Russian invasion of Ukraine

[beanman12345]

So I guess Putin has finally given his war speech after spending months making NATO more united then ever.

[Elegiac]

So I guess Putin has finally given his war speech after spending months making NATO more united then ever.

Yeah, that's the mystifying thing.

Prior to Putain getting sand in his vagina over Crimea, the trend in NATO was towards disarmament and demilitarization especially with US interests focused on the Middle East and then China. Thanks to him that trend has now reversed with the added bonus of every former Soviet Republic understanding it might be next on the chopping block.

[Ihavewaffles]

You are like Jon Snow We have russian: 8796 of them. Not much i know Much more people from Ukraine. But Putin just said that he want Imperium back. So also probably Poland. Maybe even part of Berlin like during ZSSR.

You have 13000 Russians, we in Bulgaria has almost three times that, 31679 Russians, yet you don't hear us crying like little girls "the Russians are gonna invade!!!1111oneone"
Maybe if you tried cooperation instead of confrontation? I mean you have no real reasons not to cooperate with Russia.

[Elegiac]

You have 13000 Russians, we in Bulgaria has almost three times that, 31679 Russians, yet you don't hear us crying like little girls "the Russians are gonna invade!!!1111oneone"

You do realise that y'all are included in the sphere that Putain believes to belong under Russian East Ukrainian sovereignty, right?

I mean you have no real reasons not to cooperate with Russia.

Aside from the fact its government is a corrupt and autocratic shitbox, you mean.

[Kreuger]

Yeah, that's the mystifying thing.

Prior to Putain getting sand in his vagina over Crimea, the trend in NATO was towards disarmament and demilitarization especially with US interests focused on the Middle East and then China. Thanks to him that trend has now reversed with the added bonus of every former Soviet Republic understanding it might be next on the chopping block.

Maybe Putin wants a unified and strong NATO. Having that card to play with his homecrowd, evil nato etc.
Just guessing though.

[Twdft]

Ah, i see, typical American educational failure in geography.

Not just the name, you have even drawn the map wrong - Crimea doesn't belong to Ukraine.

And soon, neither will Donbass.

Looks like the original Shlacker dude went home for the night and turned the account over to you again. I liked him better, he is at least somewhat sane and only works in your troll farm to make a living. You however actually believe your warmongering propaganda.

[Ihavewaffles]

You do realise that y'all are included in the sphere that Putain believes to belong under Russian East Ukrainian sovereignty, right?

We are in the Balkans, Ukraine is not in the Balkans, what are your geography skills, man??

Aside from the fact its government is a corrupt and autocratic shitbox, you mean.

You claim that, yet support a coup n accept a very corrupt government in kiev that tramples on every law known to man.

[zEmini]

I don't understand how you can't believe it when you live in a country that's been invading other countries left and right.

Awe look deflection, basically that is made when you do not have any argument. You lost. Try again

Looks like the original Shlacker dude went home for the night and turned the account over to you again. I liked him better, he is at least somewhat sane and only works in your troll farm to make a living. You however actually believe your warmongering propaganda.

Rofls. Yah i have him on ignore, it is always nice too see all the gaps in the threads.

[Flarelaine]

Ukraine's interests were best served by following Minsk agreement. Noone ever proposed any better deal. That would get them Donbass back and territorial integrity restored, and everyone could go on with "business as usual"

There is not a word in the Minsk agreement about Crimea, so there goes Ukraine's territorial integrity, Additionally, that agreement also messes heavily with Ukraine's sovereignty.

[Easo]

Donbas has reports of huge vehicle movements. Obvious guess by everyone is that Russian troops are entering to ensure the new status.

As for the border question - well, recongition is supposedly for current borders, not the original regional ones. Then again - both "republics" have it in their, erm, constitutions that their borders ARE the regional ones - aka Russia, help us!

P.S.
Elegiac, the East Ukraine is as dumb term as West Taiwan. Let's not scoop to their level...

[alkyd]

Awe look deflection, basically that is made when you do not have any argument. You lost. Try again

Except you didn't make any argument to deflect. I was simply questioning your inability to believe, not your arguments, whatever they are.

[Elegiac]

Maybe Putin wants a unified and strong NATO. Having that card to play with his homecrowd, evil nato etc.
Just guessing though.

Nah, I think you have the right of it.

The domestic indicators for Russia East Ukraine's near future in terms of the economy and social stability aren't good. They, like a lot of countries, suffer from an aging population. They suffer from high rates of brain drain and capital flight, they're still massively reliant on selling an energy resource which other countries are actively turning away from due to climate change, and much of what they invest in trying to build up alternative economic sectors gets eaten up by corruption. This is why they rely so heavily on cyberattacks and data theft; the millions they steal from the West is one of their few steady revenue streams.

