Undead Paladin?

[Syegfryed]

OK, cool so they will do same "no effort" animal forms for other races.

I don't understand why you are so salty and frankly I don't give a damn. Shitting on current Blizz art team is just hilarious. You can talk about systems and such all you like, but Blizz WoW art guys? Yeahhh... kekw.

You seem more salty and angry than me friend, "not giving a damn" like you are 12, im not "shitting on current blizz art team"

im just saying i believe blizzard those days to the minimum, the customizations of races is an example of that, we were supposed to get much more, instead, we prob not even gain anymore this expansion.

Then again, last time we got a new class combo was in Legion, and only one, before that was in cataclysm as far i remember, so this process is too slow for all that counts, we may wait 6 years just for one combination

[Stormdash]

It's really what... 20 years passed ingame since Vanilla? Yeah, not sure it's enough of a gap for naturally falling boundries.

THAT SAID, they can just go by a simple "PC is speshul" thing and let that roll. I'd be glad to have restrictions lifted already.

It's an entirely generation. Of not just organic integration that's routinely reflected in-story and in-world, but of martially motivated integration. Societies proactively interested in learning new ways to fight and defeat their enemies. I mean, pretty much everyone learned to be monks - who canonically are mystical - almost immediately. And that's before even relying on the crutch of the protagonist privilege that rightfully belongs to the player character.

It's just exhausting and artificial. Hell, I think they should just shotgun it into the game *right now* without any in-story explanation, much like when they added Dwarf and Troll warlocks as an afterthought shortly into Cataclysm. Especially given the dire content drought that would freshen interest not to mention be an influx of cash (there would probably be so many faction/race change orders that a queue forms).

[LemonDemonGirl]

"Death druids?"
It's got potential. A corrupted form of the circle of life druid ideal. Writing it... I'd strictly limit it to the forsaken. And though the aesthetics would obviously appear very much a shapechanged corpsicle, game mechanics probably wouldn't change much beyond adding a disease factor.

Well, we have Kul'tiran Druids, and they're a bit like that right?

[OMGTwitchTV]

i dont think you can apply real science to a fantasy world

And yet the fantasy world was built using real science. You are laboring under the misconception that they are mutally exclusive. Anything is possible when logic is applied.

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they are not "variety of humans" the didn't come from the same thing, those races come from different titan constructs, so they don't share any dna structure and the class you can be have nothing to do with dna

Each of these races are from Azeroth, created by constructs on the same planet from the same source materials and filled with the same arcane,nature, elemental, theological magics. Much like the races of Middle Earth, I don't think anyone would question that Humans, Dwarves, and Hobbits all share a very common carbon makeup. And since they are all humanoids, with similar skin tones, eye and hair colors, and breathe the same air and eat/drink the same contents, that makes them just as similar as us. I imagine Andre the Giant and Vern Troyer likely both enjoyed a hamburger and french fries from McDonald's at some point. But, if it is a difference of opinions, then you are certainly entitled to yours, but I won't be adjusting my logical perspective to change my mind to suit other narratives which make less sense.

[Verdugo]

Which is the only way forsaken fanbois justify the "argument" for paladins.

I dont think that is the fanbase that wants undead paladins.

[Syegfryed]

Each of these races are from Azeroth, created by constructs on the same planet from the same source materials and filled with the same arcane,nature, elemental, theological magics. Much like the races of Middle Earth, I don't think anyone would question that Humans, Dwarves, and Hobbits all share a very common carbon makeup. And since they are all humanoids, with similar skin tones, eye and hair colors, and breathe the same air and eat/drink the same contents, that makes them just as similar as us. I imagine Andre the Giant and Vern Troyer likely both enjoyed a hamburger and french fries from McDonald's at some point. But, if it is a difference of opinions, then you are certainly entitled to yours, but I won't be adjusting my logical perspective to change my mind to suit other narratives which make less sense.

No, no, again, not the same, dwarves by example were made from stone constructs, vrykul were made from iron, and so on.

They are fundamental different and their racials show how they have different structure and dna. The only ones with relationship are vrykuls and humans, sinc ehumans direct descend from vrykul.

[Moose184]

And like with Tirion, Paladins can also reconnect with it. But The Light isn't the only faith that can work with Paladins, anyway.

