FFXIV Spoiler thread

[Merie]

Does anyone remember in 5.3 when Aliesae was getting headaches? I thought for sure that was a precursor to the sound but it's like it never went anywhere.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Does anyone remember in 5.3 when Aliesae was getting headaches? I thought for sure that was a precursor to the sound but it's like it never went anywhere.

Yeah, Y'shtola and Urianger heard it too. I guess it really was nothing more than just the distance between their body and soul, though it's strange that it was expressed in a very different way than Thancred's manifestation of it.

[KrayZ33]

So... I finally got around playing the trials and while gearing up my toon I noticed how fun it is that Zodiark uses Lightning and Flame attacks, which are the elements most commonly found in an Astral state.
And Hydaelyn uses water and ice, earth, which are most commonly found in an Umbral state.

Aside from their Light/Darkness stuff of course.
These details are amazing, considering they could've used fire attacks on both and no one would've bat an eye.

Didn't come to mind when I did the MSQ at least.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

One more day until we get... the first part of a raid storyline featuring teenage Elidibus... with Matt Stokoe's deep old man voice. *Shudders*

[Drindorai]

Does anyone remember in 5.3 when Aliesae was getting headaches? I thought for sure that was a precursor to the sound but it's like it never went anywhere.

The Scions on the First getting weak and clutching their head -- or passing out like Y'shtola does -- was a sign of the connection between their soul and body growing weaker. Basically a warning sign that they don't have much time left to get back to the Source. Thancred collapses off screen, Y'shtola passes out and then is captured by Elidibus, Alisaie gets lightheaded. I think Urianger has some moment that I'm not remembering too. The only one I don't clearly remember having a moment like that was Alphinaud.

- - - Updated - - -

So... I finally got around playing the trials and while gearing up my toon I noticed how fun it is that Zodiark uses Lightning and Flame attacks, which are the elements most commonly found in an Astral state.
And Hydaelyn uses water and ice, earth, which are most commonly found in an Umbral state.

Aside from their Light/Darkness stuff of course.
These details are amazing, considering they could've used fire attacks on both and no one would've bat an eye.

Yeah it's a super neat touch that a lot of people won't even put together unless it's pointed out to them, shows that the teams really are all working on one wavelength in terms of story, music, and even battle elements.

[Cosmic Janitor]

The Scions on the First getting weak and clutching their head -- or passing out like Y'shtola does -- was a sign of the connection between their soul and body growing weaker. Basically a warning sign that they don't have much time left to get back to the Source. Thancred collapses off screen, Y'shtola passes out and then is captured by Elidibus, Alisaie gets lightheaded. I think Urianger has some moment that I'm not remembering too. The only one I don't clearly remember having a moment like that was Alphinaud.

Urianger shows having headaches as well, most memorable one was during his jesus trial when walking on the lake. I'm honestly shocked how anyone didn't make the connection with the obvious "the time is running out" plot.

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah, Y'shtola and Urianger heard it too. I guess it really was nothing more than just the distance between their body and soul, though it's strange that it was expressed in a very different way than Thancred's manifestation of it.

Thankred's case was just way more progressed than the other's, because he was summoned considerably earlier than them and he was always more fucked up since his little stint as an ascian, maybe.

[Katchii]

The Scions on the First getting weak and clutching their head -- or passing out like Y'shtola does -- was a sign of the connection between their soul and body growing weaker. Basically a warning sign that they don't have much time left to get back to the Source. Thancred collapses off screen, Y'shtola passes out and then is captured by Elidibus, Alisaie gets lightheaded. I think Urianger has some moment that I'm not remembering too. The only one I don't clearly remember having a moment like that was Alphinaud.

He falls in the water as he's walking towards the island whale thing, due to a little headache.

But yes, it has nothing to do with the sound, it's their souls connection with their body waning and them seeing the effects in the First.

[Tojara]

So... I finally got around playing the trials and while gearing up my toon I noticed how fun it is that Zodiark uses Lightning and Flame attacks, which are the elements most commonly found in an Astral state.
And Hydaelyn uses water and ice, earth, which are most commonly found in an Umbral state.

Aside from their Light/Darkness stuff of course.
These details are amazing, considering they could've used fire attacks on both and no one would've bat an eye.

Didn't come to mind when I did the MSQ at least.

It's not even that. When she does her mantle swap during the trial she uses the exact same "jobs" as she uses during her duty. Venat being an all-rounder assumes three jobs during the trust, all of which are the ones she swaps to in both the trial and the duty encounter you have with her during Elpis. Obviously you fight Emet in Shadowbringers, but his roles in that dungeon if you do it as a trust is DRK and BLM.

Elemental wheel thing aside, I'm pretty sure it's mentioned during the Eden raid series when Ryne assumes the role of Shiva that she can handle it considering how attuned to light she is (Ice being so closely linked to Light).

