media.

[Adam Jensen]

I thought conspiracy theories were taboo on this forum. Oh, I forgot...this particular conspiracy theory is the darling of deluded liberals...so it must be OK.

It's not a conspiracy when facts and evidence are on your side.

[Felya]

Here's a chance for you to lead by example. Please cite that portion of the report that factually proves your conspiracy theory that "Trump was either a Russian asset or lobbying to become one". You have 24 hours.

The Biggest Trump Financial Mystery? Where He Came Up With the Cash for His Scottish Resorts.
https://www.motherjones.com/politics...ttish-resorts/

Such was also the case for Turnberry, the historic golf resort, an hour south of Glasgow, that Trump purchased in 2014 for $60 million. His large expenditures in Scotland were notable because they came during a rocky financial stretch for Trump. The year before purchasing the Aberdeenshire estate, he was ousted as CEO of his thrice-bankrupted casino business; in 2008, he defaulted on a large Deutsche Bank loan tied to a development in Chicago.

When Donald Trump brought Miss Universe to Moscow
https://www.politico.com/story/2016/...niverse-223173

“I know Russia well,” Trump told Fox News on May 6. “I had a major event in Russia two or three years ago, which was a big, big incredible event.” Asked whether he had met with Putin there, Trump declined to say, though he added: “I got to meet a lot of people.”

“And you know what?” he continued. “They want to be friendly with the United States. Wouldn’t it be nice if we actually got along with somebody?”

At the heart of the episode is Trump’s relationship with Aras Agalarov, a billionaire Russian real estate mogul with ties to Putin, and Agalarov’s rakish son, Emin, 36, a dance-pop singer with ambitions to international stardom who got Trump to appear in one of his music videos.

The father and son are two of several ultra-wealthy Russians to whom Trump is connected and with whom he has pursued real estate deals. “I have always been interested in building in Russia,” he told the New York Post just after his return from Moscow. He also boasted upon his return from the pageant that “almost all of the oligarchs were in the room.”

Soon after meeting Trump, the Agalarovs persuaded him to bring the 2013 pageant to one of their marquee properties: Crocus City Hall, a 7,500-seat concert hall they had opened four years earlier. “We just had a meeting … we all seemed to like each other, shook hands and signed our contract within a week’s time,” Emin said in his Forbes interview, adding that the pageant would cost $20 million to host.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aras_Agalarov

Emin said that after Trump won the United States presidential election in 2016, Trump sent them a handwritten note, saying he does not forget his friends.

While in Moscow, Phil Ruffin, who is a partner in Trump International Hotel Las Vegas, and Trump met with the Agalarov and his son at the Ritz-Carlton. Trump then appeared in a music video with Agalarov's son alongside many of the contestants. Trump and Agalarov planned on a $3 billion project, with state-owned Sberbank agreeing to provide 70% of the financing.

Agalarov has served as a liaison between Trump and Putin. According to an interview, they once discussed the construction of a Trump Tower in Russia. Agalarov had also reportedly tried to set up a meeting between the two, but this was canceled due to Putin having to meet the Dutch royal couple at the time. Putin instead sent Trump a fedoskino miniature.

I believe that covers both of your questions... So... where did Trump get the money?

[cubby]

It's not a conspiracy when facts and evidence are on your side.

If lil Doc'y doesn't see his echo chamber confirmed, he assumes conspiracy theory. The problem with swallowing what our Dear Leader tells them to think is that at some point Trump's insanity breaks down - he lies with every breath he takes, and is essentially a used car salesman.

The facts on this issue have been crystal clear for years, already confirmed by The Mueller Report.

[Levelfive]

It's not a conspiracy when facts and evidence are on your side.

I think it's just been so long since Trump supporters dealt in any of that that they don't even recognize it anymore, like some kind of Westworld "doesn't look like anything to me" experience.

[Breccia]

Here's a chance for you

@cubby is right. This is deflection. You have no standing to make challenges when you didn't even read the thread you're posting in. Or, the post you responded to, and even quoted.

Wake me when there's a legitimate challenge, not a 0-20 failure who thinks he can take the belt.

- - - Updated - - -

John Negroponte, DNI and UN ambassador to President Bush, endorses Joe Biden.

All roads lead to Trump in a way. I’m just not sure the country can withstand another four years of the presidency with a man who has shown such disregard to the office.

The real issue for Americans is whether Biden has the character, compassion and life experience needed to represent the United States as president and the requisite respect for the office to which he aspires. He beats Mr. Trump on these attributes hands down.

[DocSavageFan]

@cubby is right. This is deflection. You have no standing to make challenges when you didn't even read the thread you're posting in. Or, the post you responded to, and even quoted.

