Andrew Tate banned.

[Cynical Asshole]

[minteK917]

This guy is a symptom, red pill is rising up and nobody really cares because its men issues. Theres a reason zoomers somehow have more conservatives now then millennial does or did.

Hell at the end of the day even people that debate or oppose red pill shit like this are thought of as toxic men on most left online circles. Big online en like xqc or destiny go on their show to oppose them, but are still seen as toxic males in general. So not gona fix any time soon.Young Boys are gona keep going into red pill garbage arms.

[OnlineSamantha]

For the people saying he'll only get more popular, I wonder if they still think about Milo Yiannopoulos and his opinions. It used to be that you couldn't move 5 feet on the internet without hearing his nonsense, then he got banned, and now the air is fresh and clear again.

[Muzjhath]

This guy is a symptom, red pill is rising up and nobody really cares because its men issues. Theres a reason zoomers somehow have more conservatives now then millennial does or did.

Hell at the end of the day even people that debate or oppose red pill shit like this are thought of as toxic men on most left online circles. Big online en like xqc or destiny go on their show to oppose them, but are still seen as toxic males in general. So not gona fix any time soon.Young Boys are gona keep going into red pill garbage arms.

A lot of people care.
Most of them Feminists.

[minteK917]

A lot of people care.
Most of them Feminists.

They really dont. I watched so many feminist panels, even some that where literally about debating men issues and in the end the consensus was, men doing it to themselves, men do better. AKA exactly the kind of useless shit that makes human trash like Tates have a teenagers audience. Why the fuck do we think 13-16 years old boys should do better and we threat 13-16 years old girls like fucking babies. We are doing exactly the toxic masculinity even in feminisms now. Because its the popular thing to do. When the only dating advice you give young boy is, DONT RAPE GIRLS. It doesent actually help them date anyone. So the only person picking up the slack is toxic shit like Tates giving them the road map to date while being a shit hole.

I can even point out a recent shit about this. That fucking manosphere trash Elijah Schaffer had a tweet go rival about how girls dont pursue super dangerous and phyiscal jobs. Obviously his click bait trash was about equal rights. The worse fucking part is all the feminist coming out of the wood work with even worse fucking takes resumed to: Those are trash jobs, nobody should want to do them anyway. Thats how you expect to defeat red pill brain worming your boys? By telling your boys some of the job they might be interest in is trash?

Its not a feminist issue only. Literally everyone failed speaking to boys. Which is why boys are still more locked in their gender roles then ever before, it never moved. Only women got some slack about their roles, which is what feminism accomplished. If you cry in 2022 as a men, you are still known as a pussy to 95% of the women youll meet, that sucks but its true. People like Tates will take adventage of this.

[Muzjhath]

They really dont. I watched so many feminist panels, even some that where literally about debating men issues and in the end the consensus was, men doing it to themselves, men do better. AKA exactly the kind of useless shit that makes human trash like Tates have a teenagers audience. Why the fuck do we think 13-16 years old boys should do better and we threat 13-16 years old girls like fucking babies. We are doing exactly the toxic masculinity even in feminisms now. Because its the popular thing to do. When the only dating advice you give young boy is, DONT RAPE GIRLS. It doesent actually help them date anyone. So the only person picking up the slack is toxic shit like Tates giving them the road map to date while being a shit hole.

I can even point out a recent shit about this. That fucking manosphere trash Elijah Schaffer had a tweet go rival about how girls dont pursue super dangerous and phyiscal jobs. Obviously his click bait trash was about equal rights. The worse fucking part is all the feminist coming out of the wood work with even worse fucking takes resumed to: Those are trash jobs, nobody should want to do them anyway. Thats how you expect to defeat red pill brain worming your boys? By telling your boys some of the job they might be interest in is trash?

Its not a feminist issue only. Literally everyone failed speaking to boys. Which is why boys are still more locked in their gender roles then ever before, it never moved. Only women got some slack about their roles, which is what feminism accomplished. If you cry in 2022 as a men, you are still known as a pussy to 95% of the women youll meet, that sucks but its true. People like Tates will take adventage of this.

