Sanctum of Domination Ending cinematic

[GR8GODZILLAGOD]

uhm, no?
actually, explaining it away, like you are doing, changes the narrative to the way you want it to be so that you can like it.
fact is, arthas design existed before the jailers.
and the jailers design was created while looking at a picture of arthas. which makes the jailer the knock off.

in lore, they can OF COURSE always say its the other way around. but same as with maldraxxus and the scourge, or torghast and ICC, the "knock offs" in lore are the original design in reality.

Nah, they're going to reveal the first ones, who created the jailer, and they'll have lich kingy armor, which will make Arthas a knock-off of the jailer who's a knock-off of the first ones. *taps forehead*

[Lucetia]

uhm, no?
actually, explaining it away, like you are doing, changes the narrative to the way you want it to be so that you can like it.
fact is, arthas design existed before the jailers.
and the jailers design was created while looking at a picture of arthas. which makes the jailer the knock off.

in lore, they can OF COURSE always say its the other way around. but same as with maldraxxus and the scourge, or torghast and ICC, the "knock offs" in lore are the original design in reality.

I mean if that makes you feel better?

Fact is. Jailer comes before Arthas. Jailer creates Arthas. Jailer therefore had a design and model Arthas and his stuff off it. Hence Arthas is the knockoff.

Just because we see Arthas first doesn't change anything. That would be the same thing as saying you meet a guy/girl and see what they look like then later on you meet their parents and notice they look almost exactly the same. By your logic in this case the parents would be knockoff because you met them last, despite we know that the parents indeed did come first. Exact same principle in this case. Of course though, I'll be told that's different because it's "common sense" or something and it's real life which isn't altered by artists.

in danuser we trust.
he shall reach levels of bad writing never thought possible before.

So out of curiosity, where are all your writings and stories at? I mean, you and many others can clearly do a better job. Why aren't we having you all write the storyline, books, scripts, etc?

Now, I'm not saying the story is amazing or anything, but I always find it funny when people want to do nothing but talk crap on it they haven't done anything themselves to show they could do better.

[hecpercu]

I dont like where the arc is going, but will give blizz some credit because....NATHANOS¡¡¡ noone is gonna think about poor NATHANOS¡¡¡ Now he's dead and her love is alive, that part is the most poetic and well written story blizzard has come up with in centuries

[starstationprofm]

I'm interested what happens, because presumably Tyrande will still want justice for Teldrassil, and Sylvannas might finally feel guilt.

I expect her to break down. She did to Darnassus exactly what Arthas did to Quel'Thalas.

And poor Nathanos, who they have COMPLETELY BUTCHERED, followed her evil half without question and got himself killed and Maw'd. The only person who loved her and wasn't bound by blood to her.


A complete shame, what they did to Nathanos. His moment of guilt and shame in Dark Mirror was so good.

[GR8GODZILLAGOD]

Just because we see Arthas first doesn't change anything. That would be the same thing as saying you meet a guy/girl and see what they look like then later on you meet their parents and notice they look almost exactly the same. By your logic in this case the parents would be knockoff because you met them last, despite we know that the parents indeed did come first. Exact same principle in this case. Of course though, I'll be told that's different because it's "common sense" or something and it's real life which isn't altered by artists.

That logic makes no sense and isn't comparable since Arthas was created FIRST by almost two decades, before the jailer was even a thought in anyone's head.

[gcsmith]

I expect her to break down. She did to Darnassus exactly what Arthas did to Quel'Thalas.

And poor Nathanos, who they have COMPLETELY BUTCHERED, followed her evil half without question and got himself killed and Maw'd. The only person who loved her and wasn't bound by blood to her.


A complete shame, what they did to Nathanos. His moment of guilt and shame in Dark Mirror was so good.

I dunno, he was a terrible character. Who arguably didn't even have his soul torn in two to justify his monstrous behaviour.

[Lucetia]

That logic makes no sense and isn't comparable since Arthas was created FIRST by almost two decades, before the jailer was even a thought in anyone's head.

There's the comment I knew that would come. Difference is the logic works the same and how do we know the Jailer wasn't even a thought in anyone's head?

The fact is Jailer creates Arthas. So why wouldn't the Jailer look almost exactly like Arthas? Which was also explained in my post.

[starstationprofm]

Your opinions are just that. This shit is indefensible.

Your opinion that this is indefensible, or that it needs defence at all, is just that.

- - - Updated - - -

They're just tired of Slyvanas, and the piss poor writing.

Those people would hate it no matter what Blizzard put out.

- - - Updated - - -

I dunno, he was a terrible character. Who arguably didn't even have his soul torn in two to justify his monstrous behaviour.

Which is why they messed him up. He should've been among those that turned on Sylvanas.

Him choosing the Forsaken over Sylvanas would've been a great moment, with him becoming the Forsaken faction lead. And when Sylvanas got her soul back you'd see them slowly mend their broken bond.

[Sorshen]

Just because we see Arthas first doesn't change anything. That would be the same thing as saying you meet a guy/girl and see what they look like then later on you meet their parents and notice they look almost exactly the same. By your logic in this case the parents would be knockoff because you met them last, despite we know that the parents indeed did come first. Exact same principle in this case. Of course though, I'll be told that's different because it's "common sense" or something and it's real life which isn't altered by artists.

That's exactly what blizzard would want us to believe, it's still laughable as hell.

Now, I'm not saying the story is amazing or anything, but I always find it funny when people want to do nothing but talk crap on it they haven't done anything themselves to show they could do better.

You don't need to be a cook to realise the food is bad.

