Random Dungeon Finder - More Social Than You Think

[Crieve]

As a tank, I was very much looking forward to logging in, grabbing 3-4 guildies and using RDF to get an instant queue to a dungeon. I get the bonus reward for queuing as a tank (badges, gold, etc) and my guildies get a free instant queue. It’s exceptionally beneficial for everyone with guildies or friends that play together, particularly the DPS that usually sit around for hours or don’t do dungeons at all. Best part is when Timmy needs to go to bed at 9 PM, the 4 of you can queue up again and fill with a random instantly.

My best memories from original Wrath were actually doing exactly this with my guildies. I joined a progression guild at the start of ICC and no one knew me. Over the course of a weekend I had met and tanked for every person in that raid group using RDF and when I stepped into ICC for the first time with them on a Tuesday, everyone knew who I was and what my skillset was, etc.

Just because “RDF” has the word “random” in it, the only thing that’s actually random if you use it the right way is the dungeon that gets selected. But it can also be used as a tool for getting that last body you need to fill a dungeon group and even a tool for running around the world doing quests while waiting to be popped into one of those groups. It helps both spectrums of players! Those with friends and those without!

That’s what people coming from Retail hating the current Dungeon Finder need to realize. RDF in Wrath with a guild or a bunch of friends was literally the best experience ever. I still remember logging into my paladin tank in Dal and getting a whisper from non-guildie friends begging me to queue with their DPS mains for the instant queues. I can’t tell you how many friends I made that way since my non-guildie friends were usually grouped with 2-3 other players from our server waiting on a tank like me to login or join the queue!

My experience with LFG chat in TBC after Phase 2 has been extremely underwhelming and if it continues to be filled with boosters rather than players, I can’t see myself leveling all that many alts this time around. In original Wrath, I had 8 level 80s with full Heirloom gear after starting the expansion with only one character. I did A LOT of RDF. Bare in mind RDF wasn’t released until the start of ICC, so I did all of that in a year while also raiding at the highest level of available content for the time.

I should also mention that since RDF could be used during leveling, I used that opportunity to post the message “Hey everyone, this is my first time playing (so and so class), so if you have pointers, I’d love to hear about it.” Everyone in RDF was also leveling alts at the time, so people that mained those classes would just spew useful tips for playing the class/role I was playing in party/whisper. I think at least one time an RDF group just sat at the start of the instance (SFK) and posted helpful tips for everyone else. The tank would chime in “I’ve never pally tanked before”, well, there was my go-to thing. I had a macro for new pally tanks setup that I would post for the new pally tanks or a general tanking macro for the warriors/dks/druids.

The community in RDF was surprisingly helpful if you simply started a conversation. And new players see these interactions and would pick up the helpful tips that might be relevant to their class as well. It’s a win for everyone! Also it’s always a good thing to see engagement at low levels in dungeons among other players otherwise everyone expects everyone else to already play like professionals and when they don’t, they get sour. Wrath was the period for new players and is widely considered one of the most successful periods of socialization in the game’s history. Dare I say a lot of this can be attributed to the success of RDF.

To be honest when the Lead Classic Dev said there would be no RDF at all, I got up and walked away from the computer because I was in absolute shock to hear them say that. I would love to see it at launch, but I would understand 100% if it was delayed until a later phase since that would match the original timeline. I don’t know who the majority of the people they are talking to about this issue, but clearly those people didn’t play Wrath back then or are ignorant to the social benefits of its inclusion. I hope my post widens the viewpoints of those adamantly against RDF. I was against RDF for Classic and TBC as I wanted the experience to be as accurate to the original as possible, but Wrath was where it was introduced and at this stage of the game, the barrier to entry for new players wanting to experience Wrath is so high that the game is more likely to die than it is to thrive.

We suffered through the World Buff Meta thanks to #nochanges and I’ll be damned if we suffer Wrath without any RDF because of those same people are now spewing the opposite propaganda when it doesn’t suit them, or so they think. If you give Wrath RDF a chance, I promise you, you’ll regret not being pro-RDF the same way we all regret dealing with World Buffs all of Classic and not being able to play our main characters for most of the week.

