Recent writing has been dubbed "the worst ever" by the community & mainstream media

[Rustedsaint]

After we let Grom off the hook for the whole WoD shit when he cried “Drenor is free” I lost all faith in the storyline

[Biomega]

WoW has the same problem a lot of popular franchises have: their storytelling bows to the generic, middle-of-the-road, trope-laden median that treats stories as nothing but products. They never take chances, they never have consequences, they simply serve as a tool to advance the underlying merchandise (whatever that may be).

It's an insult to the characters' intelligence if they have to behave like moronic twist-machines who exist only to deliver chapter-appropriate dialogue; but even more worryingly, it's an insult to the PLAYERS' intelligence because we're treated like imbeciles who couldn't handle some actual gut-wrenching moments or dire consequences to storyline actions.

No, we apparently can only be trusted with monumentally stupid characters who are deeply surprised that the omni-evil overlord they've been helping overthrow the order of the universe would then seek to establish his own order; a leap of logic so boundlessly moronic it's only rivaled by the comically stereotypical idiocy of said villain in allowing the heroes a reprieve, even reinforcement (by effectively giving Sylvanas back to them). Because that's never come back to bite anyone in the ass.

Do they honestly think we WANT such storytelling, or are they so deluded and out of touch with their players and themselves that they think any step off the Dinsey-fied path of least storytelling resistance would spell doom for their IP?

[Soon-TM]

After we let Grom off the hook for the whole WoD shit when he cried “Drenor is free” I lost all faith in the storyline

How about "The Shadowlands are free!!11!!"? As Illidan famously said, You Are Not Prepared™

[TEHPALLYTANK]

It doesn't seem as bad as WoD. I mean I wouldn't call the lore of SL good, but I also wouldn't say it is "the worst ever".

[deenman]

IMO TBC was by far the most fucked up writing any WoW expansion had ever. Notables killed off for hell knows what right and left, merely a setback and the whole cringe with Illidan. It had great moments too, but overall it was a bloody mess.

not to mention killing almost titan like beings of power in random low lvl quests or a 5 man dungeon

[Susanoo]

I dislike the Shadowlands story because I think the Afterlife in RPG games should be left untouched. So many cultures on Azeroth have their own beliefs about what happens after death. Are our characters suppose to go back and basically say "Well if you do bad shit you are going to go to Revendreath for penance."

[Volardelis]

My main issue is how Blizzard is retconning old lore to make it so that the Jailer was behind it all instead of building up his character within Shadowlands itself. It is a shame too that some characters like Kel'thuzad have to suffer some character assassinations just so evil Jiren can feel like this overwhelming presence that has been playing a far longer long game than N'zoth.

Does it really add to Kel'thuzads character knowing that he was in league with Zovaal from day 1, possibly even before he was contacted by Ner'zhul? Kel'thuzad was curious about necromancy and that was what made him a potential minion for the Lich King. He ran out of Naxx feeling disgusted at what he saw was going on in there, but by that point it was too late. Sailing to Northrend sealed the deal, so he had to climb up the Frozen Spire naked and pledged his loyalty to Ner'zhul. I guess that was all an act now. The bromance he had with Arthas after Arthas fell to the scourge? Gone. All an act. Such a major moment for their relationship when Arthas calls him a friend in WC3 TFT. Kel'thuzad was serving the Lich King and by extension Arthas willingly.

But I guess building up a bland grey generic evil guy through retcons was more important.

[Graeham]

As far as I'm concerned most of the writers are hacks, especially the third party ones brought in from outside the company.

Many characters are encased in ridiculous amounts of plot armour and/are written in a way that is completely at odds with how they were written in previous expansions.

The Horde and Alliance conflict continues to make no real sense. At some point, at least some of the races within each faction would realistically throw up their hands and announce that they're going their own way instead of repeating a laughable cycle of being screwed over not only by their enemies but some of their own allies as well.