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There are many examples of Undead Paladins that exist. Whether it's possible or not isn't the issue.

Please give me one example of an Undead Paladin

[enigma77]

I think race/class restrictions do more harm than good and should be summarily removed. Let every race be every class, even if in some cases it seems like an unlikely combination.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

She will lead us down the path to Forsaken Paladins...


...but I won't say her name since it whips this forum up into a frenzy, much like saying Slyvanus.

[Zorgulon]

Paladin light.. a no go.. priest light.. well... I guess that's ok.

It's the same fucking light, yes?

Yes and no. From what I've read many years ago, priests wield the light, they manipulate it so it's external. That means an undead priest can use the light, but it burns them and they even restore some sense of feeling to their dead flesh, so they can feel the rot and maggots in their skin. Ew and ouch...

Paladins channels the light, so it's internal. It comes from inside and is kinda "stronger". That means an undead paladin would basically just explode.

I guess you could say: Priests set fire to their hands. Ouch, but usable. Paladins set fire to their spines. Ded.
That's what I've gathered at least :P

[jellmoo]

Yes and no. From what I've read many years ago, priests wield the light, they manipulate it so it's external. That means an undead priest can use the light, but it burns them and they even restore some sense of feeling to their dead flesh, so they can feel the rot and maggots in their skin. Ew and ouch...

Paladins channels the light, so it's internal. It comes from inside and is kinda "stronger". That means an undead paladin would basically just explode.

I guess you could say: Priests set fire to their hands. Ouch, but usable. Paladins set fire to their spines. Ded.
That's what I've gathered at least :P

The thing is that some of the first members of the Order of the silver Hand were Priests that popped on armor and learned to fight. Functionally, Paladins shouldn't be terribly different than Priests. They're just Priests that have shifted focus and learned the art of war.

[shoc]

Druids should be able to Hunter Tame any Animal Form they damn well please. Some minor restrictions, eg. Turtles = Bear Form only, Flying Beasts = Flight Form are all that's needed.

[jellmoo]

That is how they shifted it to war, by embodying it. That's a big difference between martial and divine casting.

But Paladins were literally just Priests that were taught to fight, and Warriors that were taught to be Priests. There really shouldn't be any difference in the 'how' when it comes to using the Light.

[Razion]

Please give me one example of an Undead Paladin

Here's 19:
- Sir Zeliek is risen Scourge that maintains faith in the Light through dialogue as a prominent recurring raid boss in Vanilla and Wrath.
- Reanimated Exarches are Draenei ghosts found in Terokar Forest, Outland with Devotion Aura.
- Disembodied Exarches are Draenei ghosts found in Netherstorm, Outland with Devotion Aura.
- Disembodied Protectors are Draenei ghosts found in Netherstorm, Outland with Crusader Strike.
- Lady Keira Berrybruck is a holy paladin human ghost found in Karazhan as a council-style raid boss that uses Holy Light and Greater Blessing of Might.
- Baron Rafe Dreuger is a ret paladin human ghost found in Karazhan as a council-style raid boss that uses Hammer of Justice and Judgment of Command.
- Reanimated Crusader and Reanimated Captains are risen Scourge that wield the Light found in Scourgeholme, Northrend that throw holy Avenger's Shields.
- Captain Brandon is a human paladin that can fall and be raised if not saved in original ICC that can use Crusader Strike, Divine Shield, Hammer of Betrayal, and Judgment of Command.
- Darkfallen Blood Knight is a member of The San'layn in Icecrown Citadel that appears before the Blood Price encounter wearing Paladin tier.
- Davil Lightfire is a human ghost bound to the events of Darrowshire, appears in Eastern Plaguelands, Eastern Kingdoms and uses Devotion Aura, HoJ, and Holy Strike.
- Silver Hand Disciple is a human ghost bound to the events of Darrowshire, appears in Eatern Plaguelands, Eastern Kingdoms and uses Crusader Strike and Holy Light.
- Scarlet Warder is a Forsaken Scarlet Crusade member found in Eastern Plaguelands, Eastern Kingdoms that uses Crusader Strike and Holy Light.
- Scarlet Praetorian is a Forsaken Scarlet Crusade member found in Eastern Plaguelands, Eastern Kingdoms that uses Exorcism and Holy Strike.
- Scarlet Commander Marjhan is a Forsaken Scarlet Crusade member found in Eastern Plaguelands, Eastern Kingdoms that uses Divine Storm, Retribution Aura, and Hammer of Wrath.
- Crusader Lord Valdemar is a Forsaken Scarlet Crusade member found in Eastern Plaguelands, Eastern Kingdoms who wields Devotion Aura, HoJ, Crusader Strike.
- Malefic Defender is a Draenei ghost found in the dungeon Auchindoun, WoD that uses Crusader Strike.
- Halahk the Deathbringer is a human ghost found during an instanced version of ICC that uses Avenging Wrath, Holy Light, and Holy Shock.
- Fanatic Crusader is a human ghost objective of Party Crashers found in The Ember Court, Shadowlands.
- Abused Souls are anima ghosts in Revendreth and The Ember Court that can use Crusader Strike.