[Houle]

I mean if that makes you feel better?

Fact is. Jailer comes before Arthas. Jailer creates Arthas. Jailer therefore had a design and model Arthas and his stuff off it. Hence Arthas is the knockoff.

Just because we see Arthas first doesn't change anything. That would be the same thing as saying you meet a guy/girl and see what they look like then later on you meet their parents and notice they look almost exactly the same. By your logic in this case the parents would be knockoff because you met them last, despite we know that the parents indeed did come first. Exact same principle in this case. Of course though, I'll be told that's different because it's "common sense" or something and it's real life which isn't altered by artists.



So out of curiosity, where are all your writings and stories at? I mean, you and many others can clearly do a better job. Why aren't we having you all write the storyline, books, scripts, etc?

Now, I'm not saying the story is amazing or anything, but I always find it funny when people want to do nothing but talk crap on it they haven't done anything themselves to show they could do better.

fact is, arthas came before jailer. creating a new character and saying he came before doesnt change the fact that the character was created later.

and that comparison with the parents doesnt stick at all, because the parents did ACTUALLY come before the child. the jailer however, did not. he was created after arthas. we didn't just "meet him later", he was literally created by the writers and designers a decade later.

and about the writing: nobody needs to be a writer to recognize a bad storyline. want a good story? go read lord of the rings, to bring the obvious example. by your logic, WoW story is on the same level as LotR story as far as we are concerned, bc we arent writers.

[Xilurm]

There's the comment I knew that would come. Difference is the logic works the same and how do we know the Jailer wasn't even a thought in anyone's head?

The fact is Jailer creates Arthas. So why wouldn't the Jailer look almost exactly like Arthas?

Because they don't think of more than two expansions ahead. And as sure as hell they didn't think of the Jailer in 2003 when the Lich King was made, along with the Scourge and the Undead.

Infact, you know what? That whole Lich King, undead, northrend stuff is WAY too similar to the Night's King from the Song of Ice and Fire. So that's definitelly where Metzen got the idea.

[Mehrunes]

I don't know why people think Sylvanas will survive the expansion. She's clearly going to feel so guilty she suicide bombs Zovaal or something.

Character was mind-controlled/corrupted =/= character is free from consequences.

What were the consequences for Kerrigan again? Oh, right, ascendance to godhood. And she still got to hook up with the love of her life.

[geco]

It's the double twist up.
Sylvanas gets back to being a high elf and joins the Alliance after saving Anduin, and everything is pardoned, as Dickmann said.

It takes a particular kind of courage to take a whole character arc and invalidate it to this level, Danuser has to be commended for this.

The Alliance wants to kill her and the Horde loses its second most iconic character if it isn't the first.

[GR8GODZILLAGOD]

There's the comment I knew that would come. Difference is the logic works the same and how do we know the Jailer wasn't even a thought in anyone's head?

The fact is Jailer creates Arthas. So why wouldn't the Jailer look almost exactly like Arthas?

The comment that had the reasonable thought process you thought would come, came, yes.

"Dinosaurs aren't real but just wait until the inevitable comment comes and tells me they are".

No, the logic doesn't work the same because, yeah, real life, humans can't exist without parents. Arthas was created and existed for almost two decades before the jailer was.

[starstationprofm]

What were the consequences for Kerrigan again? Oh, right, ascendance to godhood. And she still got to hook up with the love of her life.

Why would Kerrigan get consequences? She was a victim from Star Craft 1.

[Jackstraw]

Just because we see Arthas first doesn't change anything. That would be the same thing as saying you meet a guy/girl and see what they look like then later on you meet their parents and notice they look almost exactly the same. By your logic in this case the parents would be knockoff because you met them last, despite we know that the parents indeed did come first. Exact same principle in this case. Of course though, I'll be told that's different because it's "common sense" or something and it's real life which isn't altered by artists.

Now, I'm not saying the story is amazing or anything, but I always find it funny when people want to do nothing but talk crap on it they haven't done anything themselves to show they could do better.

There's a sizable difference between me meeting my ex's parents and noticing a striking resemblance with her father, and an entire zone and villain design being an iteration of something created in 2003.
We can discuss it all we want, but ICC and Arthas have been created when Zovaal wasn't even remotely in the books. And Anduin can be Arthas-but-teal all he wants, it still doesnt' change the facts.

And about the writing, even without going off of one's personal achievements it's enough to compare what we currently have to what we had in the past. The writing took a nosedive for a number of reasons, maybe budget ones, maybe not. But all it takes is eyes to see.

[Sangris]

So, does anything (for Blizzard's standards) noteworthy happen after the cinematic or does it just end there with everyone standing around and the quest ending, only to be continued in 10 months or so when the next patch releases?

also @Lucetia and @GR8GODZILLAGOD

Your discussion is kinda pointless since one of you is talking from an in-universe perspective and the other one from a meta-perspective. Everyone knows Arthas' design was there first and the Jailer's design is obviously and blatantly copied from it. In-universe it's the other way around.

[Mehrunes]

Why would Kerrigan get consequences? She was a victim from Star Craft 1.

1. Read the post I was replying to.
2. By her own admission in the SC2 comics she was in control of her actions as the Queen of Blades.

[Jackstraw]

The Alliance wants to kill her and the Horde loses its second most iconic character if it isn't the first.

The third, most likely. Cairne got killed off screen.

Sylvanas at this point is just a shell of a character. I'd have hoped for her to exit stage, but alas the butchering continues.

[Life-Binder]

Why would Kerrigan get consequences? She was a victim from Star Craft 1.

Sylvanas is a victim from WC3