[Dristereau]

I'd forgotten about 'Draenor is free' honestly

I remember having some massive hate towards WOD with the time travel/alternate universe stuff but in the end felt it's levelling zones and general story was good until Hellfire Citadel (Obviously RIP Raid Tier, might have not been as 180 as Grom was). Also honestly ended up liking the return in BFA with the Tyranny of the Light. I felt Legion was really cool, Illidan bringing Argus close to Azeroth at the end of Tomb of Sargeras was a big wow moment, that was very cool for me. Suramar was highly rated and really developed the Nightborne.

I don't actually mind BFA story that much, Jaina's return to Kul Tiras was decent and the return of the fleet was a very cool cinematic. Horde vs Alliance is expected, Battle for Dazar'Alor was a really nice idea and development of the Tidesage on Horde.

I think ultimately for me Sylvanas is the biggest problem. I don't really get what she's trying to do, or achieve, or why. Originally she was after vengeance against Arthas, then rebuilding her people and by the end of BFA doesn't care a bit about her people. She's been serving the Jailer, despite 'I will never serve' for 15 minutes against us for the Jailer and post WotLK we're lead to believe.

Also we're dealing with the realm of death, which makes it not feel normal. Nearly all other expansions are Azeroth based on steeped in Lore solid enough to tie to that place. Shadowlands feels very disconnected from everything we've done before.

I'm still curious where we go still. They're still holding their ace (Arthas) who will undoubtedly show up before 10.0

[cparle87]

By WoW standards, I think Shadowlands is pretty good on the story side of things, probably second to Legion. By non-WoW standards, particularly compared to non-MMO single player story games, honestly WoW has always been pretty pathetic.

I also love the ego that social media gurus and the 1% of the playerbase that are obsessed enough to come onto or even know about the existence of these forums constitutes "the playerbase."

[KrayZ33]

Well, the storytelling in WoW has always been garbage.
The overall story arc however is decent enough imho.

It's just that the game has a hard time telling that story because they simply don't connect the playercharacter with the story at all. So whatever I did in Legion, has basically no meaning.
Without the books, you are pretty much left alone.
Especially with everything about Sylvanas - but it's not like that's new.

I can imagine, most people probably don't even understand what the Jailer has done to Sylvanas at the end of the raid when he crushed that "crystal". They might explain it more properly later... but that will take another 6 months or so. In the meantime, it will just feel like shit.

[Firefall]

Shadowlands isn't the problem. BFA retconning from Wrath onwards is the problem. I think the Shadowlands expansion has done the story as well as possible from where BFA left it. I don't think BFA should've left it like this though. Heck that one popular leak with the picture of Stormwind Harbor had a better plot.

[Raven]

Sorry but are PCgamer and 2 streamers / youtubers supposed to be mainstream media ?

[Gaidax]

It's just that the game has a hard time telling that story because they simply don't connect the playercharacter with the story at all.

...

I can imagine, most people probably don't even understand what the Jailer has done to Sylvanas at the end of the raid when he crushed that "crystal". They might explain it more properly later... but that will take another 6 months or so. In the meantime, it will just feel like shit.

This IMO, is one single biggest issue with the whole thing.

Blizzard unnecessarily draws out the "mystery" and withholds much of information that players by now should have had plainly available to have a clear picture of what is going on. This in turn results in players exclaiming "what is this shit" and biting Blizzard in its ass.

Blizz really need to stop with their shitty "NPC drops half a line with half reveal and half the context", it was fun with Ilgynoth, but they really need to stop making every bloody other NPC Ilgynoth.

It's like Devos in the Spires of Ascension who keeps dropping about all these lines about how Jailer suffered injustice and how his cause is true, well fudge, why not just tell us what exactly happened on 500 occasions she and her followers could???

It's cool to have a mystery or two, but not everything should be a bloody stumbling in the dark like helpless kittens without a clue.

[Syegfryed]

i baffles me that people see this sylvanas fanfic redemption arc as "decent" or even "good", with the "i will never serve" after 2 expansions "serving"

[Gaidax]

i baffles me that people see this sylvanas fanfic redemption arc as "decent" or even "good", with the "i will never serve" after 2 expansions "serving"

Oh, that one is easy to explain, for some reason beyond me she thought she was equal stakes partner with Jailer. Which, IMO, is a bunch of baloney, given the circumstances, insane power level difference and her supposedly being smarter than that.