And most of that is because of toxic male culture perpetrated globaly.
Meanwhile if a man is seen with his children at the park but just sitting on a bench watching them play? He's accused of being a pedo. If he's into childcare? Same thing.
From patriarchical structure that has "womens" and "mens" work. So it goes both fucking ways.

Again, on the "do better" etc. Boys are encouraged to do physical shit, etc etc.

It's a deep, systematic, issue. And most men who talk about those issues generally don't have systematic solutions.
And lots of women apply for such works, generally they get passed over by names alone.

As who generally tells people that say. The Garbage man job is trash? Men in suits.

[minteK917]

And most of that is because of toxic male culture perpetrated globaly.
Meanwhile if a man is seen with his children at the park but just sitting on a bench watching them play? He's accused of being a pedo. If he's into childcare? Same thing.
From patriarchical structure that has "womens" and "mens" work. So it goes both fucking ways.

Again, on the "do better" etc. Boys are encouraged to do physical shit, etc etc.

It's a deep, systematic, issue. And most men who talk about those issues generally don't have systematic solutions.
And lots of women apply for such works, generally they get passed over by names alone.

As who generally tells people that say. The Garbage man job is trash? Men in suits.

Women reinforce partriarchy too. Again you are doing it right now lmao. Boys are getting less educated then women. Its 40 to 60 now in college. As women earn more, they still dont date men that have less monetary value then they do. Because we did try to dismenentle women roles to be more open. But not males one, we havent done a dent, because men role is actually convenient to keep even for the average women. Its unlikely men will even be accepted at large to be a main caretaker in my life time and im only in my 30s. People like Tates pray exactly on these issues. Its hard to have a systemic fix for these unlike not preventing women in work.force, we forced that with laws. Im not sure what law you could have on the books to make it so men arent sitll expected to be the bread winner, still expected to be the one opening any relationship and the plethora of other assumptions we still hold as standard to men, are generally just socials and not the lack of a right. If you know a feminist that know a systemic way to fix the lack of mobility of men as a social role, im all ears. Most of the times.it boils down to boys do better. Im aure one day 14 years old gona rise up and be better then adults out of the gate. But it aint now. We see s rise of the reversal instead.

[Muzjhath]

Women reinforce partriarchy too. Again you are doing it right now lmao. Boys are getting less educated then women. Its 40 to 60 now in college. As women earn more, they still dont date men that have less monetary value then they do. Because we did try to dismenentle women roles to be more open. But not males one, we havent done a dent, because men role is actually convenient to keep even for the average women. Its unlikely men will even be accepted at large to be a main caretaker in my life time and im only in my 30s. People like Tates pray exactly on these issues. Its hard to have a systemic fix for these unlike not preventing women in work.force, we forced that with laws. Im not sure what law you could have on the books to make it so men arent sitll expected to be the bread winner, still expected to be the one opening any relationship and the plethora of other assumptions we still hold as standard to men, are generally just socials and not the lack of a right. If you know a feminist that know a systemic way to fix the lack of mobility of men as a social role, im all ears. Most of the times.it boils down to boys do better. Im aure one day 14 years old gona rise up and be better then adults out of the gate. But it aint now. We see s rise of the reversal instead.

Almost like capitalism itself entrenches patriarchical ideas.

I just said who generally tries to help and come with solutions to the issues. Generally it isn't the crowd who goes "boys will be boys".

[minteK917]

Almost like capitalism itself entrenches patriarchical ideas.

I just said who generally tries to help and come with solutions to the issues. Generally it isn't the crowd who goes "boys will be boys".

Neither group actually offers solutions for individuals. Actually someone like tates offer a solution, its just a bad one. Your patriarchy speech doesent actually help the 16 years old out of his slump, infact its not related because you talk about his issue as if its made by him only and he needs to fix it.