Wake me when there's a legitimate challenge, not a 0-20 failure who thinks he can take the belt.

So let me get this straight...you believe that I'm the one who's deflecting (and have no standing in this thread to make challenges) when I merely ask you to back up your stupid conspiracy theory with facts. Unbelievable.

You're the one who specially stated that "Trump was either a Russian asset or lobbying to become one" even though there was NOTHING in the intelligence report which indicates that this statement is true. All I did was ask you to back up your statement. And if anyone is deflecting...it's you.

Bottom line, your horseshit conspiracy theory that Trump was a Russian asset (or aspired to be one) is irrational self-delusion with ZERO basis in fact.

Wake up.

[Breccia]

I have to say, I really like The Atlantic's take on this.

While Mueller received all the hype, the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence kept its head down. Yesterday, having avoided cable speculation almost entirely, the SSCI released the fifth and final volume of a report on Russia’s attempt to sway the last election in Donald Trump’s favor. It finally delivered what Mueller either could not or would not: a comprehensive presentation of the evidence in the matter of “collusion.” The report confirms that Russiagate is no hoax. Whether or not the Trump campaign illegally coordinated with the Kremlin, Trump has no grounds for proclaiming vindication, much less that he’s the victim of a witch hunt.

Credit largely goes to Mark Warner, the ranking Democrat on the SSCI, who shrewdly orchestrated the proceedings. Cultivating a close relationship with the SSCI’s Republican chair, Richard Burr, he worked to keep the investigation deliberately low-key. (The committee did the bulk of its work behind closed doors, without leaks.) As a result, the committee on the whole miraculously avoided the politicization that tainted the broader debate over Russian interference. Each of its findings won bipartisan approval prior to publication. Instead of rushing forward, the committee left the incendiary question of collusion for last.

The thousand-page fifth volume doesn’t definitively settle the question, in part because the SSCI was unable to procure a full record of events. The White House engaged in gamesmanship, invoking executive privilege to deny witnesses and block access to a paper trail. A slew of important witnesses invoked the Fifth Amendment. Others, such as Paul Manafort, lied relentlessly to investigators. The election of 2016 is one of the most closely studied events of recent memory, yet even the best-informed students of Russian interference don’t have a comprehensive understanding of it.

When Mueller’s prosecutors appeared in court, in February 2019, they implied that the most troubling evidence they had uncovered implicated Manafort, the Trump campaign chairman. This wasn’t a surprising admission. Throughout their filings, Mueller’s team referred to Manafort’s Kyiv-based aide-de-camp, Konstantin Kilimnik, as an active Russian agent. Manafort had clearly spoken with Kilimnik during the campaign, and had even passed confidential campaign information to him, with the understanding that the documents would ultimately arrive in the hands of oligarchs close to the Kremlin.

One of the great disappointments of the Mueller Report is that it fails to provide narrative closure after building so much anticipation for the Kilimnik story line. Mueller did not fully explain why Manafort’s relationship with his Ukraine-based adviser so bothered his prosecutors. Why had Manafort passed along the documents? And what did the oligarchs want with them?

The committee fills in the gaps somewhat. It reports that Manafort and Kilimnik talked almost daily during the campaign. They communicated through encrypted technologies set to automatically erase their correspondence; they spoke using code words and shared access to an email account. It’s worth pausing on these facts: The chairman of the Trump campaign was in daily contact with a Russian agent, constantly sharing confidential information with him. That alone makes for one of the worst scandals in American political history.

The significant revelation of the document is that Kilimnik was likely a participant in the Kremlin scheme to hack and leak Clinton campaign emails. Furthermore, Kilimnik kept in close contact with the Russian oligarch Oleg Deripaska, a former client of Manafort’s. The report also indicates that Deripaska was connected to his government’s hacking efforts. This fact is especially suggestive: Deripaska had accused Manafort of stealing money from him, and Manafort hoped to repair his relationship with the oligarch. Was Manafort passing information to him, through Kilimnik, for the sake of currying favor with an old patron?

As maddeningly elliptical as this section of the report may be—and much of it is redacted—it still makes one wonder why Mueller would cut a deal with an established prevaricator like Manafort before pursuing his investigation of Kilimnik to more concrete conclusions.

When Manafort—with a pardon dangling in front of him—brazenly lied to prosecutors, he helped save Trump from having to confront this damning story. He wasn’t the only Trump associate to obstruct justice. (The committee has referred five Trump aides and supporters to the Justice Department for possibly providing false testimony.) By undermining investigators, Trump’s cronies rendered Mueller’s report a hash lacking a firm conclusion. They helped detonate the charge of collusion, letting it fizzle well ahead of the 2020 election.