[Syegfryed]

Oh, that one is easy to explain, for some reason beyond me she thought she was equal stakes partner with Jailer. Which, IMO, is a bunch of baloney, given the circumstances, insane power level difference and her supposedly being smarter than that.

Thats one of the reasons why this arc is hot garbage, is beyond common sense or logic with the previous established characters, Bfa had the same problem, one easy example is how they distort Saurfang into a crying orc that have to be taught honor by a human kid.

Like you said earlier, Blizzard witers now are fan of edgy one liners, as long it sounds cool or edgy is fine.

I still remember the throw away line out of nowhere, that lead to nowhere in bfa when they saved baine, it was like "mulgore will burn" or some shit, we were like ??????????, but it was just meaningless.

[VinceVega]

I don't even think the story itself is that bad... it is just so freaking annoying that nothing gets resolved since the beginning of BfA.

Every patch you get a really small lore cinematic that answers nothing and just throws another "twist" at you with more questions attached. And overall the lore is just so.... nothing? No thread ever gets resolved. Its always only 2-3 characters who do anything the rest, including us, are just.... there. Hundreds of characters...a dn they use nearly no one.
Everything that has happend lorewise in wow since the start of SL should have happen in the first patch.

But yes... the jailor not outwright killing us is stupid. Why wouldn't he? He was able to. We have been standing right in front of him.

[dfsdfvh]

And why would you put punish under quotes? He literally leaves her two feet away at the mercy of three people that want her dead. Also, now she will be tormented by all the horrible stuff she has done. People generally loved the soul split/personality change from Uther.

Also, I fail to see any evidence that Sylvanas will get a redemption, people are outraging themselves in advance lol.

Anyway, no matter how SL ends, Bastion Afterlives cinematic alone is one of the best pieces of WoW story i have ever seen. To mee, that video was perfect, and i still get goosebumps when i revisit it. Revendreth and Arden were also really cool, Maldraxxus one a little less.

I generally liked how Blizzard envisioned SL as a WoW afterlife, i really liked the structure and the zones. I also applaud them from actually creating new lore and stepping into the unknown.

For the main story plot, I am curious. It is not excellent, but it is not trash. I think many people are too emotionally invested in some chars and prone to outrage if the story didn't fit their narrative.

But the point is, will we just outright kill her? No. Will she show regret and join us against the Jailer? Yes. And that my friend, its called "Redemption".

[Pheraz]

WoW has the same problem a lot of popular franchises have: their storytelling bows to the generic, middle-of-the-road, trope-laden median that treats stories as nothing but products. They never take chances, they never have consequences, they simply serve as a tool to advance the underlying merchandise (whatever that may be).

It's an insult to the characters' intelligence if they have to behave like moronic twist-machines who exist only to deliver chapter-appropriate dialogue; but even more worryingly, it's an insult to the PLAYERS' intelligence because we're treated like imbeciles who couldn't handle some actual gut-wrenching moments or dire consequences to storyline actions.

No, we apparently can only be trusted with monumentally stupid characters who are deeply surprised that the omni-evil overlord they've been helping overthrow the order of the universe would then seek to establish his own order; a leap of logic so boundlessly moronic it's only rivaled by the comically stereotypical idiocy of said villain in allowing the heroes a reprieve, even reinforcement (by effectively giving Sylvanas back to them). Because that's never come back to bite anyone in the ass.

Do they honestly think we WANT such storytelling, or are they so deluded and out of touch with their players and themselves that they think any step off the Dinsey-fied path of least storytelling resistance would spell doom for their IP?

The style of the game is amazing. The artists drawing those worlds and characters and animations are really really good. I think this carries a lot. This also carries the story writers which only think about X moments that would be "cool". LIke... "Wouldn't it be cool if Sylvanas suddenly starts fighting the Jailor? And then he grabs her arrow without looking to it?"
I think the cinematics are the worst part. As many have written those constant cliff hangers and twists are annoying. Maybe a little bit hope left ("you can not kill hope" ) is that it was worse once (WoD) and got better after (legion). So maybe they are indeed still able to see their crap and come up with something less annoying still satisfying their shareholders