How do I make tanks stop pulling so I can drink?

[MrKnubbles]

Damn, I don't get why everyone is being so rude. I have my raid frames set to hide mana bars unless I'm on my tank. I also often check to see if the healer is drinking or not. If the tank keeps pulling and dies when the healer is low on mana, then it's the tank's fault. The tank needs to pay attention but communication is important and you're clearly communicating. Yes, there is a timer but you'll save more time by preventing a wipe from being a little more careful. I don't have the perfect solution for you but hopefully, the tank will learn their lesson if they die. Worst case scenario, they blame you, call you bad and leave the group. I'd highly suggest making some tank friends and getting comfortable with each other.

[Azerox]

Ill just sit and eat while they die (tell them before ofc).
I refer to that if they die

[Zephire]

9 out of 10 tanks that I come across in M+ seem to be blind and illiterate, because I've got a WeakAura that automatically sends a message to the party when I drop below 30% mana, and even with that, tanks ignore it and continue to go off chainpulling when I'm at 10% and drinking. And with how close together most trash packs are, I have barely any time to drink. I end up spending the entire dungeon below 40% mana because tanks just chainpull nonstop.

No, I can't "drink while the tank pulls" because they often just start taking loads of damage as soon as they engage mobs. Even trying to drink after every pull, I'm running up and just barely saving the tank from death as I struggle to spam heal them, which wastes even more mana.

Should I just let them die if they won't let me drink? That's likely the only way I'm gonna get their attention if multiple party chat messages aren't doing anything.

It's a balance. I'm one of those tanks you discribe and I base my pulling on:
1) do I have cds?
2) do I think the mana will be enough to heal?
3) can I avoid a lot of damage by kiting?
4) do we have hybrids who offheal?
5) can we keep trash cc:ed?

I expect the healer to drink when s/he needs mana and I expect to have to deal with a lot of damage without healing for a bit. I can see how frustrating it can feel to never get 100% mana and "wasting" good ol' drinks.

The change to how mana return from drinks work in SL probably hasn't sunk in completely either. I'm talking about how the mana return from drinking ramps up the longer you drink, starting low instead of being the same amount per second like in BFA. Also fish feast was nerfed, right?

That said, if the healer communicates that they want full mana etc then I ofc listen and wait. (same goes with rogues flaming me for not letting them restealth, I'm sorry, ok?! I forget that )

Edit:
I don't know how you get the tanks attention if they don't listen. If we die and I hear "I HAD NO MANA" from healer then I say that I misscalculated it and say I'm sorry. That means I listen though... those who don't? Whisper them maybe? No idea.

[erifwodahs]

So many "let them die" responses. I mean how long do you drink? "Oh I am going to use every second of this food" ? Sit down for 5-6 seconds and it will get you through into the prides. Tanks can take that unless it's one of big ass pulls, where they would pop defs and kite after. If shit goes down pop a mana potion. Do you think tanks don't use health potions? Because we do.

Letting a pug tank die will be only educative for his next run if he learns, so likely you are teaching a player who you will never see again and chances are that next run you will have to do the same just killing another key

[Kumorii]

Nah. I main a Guardian druid, always keep an eye on healer mana. It's fine if the tank pulls a pack once when healer mana is low because he wasn't attentive. But there are tanks that will never stop and just chain pull everything. Some even pull while you are still rezing dead DPS.

Absolutely, bad players do exist yes.

[chiddie]

Is it wiping the group? It sounds like you are getting through it alive still, so it's all okay. Why need 60-70+% mana when 30% still keeps the group alive? You do what you can with what you have instead of slowing the group. Dps players don't just stop running without their dps cooldowns or resources up. Tanks don't stop pulling even if defensive cds are down.
If group waits for you to drink you're playing wrong

Noes. You have to go at healer’s pace EXACTLY because there’s a timer and you waste more time if there’s a wipe because healer is oom than waiting 10 seconds from time to time to let him get back from 15-20% to 60-70%.

Also if a healer gets constantly oom, assuming he’s not spamming heals with ppl at 100% hps, it means the other 4 are taking TONS of AVOIDABLE damage.

It’s enough to run the same dungeon at the same level 4-5 times in a row to notice it: sometimes you can even dps, sometimes you are oom after 2-3 pulls. Guess why in the second case.