Putain and his cronies are well aware of this ticking time bomb, and they need something to distract the public from it and to justify the economic hardships - i.e. war. You get to blame half the hardships on "the enemy" while the other half are justified as wartime rationing, and people don't get it into their heads that they should push for something as silly as democracy or limited government because national security.

If this sort of strategy sounds familiar... Well, Orwell put it best.

The war, therefore, if we judge it by the standards of previous wars, is merely an imposture. It is like the battles between certain ruminant animals whose horns are set at such an angle that they are incapable of hurting one another. But though it is unreal it is not meaningless. It eats up the surplus of consumable goods, and it helps to preserve the special mental atmosphere that a hierarchical society needs.

[Elegiac]

We are in the Balkans

Y'all don't seem to remember that the Soviet Sphere extended there.

You claim that, yet support a coup n accept a very corrupt government in kiev that tramples on every law known to man.

Which should be telling as to how much worse Putain's government is.

[Gaidax]

Donbas has reports of huge vehicle movements. Obvious guess by everyone is that Russian troops are entering to ensure the new status.

As for the border question - well, recongition is supposedly for current borders, not the original regional ones. Then again - both "republics" have it in their, erm, constitutions that their borders ARE the regional ones - aka Russia, help us!

P.S.
Elegiac, the East Ukraine is as dumb term as West Taiwan. Let's not scoop to their level...

I just wonder if it will be considered "minor incursion" in the end.

I have a feeling it will be like Crimea - mild sanctions that did not prevent or do anything really, just to put a token checkmark "we responded".

[Kreuger]

Nah, I think you have the right of it.

The domestic indicators for Russia East Ukraine's near future in terms of the economy and social stability aren't good. They, like a lot of countries, suffer from an aging population. They suffer from high rates of brain drain and capital flight, they're still massively reliant on selling an energy resource which other countries are actively turning away from due to climate change, and much of what they invest in trying to build up alternative economic sectors gets eaten up by corruption. This is why they rely so heavily on cyberattacks and data theft; the millions they steal from the West is one of their few steady revenue streams.

Putain and his cronies are well aware of this ticking time bomb, and they need something to distract the public from it and to justify the economic hardships - i.e. war. You get to blame half the hardships on "the enemy" while the other half are justified as wartime rationing.

If this sort of strategy sounds familiar... Well, Orwell put it best.

yea, a old and proven move by dicators sadly.
The incoming sanctions from EU/USA will play into his hands regarding this, but they need to happen either way.

shit day

[Ihavewaffles]

U should really read some polish - russian history. Start with this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre
Putin said today that he want Imperium back. So probably he will try conquer sooner or later Poland. Not work with Poland but attack us and do typicall russian stuff like rape and murder.

You sound like a cartoon...maybe you should look at the present n not crying about communism that is gone

[zEmini]

Except you didn't make any argument to deflect. I was simply questioning your inability to believe, not your arguments, whatever they are.

No you were deflecting my statement in a effort to form a argument against my statement. bye

[Logwyn]

I heard it said pretty well on NPR this morning.

Russia is effectively holding a gun to it's neighbors head. Even if they put the gun down right now and go home they still committed a crime already...

These people can't even play in the Olympics without constant bullshit. They cheat and scam on literally every level, why can't the world just fk up Russia and end this consistent nuisance and nonsense? They follow a different set of rules from the rest of the civilized world, and they don't even follow those lol.

How do you do that without a nuclear winter happening?

[Elegiac]

You sound like a cartoon...maybe you should look at the present n not crying about communism that is gone

Russia East Ukraine was busy brutalizing Poland and the Baltic Countries long before communism was even a thing.

As Kennan explained in Sources of Soviet Conduct, the attitudes aren't a function of socialism; they're a function of being Russian East Ukrainian.

[Shalcker]

There is not a word in the Minsk agreement about Crimea, so there goes Ukraine's territorial integrity, Additionally, that agreement also messes heavily with Ukraine's sovereignty.

Again, noone proposed any better agreement. How would you reintegrate breakaway provinces without any concessions? "Shell them until everyone leaves" that Ukraine seemed to prefer not being an option.

You could have Ukraine "We accept XX billions as compensation and drop our claim on Crimea", for example; Putin would easily agree.

But over last 8 years "new Ukraine" have proven to be incapable of honoring any agreements - including to the rest of the world like China.