New date may not be til spring...

[Synical123]

he didnt move the goalpost, he said it before, you just ignored it...
and obviously the delay wasnt due to state of things and changes made in the begining of beta, but due to recent state, so when talking about delay and how things are working NOW it is kinda stupid to talk about what was months ago, even if he didnt mention recent state/changes, which he did...

No no no I specifically said there were multiple changes to the core of the system in beta. He then said there were no such changes and that I was being vague. Then went on later to say there were no changes made RECENTLY. Pay attention to the conversation before you butt in, thanks.

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I'm not moving it, my first post to you about the covenant system was literally that nothing has changed recently. Go back and read it.

There has been no major changes recently to the covenant system. So lets to back to that, which you still havent been able to argue for.

Here it is for you:

Read your own quote, what you’re referring to isn’t what I listed. What I’m discussing isn’t them just “moving around placements” I’m discussing them changing the system on a fundamental level. Which they have, and you claimed they didn’t. Like I said, you are too uninformed to participate here, sorry.

[rhorle]

Yeah, no one asked for refunds for their preorders before delaying the game. You missed the whole point. Nintendos court case about refunding preorders has nothing to do with not delivering a product on a stated time. Not sure why bringing that up in the first place.

"The original lawsuit alleged that Nintendo’s eShop policies that forbade refunds on digital pre-orders, both before and after release, went against EU rules that ensure customers have the right to withdraw from a purchase if the product in question has yet to be distributed."

The claim by Nintendo, which the courts have upheld, is that by pre-loading the software prior to release the contract has been fulfilled. Blizzard allows pre-loading, allowed use of some parts of the product, and has "released" 9.0. The date of a product being pushed back isn't relevant to the law. If part, or all of, the contract has been delivered they are not legally required to do anything.

[arkanon]

I'm with you. I've been playing beta pretty solidly and it's not as bad as the doomsayers are pretending.

It's basically feature complete, the leveling is fine, most of the intro stuff when you hit 60 and choose a covenant is fine(I had a bug on a couple of skip toons) and nothing seems super overtuned that couldn't be fixed with a round of hot fixes.

Honestly if it wasn't for covenant balance they could have launched it yesterday and it would have been okay. At least in my eyes.

The only other thing is the maw... but that could be fleshed out in a .0.5 patch or something when everything else starts to die down, it's perfectly functional as is.

I'm hoping for late nov/first week dec at the latest because hype is already dying down big time, and there is no replacement for launch hype no matter how much better you think they're going to make it.

I see the new acceptable standard for Blizzard products is "it's not that bad, and yeah, this feature is not good, but they can fix that later in another patch". Oh how the mighty have fallen.

In dungeons I have experienced mobs bugging out and sliding up the wall and getting stuck on the ceiling, mobs bugging out and respawning, bosses where you must dismiss all your pets or it bugs out in an endless loop, bosses randomly despawning at 5%, players falling through the world, mobs having the wrong animations and walking around with the "falling" animation, and an endless list of similar events. All reported for weeks, all still there.

If this is the standard we now consider acceptable from a AAA release, no wonder the gaming industry is happy taking advantage of their consumers.

[Pann]

Yeah, no one asked for refunds for their preorders before delaying the game. You missed the whole point. Nintendos court case about refunding preorders has nothing to do with not delivering a product on a stated time. Not sure why bringing that up in the first place.

What does this have to do with anything I have written?

No, I did not! I replied to a post that, incorrectly, claimed that EU law entitled the customer to a refund as well as the receiving the product if it was not delivered by an advertised date. For some reason you decided to reply with some irrelevant links claiming that customers were entitled to compensation (although there seems to be some confusion on your part as to what is compensation or a refund).

The Nintendo court case clearly states that the contract is complete once data is pre-loaded to the customer's device (even if it is not playable) - which is the case for SL - and that the customer is no longer entitled to withdraw from the sale.

Given that the release date has already been delayed and Blizzard have given customers the option of requesting a refund or accepting the new, vague, release date of 'Coming later this year', they have already fulfilled their obligations of being unable to deliver the product on the stated date.

But seeing as you are so sure of yourself which article of EU law - they are all readily available online - do you think entitles a customer to refund and compensation if they do not release SL by the end of the year?

[rhorle]

If this is the standard we now consider acceptable from a AAA release, no wonder the gaming industry is happy taking advantage of their consumers.

You find it acceptable enough to keep playing so why is it so terrible of a thing? Bugs happen and what you describe is not that bad even from a AAA release.

[Spiritguide]

Not sure if this adds to the speculation as NVidia slipped with something similar also https://www.wowhead.com/news=318811/...g-feature-vide

[Jowany]

If they need time up to spring, let them, better late and finished than now and agoun live beta.