I actually had to help my nephew because my sister had trouble with him going into red pill shit. My sister idea was pretty much yours, talking about systematic patriarchy, nice except hes a 15 years old not a fucking sociology class. Doesent matter if its patriarchy girls still expected him to pay for everything on his couple dates. He still had body issues to deal with that my sister glossed over, because most people including feminist gloss.over, because its not there job and its fine. But nobody does it beside the pick up artist and red pill trash, its who we let our teenage boys learn from. We went years and are still going on about how bad we made girl sexual objects in media and hurt self esteme, a good thing. We have yet to even dent into the any men problems with image and self esteem. We let girls play with the "boy" thing, but the boy cant really turn around and do that still. It doesent matter if its patriarchy, your kid is living right now, its not a sociology class.

Thats why these red pill.and pick up artist get teenage boy following. They offer personal "solutions" to problems while someone like you shrug and tells them well.its not how the world should be. Thats cool, except it is like that.

I got my nephew out of this with some actual real knowledge. Yes most girls are still educated to expect him to give more directly , its not because women are just a game and they only value your money. Thats the difference between a real advice, the red pill shit view and your feminist bs that just tell him: well one day the world wont be like this.

[Diaphin]

Neither group actually offers solutions for individuals. Actually someone like tates offer a solution, its just a bad one. Your patriarchy speech doesent actually help the 16 years old out of his slump, infact its not related because you talk about his issue as if its made by him only and he needs to fix it.

I actually had to help my nephew because my sister had trouble with him going into red pill shit. My sister idea was pretty much yours, talking about systematic patriarchy, nice except hes a 15 years old not a fucking sociology class. Doesent matter if its patriarchy girls still expected him to pay for everything on his couple dates. He still had body issues to deal with that my sister glossed over, because most people including feminist gloss.over, because its not there job and its fine. But nobody does it beside the pick up artist and red pill trash, its who we let our teenage boys learn from. We went years and are still going on about how bad we made girl sexual objects in media and hurt self esteme, a good thing. We have yet to even dent into the any men problems with image and self esteem. We let girls play with the "boy" thing, but the boy cant really turn around and do that still. It doesent matter if its patriarchy, your kid is living right now, its not a sociology class.

Thats why these red pill.and pick up artist get teenage boy following. They offer personal "solutions" to problems while someone like you shrug and tells them well.its not how the world should be. Thats cool, except it is like that.

I got my nephew out of this with some actual real knowledge. Yes most girls are still educated to expect him to give more directly , its not because women are just a game and they only value your money. Thats the difference between a real advice, the red pill shit view and your feminist bs that just tell him: well one day the world wont be like this.

Isn't kind of the problem that men aren't really organizing to bring these issues to the forefront the way feminists did when it came to their civil rights and social issues? Most of the time men organized, its some manosphere bullshit mostly about blaming women for all the problem men have in their lifes and for rape not being legal. The feminist movement can only talk so much about these issue that plague men as it interjects with their issues, we can be allies but even that only works out if there is a movement we can ally ourselves to without comprimising our own needs and advocacy. I mean, outside of you bitching about feminists, I'm with you for the most part, the problem is just that there is no constructive organized effort to advocate for boys. Most of the time, men seem to expect that women just do the advocacy for them but in a way thats comfortable for them, so no talking about toxic masculinity or anything like that.

[minteK917]

Isn't kind of the problem that men aren't really organizing to bring these issues to the forefront the way feminists did when it came to their civil rights and social issues? Most of the time men organized, its some manosphere bullshit mostly about blaming women for all the problem men have in their lifes and for rape not being legal. The feminist movement can only talk so much about these issue that plague men as it interjects with their issues, we can be allies but even that only works out if there is a movement we can ally ourselves to without comprimising our own needs and advocacy. I mean, outside of you bitching about feminists, I'm with you for the most part, the problem is just that there is no constructive organized effort to advocate for boys. Most of the time, men seem to expect that women just do the advocacy for them but in a way thats comfortable for them, so no talking about toxic masculinity or anything like that.

Thats exactly my point lol. But you point that out and you get the answer I got from this person, well feminist are doing. No they are not, they probably shouldnt be either. But its been hijacked already. Like I said we know online figures that do want to oppose the red pill and scam pick up artist, but these men are still considered problematic and toxic. Because they will directly acknowledge the reality that these scammer uses and comfort them by pointing out their solutions are terrible.