[iinverse]

You can drink just after combat fades between pulls and continue drinking while tank pulling, its usually enough to keep mana and tank can stay alive for some time using his defensives. If you will not learn how to do this, you will not be able to time higher keys.

[Asrialol]

As a resto druid i can't recall having had to drink anything in a m+ dungeon yet. Except for after 2nd boss in a 18 SD last night.. Had to get food buff since I was destroyed.

[chiddie]

It's a balance. I'm one of those tanks you discribe and I base my pulling on:
1) do I have cds?
2) do I think the mana will be enough to heal?
3) can I avoid a lot of damage by kiting?
4) do we have hybrids who offheal?
5) can we keep trash cc:ed?

I expect the healer to drink when s/he needs mana and I expect to have to deal with a lot of damage without healing for a bit. I can see how frustrating it can feel to never get 100% mana and "wasting" good ol' drinks.

The change to how mana return from drinks work in SL probably hasn't sunk in completely either. I'm talking about how the mana return from drinking ramps up the longer you drink, starting low instead of being the same amount per second like in BFA. Also fish feast was nerfed, right?

That said, if the healer communicates that they want full mana etc then I ofc listen and wait. (same goes with rogues flaming me for not letting them restealth, I'm sorry, ok?! I forget that )

Edit:
I don't know how you get the tanks attention if they don't listen. If we die and I hear "I HAD NO MANA" from healer then I say that I misscalculated it and say I'm sorry. That means I listen though... those who don't? Whisper them maybe? No idea.

No good healer do think he needs 100% mana all the time, because... well he simply does not need it.

I type REC when I need to rec, if no one cares I adapt and try to drink for 3/4 seconds whenever I can IF I need it. If we wipe because I’m oom and they blame me I point them to the REC I wrote before.

[czarek]

Let them die and suffer hahaha

[Tziva]

The drinking change was pretty shit. I am sure it had to do with arena, but I wish they could have only made it function like that in arena. They have that power.

It's pretty frustrating in m+, especially on weeks like this one or bursting or any of the other affixes that hold you in combat for abnormally long.

[h4rr0d]

Just drink man.

Tanks can usually survive a while on their own

thats the thing, starting with like 10+, they really can't, especially on fortified weeks. Some packs are really insane. The isue is especially big on spiteful weeks, where you finish clearing a pack, but are stuck in combat thanks to the retarded adds that spawn. You can just run from then, so as soon as the last actuall trash mob dies, the entire party legs it and pulls the next pack barely dropping combat, if ever. This is especially bad for disc priests, who have terrible mana efficiency and are proactive healer, so pulling when they are not ready means they are behind on healing immediately after the pull and have to resort to inefficient healing methods only straining their mana further in a spiral that is not fun to play. DHs with their superior mobility are the biggest offenders here when they just fell rush out of range too...

[chiddie]

You can drink just after combat fades between pulls and continue drinking while tank pulling, its usually enough to keep mana and tank can stay alive for some time using his defensives. If you will not learn how to do this, you will not be able to time higher keys.

If the curve is like in BfA (I don’t know, I am in the 4-6 bracket atm), the more you do high level keys, the less oom is an issue because you start playing with ppl that know what to do and most of all how to avoid avoidable damage.

The real nightmare are keys under +10 I think.

[iinverse]

If the curve is like in BfA (I don’t know, I am in the 4-6 bracket atm), the more you do high level keys, the less oom is an issue because you start playing with ppl that know what to do and most of all how to avoid avoidable damage.

The real nightmare are keys under +10 I think.

Unfortunately there are many players which do sh*t in 10+ keys.

[Sinaa]

Tanks know that it's almost always possible to keep constantly pulling. I hate how much more frustrating that made dungeon healing in general, but sans telling your tank on discord to stop they won't wait for you. Letting the tank die is not a good strategy in pugs, ever. (In m+ the key will fail and dungeon finder groups will just boot you)

[VinceVega]

9 out of 10 tanks that I come across in M+ seem to be blind and illiterate, because I've got a WeakAura that automatically sends a message to the party when I drop below 30% mana, and even with that, tanks ignore it and continue to go off chainpulling when I'm at 10% and drinking. And with how close together most trash packs are, I have barely any time to drink. I end up spending the entire dungeon below 40% mana because tanks just chainpull nonstop.