It obviously wouldn't have mattered much if either of the bosses fired of spells from other elements though. I think the coolest thing about the second trial was more or less the job swaps and how they're completely synced with the jobs she generally used while she was an ancient (paladin, dancer, white mage). Zodiark using ice wouldn't be that odd considering BLM uses those skills, and I don't think anybody associated a BLM with being light attuned.

[KrayZ33]

It's not even that. When she does her mantle swap during the trial she uses the exact same "jobs" as she uses during her duty. Venat being an all-rounder assumes three jobs during the trust, all of which are the ones she swaps to in both the trial and the duty encounter you have with her during Elpis. Obviously you fight Emet in Shadowbringers, but his roles in that dungeon if you do it as a trust is DRK and BLM.

Elemental wheel thing aside, I'm pretty sure it's mentioned during the Eden raid series when Ryne assumes the role of Shiva that she can handle it considering how attuned to light she is (Ice being so closely linked to Light).

It obviously wouldn't have mattered much if either of the bosses fired of spells from other elements though. I think the coolest thing about the second trial was more or less the job swaps and how they're completely synced with the jobs she generally used while she was an ancient (paladin, dancer, white mage). Zodiark using ice wouldn't be that odd considering BLM uses those skills, and I don't think anybody associated a BLM with being light attuned.

I found that thing with the jobs to be way more obvious though - almost to the point not worth mentioning, even if it's a nice touch (just like how she looks similar to how she looked as an ancient), especially since there was that fight with her beforehand, which is why I thought the element thing is a detail that is worth pointing out more and wouldn't matter all that much if it wasn't followed, yet, it is extremely consistent with the overall lore and worldbuilding established in the previous expansions (and not just the previous 2-3 hours) - especially Shadowbringers.

As for the elements themselves, each and every one of them has the Astral and Umbral version of it, so they could have used both each. But they didn't to emphazise on the Umbral/Astral attunement each of them have, probably.

[Lane]

Seems like they're holding fast to what the WoL does in the past are the building blocks for the current future based on the raid storyline. I still don't understand the rationale (and am not a fan of the bootstrap paradox). We haven't seen any alternate futures, so there's no way to appreciate the current one not knowing any differently. Going back to the past to help with Pandemonium when they're however long away from the Final Days doesn't feel meaningful either. Unless there's a major twist I think a lot of people are going to be disappointed in not being able to save the Ancients (again).

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Yeah, it also doesn't help that the time loops have had... less than satisfactory endings. G'raha going back into the past resulted in the creation of a new timeline, so the prior one is still screwed but we didn't get to see it. And then Emet got mind wiped so he forgot the WoL at Elpis (whereas it would have been more satisfactory if there was clever obfuscation at work, like the heroes in Chrono Trigger doing the body swap, or the time loop in Thunderbolt Fantasy where the time travel was just done out of sight, hence why there was no paradox). I'm guessing Elidibus is going to get whacked on the head which causes him to forget the WoL.

[Graeham]

I have mixed feelings. I'm generally not a fan of time travel since it's rarely handled well and all too conveniently benefits the protagonists in a way that leads to no meaningful losses for their side. The game keeps insisting that everything is a matter of perspective, that everybody is just fighting for what they believe in and yet it can't seem to ever really give even the more sympathetic antagonists a happy ending.

[Lane]

I love questing alongside the antagonists from ShB, but they're not antagonists yet in the time of Elpis. It could be argued that the WoL is the villian in their tale, as Emet said in ShB. We not only know they're doomed to suffer horrific fates, we're actively trying not to change the timeline to preserve the present which is highly morally questionable.

Not only that, but if they keep with the bootstrap paradox then it also makes the WoL responsible for everything that happened after Elpis. We are the ones who gave Venat the playbook to the future. She knew we had to be 8x rejoined, so she created double the amount of shards than necessary knowing they would be lost to the Ascians. Emet, Elidibus, and Lahabrea may have only escaped the sundering because we told her they did and she spared them (it'll be interesting if anything in Pandemonium suggests otherwise).

The cynic in me says it was crafted this way to give the WoL 'disposable' friends for emotional manipulation since the Scions are untouchable. I'm concerned about Azem's involvement with Pandemonium because I don't like the possible implication that they would know about the WoL, their future sundered self, and not actively revolt against what caused them into being given that it resulted in the death of one of their best friends, 12k years of torment for the other, not to mention the end of their civilization. Were they the Scions the WoL would be fighting tooth and nail to prevent that from happening.