[Lolites]

No no no I specifically said there were multiple changes to the core of the system in beta..

he said "They havent changed anything fundamental in a long time."
to which you reacted they changed it multiple times, and so on... so he didnt move goalpost, you just either ignored what he said, or werent capable of understanding it...
soo its YOU who should either pay attention to conversation (especialy since you are one of main "sides" in it) or learn how to read WITH COMPREHENSION

[ClassicPeon]

No no no I specifically said there were multiple changes to the core of the system in beta. He then said there were no such changes and that I was being vague. Then went on later to say there were no changes made RECENTLY. Pay attention to the conversation before you butt in, thanks.

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Read your own quote, what you’re referring to isn’t what I listed. What I’m discussing isn’t them just “moving around placements” I’m discussing them changing the system on a fundamental level. Which they have, and you claimed they didn’t. Like I said, you are too uninformed to participate here, sorry.

You keep saying they have, i keep telling you they havent done that in a long time. Its time to present some evidence.

[MrLachyG]

My theory is August 2021. They don't wan't to release it in holiday season. Early 2021 major PS5 / XSX games are coming so it's not the ideal time too. Classic Naxx is coming in spring 2021 most likely so they don't want to release it at the same time. Summer is also bad time to release new xpac so it's going to be August 2021 most likely.

So a 10 month prepatch? Yeah, no

[Wries]

Why would Cyberpunk 2077 effect Shadowlands release? They are two completely different types of games, with different audiences I would think. Isn't Cyberpunk a Grand Theft Auto type game set in a Sci Fi near future world?

I would think most WoW players would be ready and waiting for Shadowlands regardless of CP77

I'm with Zenfoldor in thinking that they probably share a non-insignficant chunk of audience. Sample size of my group of WoW-friends I'd say most of them have expressed interest in Cyberpunk.

It's like how say DC and Marvel movies typically just don't share the same opening weekend. Makes sense to stay away from the week where CDPR and their game gets the spotlight.

That said, I can imagine that Blizzard hasn't shared a new release date because they haven't settled on one just yet. So they might be able to flex around this.

[Synical123]

You keep saying they have, i keep telling you they havent done that in a long time. Its time to present some evidence.

Fine here is one of the latest, not even a month ago? A change to how the conduit system works itself what would have been a month before release

https://www.wowhead.com/news=318351/...nduit%20Charge.


Oh and back in july they changed it to act like this

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...-update/596481

And this was changed from acting like it was in alpha where your conduit worked like something that you destroyed when you changed so there was no collection system.

This is just one example here. These are not just 'balance' changes. These are changing how the system works as a whole, these should have been alpha decisions not beta decisions, and for sure not changes that would normally be happening a MONTH before release.

There is a solid reason they discussed pulling the ripcord, you don't hear that a lot from blizzard. And once again, this is not because they just need to balance it, it's because they are finding it imbalanceable. I mean it would take a monkey not to be able to see this.

[MrLachyG]

It’s not going to be Nov 10

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

It’s not going to be Nov 10

People seem to have forgotten there's the whole zombie event which is gonna be 3-4 weeks probably. We're already pushed out of November entirely.

[Hero2Zer0]

Could you tell me how paying for an actual service is considered a scam ?

Right, I haven't been charged for any of the free gifts I've gotten for playing. I wish they had started this back in wrath.

[rhorle]

People seem to have forgotten there's the whole zombie event which is gonna be 3-4 weeks probably. We're already pushed out of November entirely.

They can modify it to be whatever length they want though. It isn't required to be 3-4 weeks and could easily be compressed into 1-2 weeks if they run everything at the same time.

[Yayeet]

Just a reaction from PoE producer Chris Wilson after hearing that CP will be delayed to 3 days before the new PoE league.
https://twitter.com/bexsayswords/sta...16504130465792

Honestly, this is HUUUUUUGE. The CP delay is ruining Blizzards plans big times.

people will still play wow, they'll just play cyberpunk when they've done their daily stuff.

[MrLachyG]

People seem to have forgotten there's the whole zombie event which is gonna be 3-4 weeks probably. We're already pushed out of November entirely.

Nov 24 is still an option. Any later than that and we won’t see raid til next year

[arkanon]

People seem to have forgotten there's the whole zombie event which is gonna be 3-4 weeks probably. We're already pushed out of November entirely.

Yeah I have it in my brain that it was 3 weeks, and for the life of me I don't know where or when that imbedded. I keep saying they will give very little warning for the event - even a couple of days would be fine, and when they announce that, they will be announcing the new release date at the same time. I expect this date to be 3-4 weeks after the announcement date.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Nov 24 is still an option. Any later than that and we won’t see raid til next year

It is but I kinda feel like at that point they just kick it a week later soas not to have to put out fires on Thanksgiving.

Yeah I have it in my brain that it was 3 weeks, and for the life of me I don't know where or when that imbedded. I keep saying they will give very little warning for the event - even a couple of days would be fine, and when they announce that, they will be announcing the new release date at the same time. I expect this date to be 3-4 weeks after the announcement date.

History is what imbedded it. Events usually run ~4 weeks.