Again when a teenager ask for dating advice. Only resorting to telling them their issues all comes down to patriarchy doesent actually help them at all. Girls still expect him to make first moves 99% of time, they still expecting him to pay, they still on average expect things that are only expected of the stereotypical gender role. Telling him it shouldn't be like that is not helping. People rather run away from that usually and it leaves room for andrew tates of the world to just tell them, yes what you see is true, your eyes are opened you took the red pill and that's why you should use my solution.

As long as people pretend feminism will solve men issues, this will be the state of things. Feminisms will not and does not have the burden to fix men issues. Pretending that it will is why we have these movements growing. Nothing is being done, its literally a few streamers that are engaging in the anti red pill shit. Theres no giant movement to help there, it was hijacked and since then nobody even wants to try to do anything. When andrew tates was banned, social media was filled with parents being like omg my boys know about him and watch him, how awful. YOU ARE THE FUCKING PARENTS, You made your kid fall into this trap. Tates is just reaping what you sowed for fucking money. Hes preying on the maladjusted boys that YOU RAISED.

I still dont understand how my own side doesent see it as clear as fucking day. We are the ones that fucking advocate for real sex education as young as possible for prevention and good outcome. But when it comes to dating. Look figure your shit out 14 years old, just dont rape people. Id propose scraping sex education and just making it relationship education, which would include sex education. Mabye if we didnt only focus our education on the physical part of relationship, we could undo some of the stereotype that still lingers which is not civil right bounds but social bound. Thats really the play ground of red pill and manosphere.

[Kumorii]

Isn't kind of the problem that men aren't really organizing to bring these issues to the forefront the way feminists did when it came to their civil rights and social issues? Most of the time men organized, its some manosphere bullshit mostly about blaming women for all the problem men have in their lifes and for rape not being legal. The feminist movement can only talk so much about these issue that plague men as it interjects with their issues, we can be allies but even that only works out if there is a movement we can ally ourselves to without comprimising our own needs and advocacy. I mean, outside of you bitching about feminists, I'm with you for the most part, the problem is just that there is no constructive organized effort to advocate for boys. Most of the time, men seem to expect that women just do the advocacy for them but in a way thats comfortable for them, so no talking about toxic masculinity or anything like that.

can't say I've experienced much of that. I have seen lots of mocking men when they speak up about various issues they have.
Or they try to tell them their issues aren't issues and they should focus on toxic masculinity instead of whatever issue they say they deal with.
It's lots of minimizing. I haven't heard much that women should advocate for them, I have heard lots of people not feeling heard when they speak up though.

I think we solve it by doing what we did with womens issues. People started to listen, people started to clap back when others tried to shut down their voice. We just need to do that for men who speak up as well. Just reverse it. Lets say women speak up about an issue and the response to it is "nah, that's not your issue, we tell you your issue is this". I think it's justified to say that's fucked up.

Everything starts with listening. There's very little of it from my experience.
Oddly enough, now that I think about it, I would categorize the not listening and not validating mens feelings is a product of toxic masculinity perpetuated by both women and men. Which makes it a circle basically where people telling people to shut up about their feelings and focus on toxic masculinity perpetuates toxic masculinity.

[PACOX]

Neither group actually offers solutions for individuals. Actually someone like tates offer a solution, its just a bad one. Your patriarchy speech doesent actually help the 16 years old out of his slump, infact its not related because you talk about his issue as if its made by him only and he needs to fix it.

I actually had to help my nephew because my sister had trouble with him going into red pill shit. My sister idea was pretty much yours, talking about systematic patriarchy, nice except hes a 15 years old not a fucking sociology class. Doesent matter if its patriarchy girls still expected him to pay for everything on his couple dates. He still had body issues to deal with that my sister glossed over, because most people including feminist gloss.over, because its not there job and its fine. But nobody does it beside the pick up artist and red pill trash, its who we let our teenage boys learn from. We went years and are still going on about how bad we made girl sexual objects in media and hurt self esteme, a good thing. We have yet to even dent into the any men problems with image and self esteem. We let girls play with the "boy" thing, but the boy cant really turn around and do that still. It doesent matter if its patriarchy, your kid is living right now, its not a sociology class.

