You dont have to project your LFR mentality and mechanics failing on to me mate. You can keep that all to yourself. If you dont optimize your character, you dont optimize your character its as simple as that.
You probably dont do m+ for bis trinkets either, or whatever else you can do to get more then 230 ilvl from ZM. Your mentality leads to 20-25 lower ilvl, less mastery of your character and much less impact in a lfr raid.
The gold it costs is completely prohibitive. I am thrilled that there won't be more in dragonflight.
Continuously ignoring what I write means your posts have no merit. We are in a thread discussing specifically legendary upgrades which cost a significant amount of gold, not overall optimization of a character or gearing mentality and gearing strategies, try to keep up and stick with the topic.
as pointed out and easily quantified for any spec/class, a legendary upgrade to 291 results in negligible upgrade which will not make a difference on a boss when you are failing mechanics as your failure is due to the inability to grasp and execute mechanics. I recommend that you attempt and refute that with actual arguments, rather than resorting to name-calling and baseless presumptions.
Last edited by Rozz; 2022-04-25 at 09:20 PM.
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Exactly this.
The first ones arriving and crafting legendaries are the ones already having big amounts of gold to buy the materials.
They then create the object and sell them, getting more gold that they use to buy the competition and resell it.
Eventually, they control the market, so you only can enter losing big amounts of money vending under cost.
There's no point in losing that money, better to use it to buy you legendaries and call it a day.
In the end, only the wealthy first arrivers made money with the system. Everyone else lose.
I kind of prefer the MoP and WoD legendary systems - where a given legendary is something you build and power up over time as you go through the story, with different tiers of power depending on your progression through the end-game content. Mix this with legendaries acquired as rare drops from tier bosses (e.g. the Azzinoth Warglaives, Thori'dal, etc.) and I'd say you have a decent mix. A legendary shouldn't be both obligatory and difficult to acquire, in my view - it should either be a baseline item acquirable with consistent but realistic effort or it should be an unexpected and cherished (but still non-obligatory) bonus from particularly difficult content.
"We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead
This. I didn't even bother just bought the slot item from the AH. Not remotely engaging.
I would also consider the Artifacts of Legion that kind of "have it through the entire expansion and build the strength of it". Even more interesting than the WoD or MoP leggos just because of the visible gear. The WoD ring was underwhelming in that regard.
Last edited by ChairmanKaga; 2022-04-25 at 09:36 PM.
It was a colossal failure.
It was a solid idea, but like everything else Blizz does, they managed to take something that could have been cool and fun, and they turned it into the worst chore they could possibly dream up.
Its like they went out of their way to ensure not a nano-gram of fun could be extracted.
How in the world Ion manages to keep his job when expansion after expansion are just colossal shit storms is beyond me.
This is a signature of an ailing giant, boundless in pride, wit and strength.
Yet also as humble as health and humor permit.
Furthermore, I consider that Carthage Slam must be destroyed.
I think the whole idea that everyone should be able to acquire a legendary early on in the game and balance everything around everyone having such legendary is a conceptual failure from inception.
It dillutes the appeal of a legendary and simply makes it another must-have to begin raiding.
Kind of like what Corollas are. In North America Corollas are every day cars, everyone can have one, so when you get it, you feel like you got something mundane. In South America Corollas are expensive, rarer, a goal to work towards, and when you get one, you feel good about your achievement.
It's all a factor of how rare or difficult to obtain an item is and when it's too easy, the community takes it for granted. Making it craftable, using materials you can easily get out in the world makes it ordinary, so you're expected to have it. That makes it boring
Much like Azerite Armor in BfA: I see what Blizzard was trying to do with crafted Legendaries, and I can respect them for that... But yeah, it's implementation was terrible. The idea of having a crafted Legendary that would require you to craft it dozens of times to rank it up and create a more powerful version - one that I assume Blizzard had ideally thought would be a guild activity - sounds great on paper... until you realize that everyone has access to this recipe, and that a lot of solo or small guild players are going to be left in the dust because of it.
Crafted Legendaries are fine, but really only if they're done in the style of Legion's. Give us a questline to hunt for materials, along with the normal material grind, to create a Legendary Item that can then be upgraded through something like Torghast over time, that would have worked out far better - especially if they wanted to keep the idea of making it a guild activity and requiring a shit ton of materials to make it. Sure, a solo player or small guild might take longer to get it done, but they'd be able to make continued progress towards it (like the GW2 Legendary Weapons).
The way the system worked in Shadowlands, though , just wasn't going to work well for anyone, even guilds that had the people to work towards crafting one.
The Artifact weapons were a cool concept that could be iterated on, yeah. The WoD ring was an example of that concept, but I also agree it was kind of underwhelming. Artifact/Legendary gear should have an aesthetic quality to them in addition to the obvious stat boost, as well.
"We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead
If it means anything to the recipient then it's meaningful. It's personal and others don't get to judge how much or what it meant. Besides, progression in that sense is bought and sold every day with people buying runs and raiding guilds happy to be in business selling them. People pay money for things that have meaning for them all the time. I'm not arrogant enough to imagine I can judge them.
EDIT: To answer the question posed in the thread: Crafted legendaries failed as a system for some. I'm pretty sure they worked for others. So no, I'm not inclined to agree.
Last edited by MoanaLisa; 2022-04-25 at 11:27 PM.
"...money's most powerful ability is to allow bad people to continue doing bad things at the expense of those who don't have it."
In the same way the mage tower rewards are a lottery or access to Wintergrasp or Tol Barad was a lottery. I mean, I really didn't care for the PVP requirement in the cloak chain but it was literally one win, wasn't it? It wasn't like "get rank 10 or better in Classic to proceed".
I mean, I guess, but this was the way they were doing it at the height of the game's popularity, too and I can't remember ever having heard one person ever give their reason for leaving as "I just couldn't stand that they gave caster DPS a legendary staff and I just had farm for the amazing reskin of an old legendary for my 2H DPS weapon", or similar.The problem is that you have so many classes/specs now... Do you really want to tell the playerbase hey this xpac, it's X classes turn to get a "legendary" the rest will need to wait for the next xpac. Oh and forget about seeing a "legendary" if your class was the one we just did in the last xpac because it's going to be a decade before we get back to you since we're doing only 2 at a time... Of the 36 specs and 12 classes.. (Well now 38 specs and 13 classes in DF)
For that matter, even while Shadowlands was burning the WoW playerbase to the ground, I don't remember much pushback on Hunters getting a legendary bow off Sylvanas. If anything I feel it's one of the few things people concede made sense about this dumpster fire.
Broken down by weapon type it's not as hard to cover everyone, especially not two at a time. We don't really know Invoker weapons yet, right, but it's presumed to probably cover mage + priest?
If they were going to go back to that system *in* DF, I'd assume Invokers would be included... one handed sword? Just on casters that covers Mage, Lock, probably Invoker, and Hpally if you feel like making it have healer "mode". Or even a phys DPS mode and suddenly rogues, warriors, DKs, and DHs can play too?