The SSCI report does an honorable job of showing which strands of speculation deserve to be buried—Carter Page, for instance, was just a grifter who never got close to the heart of the Trump campaign. It also shows that many other strands, and not just those involving Manafort, merit further investigation. So many aspects of Trump-campaign behavior were suspicious—and designed to evade detection—that the truth remains elusive, even after a careful Senate investigation. The publication of this admirable report should not mark the end of the quest to uncover what really happened.

Bolded for emphasis. So very much emphasis.

It will be a whlle before we decide on which is the worst part. Was it Trump's campaign manager talking daily and secretly with a Russian spy? Was it that same Russian spy obtaining the emails that Trump had personally asked Russia for in public? Was it Roger Stone also working on this, and Trump knowing about it, as the SSCI says? Was it Trump following Manafort's lead and redirecting the blame to Ukraine? Was it the Trump Tower meeting, when members of Trump's campaign and even his own family intentionally invited Russian agents to Trump Tower to ask for dirt on a political rival? Or was it the intentional obstruction of the investigation and/or justice, by use of executive privilege, pardons, and sentence reduction? The fact that it's difficult to determine is what makes this mess of Trump and his campaign intentionally working with Russia to attack the election such a big deal.

Now if you'll excuse me, there's a nap I have to get back to. If anyone asks for me, tell them I don't listen to admitted cowards.

[Felya]

So let me get this straight...you believe that I'm the one who's deflecting (and have no standing in this thread to make challenges) when I merely ask you to back up your stupid conspiracy theory with facts. Unbelievable.

You're the one who specially stated that "Trump was either a Russian asset or lobbying to become one" even though there was NOTHING in the intelligence report which indicates that this statement is true. All I did was ask you to back up your statement. And if anyone is deflecting...it's you.

Bottom line, your horseshit conspiracy theory that Trump was a Russian asset (or aspired to be one) is irrational self-delusion with ZERO basis in fact.

Wake up.

I was willing to stoop to your level and actually responded, clearly showing both assertions to be true. Oh well... pretend it didn’t happen... lol

[Thee ANCOM]

weather Trump is a Russian asset isn't as important to the fact that he and Russia worked together. like we don't need to staple on a conspiracy theory for it to still look incredibly bad for Trump. it certainly validates any FBI "spying"**** that went on into his campaign. seeing as literately every single one of these mother fuckers are criminals.

[Felya]

weather Trump is a Russian asset isn't as important to the fact that he and Russia worked together. like we don't need to staple on a conspiracy theory for it to still look incredibly bad for Trump. it certainly validates any FBI "spying"**** that went on into his campaign. seeing as literately every single one of these mother fuckers are criminals.

Former republican FBI and CIA officials are putting their support behind Biden tomorrow, calling Trump corrupt and unfit for office.

[Shalcker]

I rather enjoy watching Trumpsters line up with Russian misinformation agents to shill for a corrupt racist like Trump. Sure, it's depressing as hell to see people completely forsake principles and morals... but it is like watching Idiocracy take shame in real time.

There are plenty of US misinformation agents pushing their own misinformation for various reasons.

Supporting one misinformation over other is still supporting misinformation.

If you don't make an effort to show coherent chain of proofs, then you encourage more misinformation as releasing shoddy evidence is rewarded with approval and attention.

[Breccia]

There are plenty of

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

(deep breath)

MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Are you, an admitted supporter of Putin For Life, really trying to "Both sides do it"? Oh man, it's adorable that you even pretend to have any moral authority on this topic. Wow, I haven't laughed this hard in a while. I needed that, thanks.

[pathora44]

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHA

(deep breath)

MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Are you, an admitted supporter of Putin For Life, really trying to "Both sides do it"? Oh man, it's adorable that you even pretend to have any moral authority on this topic. Wow, I haven't laughed this hard in a while. I needed that, thanks.

Hey no turnips for Shalcker if he doesn't shill for Papa Putin.

[Milchshake]

Hey no turnips for Shalcker if he doesn't shill for Papa Putin.

I could be worse. Imagine if Putin sends you a gift-basket full of exotic teas. What do you do?

[pathora44]

I could be worse. Imagine if Putin sends you a gift-basket full of exotic teas. What do you do?

*In horrible Russian accent: "Well obviously you drink the tea because it is a wonderful gift from almighty Papa Putin. If you chose not to drink it would be a terrible insult to oh so generous Papa Putin and, in no correlation, you might have horrible accident falling onto to 20+ bullets a common accident in Russia."