Thats why these red pill.and pick up artist get teenage boy following. They offer personal "solutions" to problems while someone like you shrug and tells them well.its not how the world should be. Thats cool, except it is like that.

I got my nephew out of this with some actual real knowledge. Yes most girls are still educated to expect him to give more directly , its not because women are just a game and they only value your money. Thats the difference between a real advice, the red pill shit view and your feminist bs that just tell him: well one day the world wont be like this.

Im online enough to know you're not talking about about actual feminism, people who want equity among the all gebders and sex, but instead femcels abd terfs. I love when I have to distinguish between the two, both are bad. I think the nuance of separating them from feminism proper is important, especially trying to isolate social issues ie why men like Taye can go as far as they do.

Because what you argue is nit necessarily wrong but the generalizations are and take away from the argument.

Sadly attitudes jeld among people and femcels (including terfs) were held as nomative for a long time or no one spike out against the views so a lot people may even share views with somw of the views of the people. Like in the Coffeezilla video i posted, the key for a person luke Tate is that sort of foot in the door techniques. Saw some off the wall stuff to hey your attention, say some 'normal' you might agree with to let your guard down, then spew his true bullshit once h has your fu attention and a bit of acceptance.

[s_bushido]

Oddly enough, now that I think about it, I would categorize the not listening and not validating mens feelings is a product of toxic masculinity perpetuated by both women and men.

But...that's exactly what it is. It would be incredibly helpful if the people complaining that men's issues are being ignored weren't also the same ones who somehow convinced themselves that feminists believe "toxic masculinity" means "men are toxic." All it really does is demonstrate their ignorance, or their willful malice in perpetuating the "man-hating feminazis are the reason men can't speak up about their problems" bullshit.

And even granting for the sake of argument that men's issues do get ignored or downplayed by society, that is in no way a justification for turning to reprehensible sacks of shit like Tate in response.

[Kumorii]

But...that's exactly what it is.

So you agree with me.

It would be incredibly helpful if the people complaining that men's issues are being ignored weren't also the same ones who somehow convinced themselves that feminists believe "toxic masculinity" means "men are toxic." All it really does is demonstrate their ignorance, or their willful malice in perpetuating the "man-hating feminazis are the reason men can't speak up about their problems" bullshit.

Not sure what your point is really. Except you wanted to vent against people who don't like feminists?
I didn't even mention feminists in my post because it has nothing to do with what I said.
I'm talking about people dismissing men who speak up and try to correct them that their problem is actually whatever they consider to be a problem with men rather than the personal experience of the individual who speaks up.
Or trying to change the topic into talking about a different problem they find to be the problem rather than the problem the person they try to "listen to" has.

[Draco-Onis]

This guy is a symptom, red pill is rising up and nobody really cares because its men issues. Theres a reason zoomers somehow have more conservatives now then millennial does or did.

There's zero evidence of this, they don't identify with either party but there's no evidence that Gen Z or any of the younger generation have more conservative views. Feel free to post data showing huge support among them against LGBTQ, abortion and pro religion.

[Cynical Asshole]

There's zero evidence of this, they don't identify with either party but there's no evidence that Gen Z or any of the younger generation have more conservative views. Feel free to post data showing huge support among them against LGBTQ, abortion and pro religion.

Ah yes, the good old "You're either with us or against us". You can't support LGBT people without agreeing with forced agendas in entertainment products and learning institutions, you must be a -phobic of some kind. You can't support black people if you disagree with BLM domestic terrorism, you must be racist. And if you disagree with uncontrolled abortions up to birth and, why not, post-birth as well by cyanide injection, then you must be a bible loon.

The existence of centrists must be defying all logic for you, guys.

[Edge-]

You can't support LGBT people without agreeing with forced agendas in entertainment products and learning institutions you must be a -phobic of some kind.

That you think there's a "forced agenda" kinda places you in one camp to begin with. What forced agenda? That LGBTQ+ people exist?

You can't support black people if you disagree with BLM domestic terrorism, you must be racist.