My original post on the US WoW Forums can be found here: https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...-think/1227086
You can also add your opinion to the straw poll link, even if you disagree: https://strawpoll.com/polls/jVyGJaER1Z7

[Schmilblick]

It doesn't matter if it's more social or not, we are no more in 2005/2008, people want it for the sake of having easier access to game content and that's all what it matters.

https://strawpoll.com/polls/jVyGJaER1Z7

[Crieve]

It doesn't matter if it's more social or not, we are no more in 2005/2008, people want it for the sake of having easier access to game content and that's all what it matters.

I'm sorry, but... is that a bad thing? Being accessible is not a bad thing.

[Schmilblick]

I'm sorry, but... is that a bad thing? Being accessible is not a bad thing.

It's a VERY GOOD thing and I'm for RDF on launch.

[deenman]

This entire myth of mmo's as a social thing needs stop,this isnt 2001-2005 anymore,people dont play mmo's for the social aspect,its not a novelty anymore,people who want to socialize have facebook/grindr/youtube/etc

as an example i havent made a single friend in wow after maybe tbc by just randomly meeting someone,i made some in vanila that i still know today,but thats it....everyone else i met in my guild or befriended from another friend,these random social encounters out in the wild that spark everlasting friendships just dont happen like they used to

[Crieve]

This entire myth of mmo's as a social thing needs stop,this isnt 2001-2005 anymore,people dont play mmo's for the social aspect,its not a novelty anymore,people who want to socialize have facebook/grindr/youtube/etc

as an example i havent made a single friend in wow after maybe tbc by just randomly meeting someone,i made some in vanila that i still know today,but thats it....everyone else i met in my guild or befriended from another friend,these random social encounters out in the wild that spark everlasting friendships just dont happen like they used to

That's very sad and I'm sorry that your Classic experience hasn't netted you any lasting friendships so far. I hope that changes for you soon!

The primary reason why I wanted to draw attention to the social aspect that RDF provides was because there being a lack of social elements involved with RDF was explicitly listed by the developers as one of the reasons for leaving it out of Wrath, which is simply wrong.

[kranur]

The hypocrisy in some of the comments.
"Wrath was my favorite expansion, can't wait to play it again .. but you know ... without actually playing it because I played it in 2008"

[Schmilblick]

This entire myth of mmo's as a social thing needs stop,this isnt 2001-2005 anymore,people dont play mmo's for the social aspect,its not a novelty anymore,people who want to socialize have facebook/grindr/youtube/etc

Exactly this.

[Crieve]

The hypocrisy in some of the comments.
"Wrath was my favorite expansion, can't wait to play it again .. but you know ... without actually playing it because I played it in 2008"

Wrath was certainly my favorite expansion. Wrath, then Legion, then MoP (believe that or not!), and then everything else. I have certainly enjoyed playing Classic and TBC though, so I'd probably rank those experiences above MoP at this point.

[deenman]

That's very sad and I'm sorry that your Classic experience hasn't netted you any lasting friendships so far. I hope that changes for you soon!

The primary reason why I wanted to draw attention to the social aspect that RDF provides was because there being a lack of social elements involved with RDF was explicitly listed by the developers as one of the reasons for leaving it out of Wrath, which is simply wrong.

Im proly gonna play wrath classic,but ill play it with existing friends,and ofc i will look for a guild,but i will look for a guild for gameplay purposes not to find my soulmate :/ my point is that no1 plays mmo's these days specificaly for THAT,even people who ERP dont do that

[WaltherLeopold]

People are being very upset about a feature that shouldn't be in the game until the last wotlk classic phase.

Even if they didn't decide to ditch the system completely and introduce it to wotlk, we're still 10-12 months away (from launch) for it to be implemented. It's really strange to me that this is what makes them not play wotlk, when 76% of the game wouldn't have it to begin with.

[banelocky]

Yeah but ,,dps here, inv pls,, is the pinnacle of social interaction! Every day I have to do it in tbc classic for daily heroics brings me so much joy! Especially when I can't find a group for an hour and end up not playing at all that day!