And for 20, if you count Leonid Barthalowmew the Revered, a Forsaken member of the Argent Dawn who believes he is a vessel to smite the undead, who still reveres the Light.

[jellmoo]

Nah, what the other person was trying to say is its not just being taught warrior stuff, they learned to hybridize and created something brand new, that's why there's specifically paladin training, you can't be a priest and go to a warrior to be a paladin, it wouldn't work unless they struck lightning twice. The Light is channeled differently as a result.

Now, it's entirely possible that they retconbed this somewhere and I'm not aware, but like, that's exactly what they did. They took some Priests and trained them to be warriors. Nothing about it fundamentally changed the way they use the Light. They just used it for a different purpose.

[Julian Rayne]

I don't see why not. I used to think there were metaphysical problems with that but those same issues apply to Lightforged Death knights. Since we now have Lightforged Dks I don't see any reason to exclude Forsaken Paladins.

[Vrinara]

Considering that Paladins have been apart of both sides for years. You would think Paladins would start teaching some of the other races. it's the same with the other classes like Shaman, Druid, you get it. However I think the reason we haven't gotten race class updates is because they may not want every race to be every class. I honestly wish we had more class love. I miss class quests and we did kinda get them back with exiles reach.

In fact... You know what I want? if you REALLY wanna teach a new player how to play a class. Why not have class quests teaching different things for the classes? Such as Prot paladins learning to throw their shields, or Ret Paladins learning how to use Templars Verdict. Something along those lines could make classes feel fun when leveling. Specially for new people.. but then again. Likely wont happen.

[Maxilian]

The only problem with Undead Paladin is that they would be in pain whenever they use their abilities (unless they somehow end up becoming Shadow Paladins), but they could use it regardless.

[Razion]

The only problem with Undead Paladin is that they would be in pain whenever they use their abilities (unless they somehow end up becoming Shadow Paladins), but they could use it regardless.

Requesite for pain being felt is A) the capacity to feel, which not all Forsaken have as some are muted to feeling after death, B) afflictions like maggots and flesh, which not all Undead have to have, a skeleton or ghost/banshee undead doesn't have to worry about these feelings - even less so if they're apathetic/unfeeling type Undead.

Also C) Forsaken can be driven to madness, such as Scarlet or Argent Dawn zealotry or D) be masochistic.

Being in pain lorewise is acceptable. It can be done. Pain doesn't detract from the combo, if anything some Forsaken only have an outlet with pain and require it to feel much of anything.

[shoc]

Considering that Paladins have been apart of both sides for years. You would think Paladins would start teaching some of the other races. it's the same with the other classes like Shaman, Druid, you get it. However I think the reason we haven't gotten race class updates is because they may not want every race to be every class. I honestly wish we had more class love. I miss class quests and we did kinda get them back with exiles reach.

In fact... You know what I want? if you REALLY wanna teach a new player how to play a class. Why not have class quests teaching different things for the classes? Such as Prot paladins learning to throw their shields, or Ret Paladins learning how to use Templars Verdict. Something along those lines could make classes feel fun when leveling. Specially for new people.. but then again. Likely wont happen.

Hell just bring Sir Zeliek back to serve under the Forsaken ruled by Calia Menethil, he becomes a prominent Undead Paladin character, call it a day.