[Dakhath]

Yeah, it also doesn't help that the time loops have had... less than satisfactory endings. G'raha going back into the past resulted in the creation of a new timeline, so the prior one is still screwed but we didn't get to see it. And then Emet got mind wiped so he forgot the WoL at Elpis (whereas it would have been more satisfactory if there was clever obfuscation at work, like the heroes in Chrono Trigger doing the body swap, or the time loop in Thunderbolt Fantasy where the time travel was just done out of sight, hence why there was no paradox). I'm guessing Elidibus is going to get whacked on the head which causes him to forget the WoL.

I believe one of the stories says that in the doomed timeline, Midgardsomr wakes up and leads them to a brighter future.

[SkyTides]

Just finished MSQ last night...

While I could write an essay I'll just do a brief thoughts on story:
It was a very emotional story with a sound message - like others said it really crammed a lot in.
I enjoyed the teasing with how the patch would end. A part of me is a little disappointed though that we didn't get to all go on the ark to a new world though!
Elpis and Garlemald were my favorite zones.
My boys in Elpis were the best characters, Venat was also cool

For the negatives - The threat of the final days didn't really play out in game too well. We had some cool chaos in Radzt-at-Han but I was expecting cities to be reduced to ashes and fire in the sky everywhere. Also during the 'downtime' sections everyone seems just a bit too happy and chilled out considering the world is about to end at any moment. Surely people would have been going crazy with panic...

Zenos felt pretty wasted - his character didn't seem to really go anywhere. He's just a battle obsessed wanderer with no friends... And I didn't get to have his scythe

Moon bunnys- while it was cute and quaint this section of game was way too long with tons of fetch quests in an enormous, mostly empty building.

The satrap kid absolutely gives me the creeps - even after we know who he is *shudder*

Overall it was pretty good. I hope in the patches we get started exploring other areas, as is there anything really left for us to do in the current situation?

[CalamityHeart]

As far as Pandemonium goes, what I'm mostly interested in is just learning more about the setting of Elpis, the Convocation, and potentially Lahabrea, which has already started to pay off a little bit. The whole bootstrap paradox and the issue/non-issue of our interfering with the past theoretically preserving the present, I've let fly completely over my head. It doesn't matter; my Warrior of Light and I are just there to sate our curiosity. Besides, my understanding of the matter is that in the absence of our interference, Pandemonium just ends up getting closed off from the rest of reality and left to rot in its own little pocket space, like Themis said would happen. And I'm assuming that's what's going to end up happening in some kind of way by the end, considering that history tries at least somewhat to preserve itself and resist interference. My guess is that the Final Days will end up causing another irreparable incident in Pandemonium, and that's when it's actually considered a lost cause and severed off, instead of whatever we're doing now.

[Stormspark]

Holy crap, I just unlocked The Dead Ends. This game just made RP WALKING UP A STAIRCASE 1000x more impactful than the entire story of Shadowlands (granted that's a low bar because that "story" had zero impact).

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Did the ranged DPS - Doma rolequest. Spoilered for length.

Spoiler: 

Even though the old lady's claim of being able to commune with the dead is bullocks, it is rather interesting that the characters are just straight up saying "communing with the dead is bad", even though that is objectively possible with people being able to visit the aetherial sea and visit people's souls. In FFX, people visited the Farplane to see departed loved ones again, or at least determine whether or not someone is still alive.




My gosh he shaved his head!




He became some sort of Shinto priest or Buddhist monk?




Nice of the Kami to be watching out for us.

Well, it wasn't very exciting, but I do appreciate that the people didn't drop their hard feelings overnight. Also appreciated that Hien had a spine and just straight up said "no" to a request.

I was hoping that maybe there would be a chance that Gosetsu trust, but he went off on a pilgrimage, not to go adventuring, so... I doubt it.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Btw, I'm curious, can you really ignore the final Battle with Zenos? I figured I would humor him, but did anyone try what happens if you don't?

[Drindorai]

Btw, I'm curious, can you really ignore the final Battle with Zenos? I figured I would humor him, but did anyone try what happens if you don't?

You can't, which I guess is where some people are upset about the very end of the expansion, including Bellular.

I personally came around to Zenos by the time that moment came. Until then I was pretty apathetic to him as a villain but by the time he shows up just at the end, they managed to make me come around to the feeling of, "Alright Zenos, you bitch, I'll give you the fight you want" and I really liked the end of it where he seems to waver on the idea of him just wanting to fight you being his only wish.

It both felt separate to the main story of Hermes/Meteion and "What is life worth living for?" question the game poses while also still addressing it from Zenos' end. Because, at least to me, it came off as Zenos ending up questioning that very thing and before he can finish the answer for himself, you teleport away and he dies. As if he was so sure of it the entire time but once he achieved it, it almost felt as if he was left feeling hollow when really analyzing it. And he doesn't get a happy ending or anything, he just is left on him saying, "I..." and then dying.

That's just how I interpreted it though, based on playing the rest of the franchise my entire life and seeing the themes they like to toss out toward the ends of the games.