No, I can't "drink while the tank pulls" because they often just start taking loads of damage as soon as they engage mobs. Even trying to drink after every pull, I'm running up and just barely saving the tank from death as I struggle to spam heal them, which wastes even more mana.

Should I just let them die if they won't let me drink? That's likely the only way I'm gonna get their attention if multiple party chat messages aren't doing anything.

I always use pots on CD and spam click water at the end of each pack. Normally i don't run out and if i do i write in chat that i need to drink after the next pack.
The tank can choose himself if he thinks he can survive the next pack at the start without me or not. If he dies anyway it is not my fault and he learned a lesson.

If i would send a message everytime i drop below 30% i would constantly spam the chat with messages i wan't to drink. I would ignore that too as a tank as that is to much. I spent half the dungeon between 10 and 40 % mana.

[Wuusah]

thats the thing, starting with like 10+, they really can't, especially on fortified weeks. Some packs are really insane. The isue is especially big on spiteful weeks, where you finish clearing a pack, but are stuck in combat thanks to the retarded adds that spawn. You can just run from then, so as soon as the last actuall trash mob dies, the entire party legs it and pulls the next pack barely dropping combat, if ever. This is especially bad for disc priests, who have terrible mana efficiency and are proactive healer, so pulling when they are not ready means they are behind on healing immediately after the pull and have to resort to inefficient healing methods only straining their mana further in a spiral that is not fun to play. DHs with their superior mobility are the biggest offenders here when they just fell rush out of range too...

Well if a tank runs into a fortified trash pack and doesn't use a single def cooldown, doesn't wait for healer who needs mana and then dies, then that's on the tank.

But a tank who has a brain and uses the skills they have shouldn't instantly fall over. My Brm monk can get a lot of damage in a short amount of time but then I activate my celestial brew, use some selfheal, kite the mobs, use my aoe stun etc. It might look dangerous how quickly I drop so low but I'm actually far away from dying. A healer who immediately stops drinking and starts healing is just wasting their mana at that point. I'm sure it's similar with other tanks.

It's kinda funny, though, how different players treat their mana differently. There are healers who are at 30% mana and tell you to "gogo just pull" and there are healers with 50% mana who scream bloody murder


edit:

If i would send a message everytime i drop below 30% i would constantly spam the chat with messages i wan't to drink. I would ignore that too as a tank as that is to much. I spent half the dungeon between 10 and 40 % mana.

Without other talk in chat, I imagine it might also get confusing when the same "I need mana" automated message is written multiple times in a row and you're not sure if that's now a new message or from the last trash pack. The last thing I want to do as a tank is to look at chat timestamps in a dungeon

[tehealadin]

If I am able to, I just start drinking and let them forge ahead. When they complain I point out what the blue bar under my health bar is (I mean it really isn't some obscure thing that is really easy to miss, a cursory glance is all that is needed). One of the basics of tanking is to keep an eye on the healers mana. Usually there are small windows to top some mana up between pulls, I've only ever once this expansion genuinely been oom because of the tank, there were no out of combat moments, the next pack is pulled before the first is killed. After a wipe he saw fit to give me a few seconds to top up.

[chiddie]

I always use pots on CD and spam click water at the end of each pack. Normally i don't run out and if i do i write in chat that i need to drink after the next pack.
The tank can choose himself if he thinks he can survive the next pack at the start without me or not. If he dies anyway it is not my fault and he learned a lesson.

If i would send a message everytime i drop below 30% i would constantly spam the chat with messages i wan't to drink. I would ignore that too as a tank as that is to much. I spent half the dungeon between 10 and 40 % mana.

I agree that a 30% alert is maybe too high threshold but it probably depends heavily on the class, with my resto shaman I feel usually ok until I go below 15% (that rarely happens unless the group is complete trash and in case I have the mana totem ready, it’s not a lifesaver but helps).

[Puri]

I find healers who do not drink every time they have the chance (even when they are at 80% mana), heal themselves empty (with no reserves if something goes wrong) and then force the group to wait 20s for them to fully drink so much more annoying than mana ignoring tanks (those will learn by themselves, it's just a question of the steepness of the learning curve).