On a serious note...Ye I completely agree. LFD brings with it way more positives than it does negatives. I think anyone that thinks otherwise is just straight wrong and also in the small minority. Especially if LFD comes with some changes like it coming in phase 2/3 or even ICC phase like it originally did and/or being only realm specific and/or not teleporting to the dungeon.

Personally I would like the feature unchanged and available at launch. But I do understand the appeal of forming groups and traveling to dungeons at the very start in phase 1 when the heroics are kind of fresh and not completely faceroll easy. So phase 2 would be fine...and ICC phase since it launched back then at the latest. Completely removing a major feature of WOTLK for the classic version is just ludicrous imo.

[deenman]

Exactly this.

There was more to elaborate on in actualy if people didnt fully understand

back then the social experience in mmo's was something that wasnt as easily found in other places,online games were more than just a game,in fact mmo's could even get away with being mediocre simply because it was a virtual facebook

these days people play games for the gameplay

[Crieve]

People are being very upset about a feature that shouldn't be in the game until the last phase and only be around for like 20% of wotlk classic.

Even if they didn't decide to ditch the system completely and introduce it to wotlk, we're still 10-12 months away (from launch) for it to be implemented.

Last phase, yes. However RDF was around for exactly half of the expansion. ICC lasted a full year and without RDF, it would have certainly died off a whole lot quicker than it did. Launch of Wrath Classic is actually closer to about 5-8 months away, based on current projections. All we're looking for is a retraction of the "No RDF" and a correction of "RDF in the phase where it makes sense to introduce it", which would be with ICC.

[WaltherLeopold]

Last phase, yes. However RDF was around for exactly half of the expansion. ICC lasted a full year and without RDF, it would have certainly died off a whole lot quicker than it did. Launch of Wrath Classic is actually closer to about 5-8 months away, based on current projections. All we're looking for is a retraction of the "No RDF" and a correction of "RDF in the phase where it makes sense to introduce it", which would be with ICC.

No, I meant that last phase of wotlk is slated to be 10-12 months away from the launch. I.e you'd go up to 12 months of not playing with RDF to begin with.

[Crieve]

No, I meant that last phase of wotlk is slated to be 10-12 months away from the launch. I.e you'd go up to 12 months of not playing with RFD to begin with.

If I knew that RDF would become available at that time, I'd feel a whole lot better about the whole of the expansion knowing that it was coming. A hard "No RDF" is a deal breaker for me though.

[WaltherLeopold]

If I knew that RDF would become available at that time, I'd feel a whole lot better about the whole of the expansion knowing that it was coming. A hard "No RDF" is a deal breaker for me though.

Sad. Just sounds like wotlk was never for you though.

[Crieve]

Sad. Just sounds like wotlk was never for you though.

I don't want to jump straight to pointing to the "10 year member" badge and then back at yours and then back to my account completion and then back to yours, but buddy, if you think Wrath of the Lich King would be anything like Wrath of the Lich King was back in the day without RDF, you're delusional.

[WaltherLeopold]

I don't want to jump straight to pointing to the "10 year member" badge and then back at yours and then back to my account completion and then back to yours, but buddy, if you think Wrath of the Lich King would be anything like Wrath of the Lich King was back in the day without RDF, you're delusional.

Yeah, because the date when either of us created our MMOC account has any bearing on anything. But sure i'll humour you;

[Crieve]

Yeah, because the date when either of us created our MMOC account has any bearing on anything. But sure i'll humour you;

Wrath of the Lich King was November 13, 2008 until the release of Cataclysm on December 7, 2010. Linking an image showing that you played Classic and TBC only tells me that you started playing the game before RDF and that you're likely older than I am, which I do not mean disrespectfully. If your only experience with RDF was in the Cataclysm era after not playing Wrath at all, then it wouldn't surprise me at all that you dislike RDF enough to not include it in Wrath. Raid Finder literally destroyed countless guilds. Dungeon Finder was the first step, but was not itself actually responsible for that chaos.