Calling BLM "domestic terrorism" again, kinda outs you as being firmly in one of these camps. And it's not the camp that exists in reality.

And if you disagree with uncontrolled abortions up to birth and, why not, post-birth as well by cyanide injection, then you must be a bible loon.

And again, your terror at purely fictional scenarios places you firmly in one camp.

I'm not gonna say which camp, but I think you can probably figure it out.

The existence of centrists must be defying all logic for you, guys.

Literally none of these positions are remotely centrist. Like, they're far, far, far from center. This is getting off-topic for the thread, but also somehow topical in how fringe, extremist views like the above have been mainstreamed by folks like Andrew Tate on social media.

I still regret doing a web search and learning who Andrew Tate is.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Meanwhile if a man is seen with his children at the park but just sitting on a bench watching them play? He's accused of being a pedo. If he's into childcare? Same thing.

This really doesn't happen. Maybe it happened once, and the story is now used as some kind of anecdote to "prove" that it's a systemic problem. I realize it's probably used perpetually in "man" spaces like 4chan and other GQP hideaways.

Andrew Tate is a blaring misogynist, and he's not a "symtpom" of the culture. He's a grifter who's fleecing millions of dollars off of insecure men who sit online all day, sitting alone in their house thinking everyone else is the problem, and their twisted views on women are just fine. This is why people see this hermit lifestyle as undesirable, it creates socially mal-adjusted people whose entire perception of the world is shaped by misogynistic echo chambers that use anecdotes and turn them into trends all on their own.

- - - Updated - - -

I actually had to help my nephew because my sister had trouble with him going into red pill shit. My sister idea was pretty much yours, talking about systematic patriarchy, nice except hes a 15 years old not a fucking sociology class. Doesent matter if its patriarchy girls still expected him to pay for everything on his couple dates. He still had body issues to deal with that my sister glossed over, because most people including feminist gloss.over, because its not there job and its fine. But nobody does it beside the pick up artist and red pill trash, its who we let our teenage boys learn from. We went years and are still going on about how bad we made girl sexual objects in media and hurt self esteme, a good thing. We have yet to even dent into the any men problems with image and self esteem. We let girls play with the "boy" thing, but the boy cant really turn around and do that still. It doesent matter if its patriarchy, your kid is living right now, its not a sociology class.

This whole situation sounds like a lack of a strong male influence in their lives, lack of an older brother who's either involved with them all the time or just lack of a father. But we know there's a ton of kids who grow up without fathers because the father knocks up a woman then runs away. Then all of them get involved with online spaces that echo "male issues" that don't exist, and ignore male issues that do exist.

Like, one reason so many men are absent from their children's lives (aside from being deadbeats) is that many modern families, the parents are often working 2 or even 3 jobs to make ends meet. So these online spaces become the de facto influence in these kid's lives. But these online spaces reinforce this system by saying that if your family can't make ends meet with a single job then it's your parent's fault for just not being skilled workers (these people are often hyper focused on "capitalism fixes everything"). So rather than talking about issues like increasing worker pay to ensure parents spend more time with their kids, teaching them normal values, they whinge about "men being accused of molesters in parks" and how it's the fault of feminists and liberals. All the while continuing to prop up this system that keeps parents absent from their kids' lives.

- - - Updated - - -

Not sure what your point is really. Except you wanted to vent against people who don't like feminists?

More like people who don't even understand feminism or what "toxic masculinity" means.

Red pill spaces prop up a lot of untrue negative stereotypes. Many about women. Many about men. And many about what feminists think about men.

And all of the posts in this forum that are about the "feminists" are stuff straight out of 4chan and other redpill spaces. They don't reflect reality. They take a microscopic fringe part of feminism and prop it up like it's the entire thing. It's indicative of people who don't go outside and only sit on forums all day echoing their bad takes.

[Draco-Onis]

Ah yes, the good old "You're either with us or against us". You can't support LGBT people without agreeing with forced agendas in entertainment products and learning institutions, you must be a -phobic of some kind. You can't support black people if you disagree with BLM domestic terrorism, you must be racist. And if you disagree with uncontrolled abortions up to birth and, why not, post-birth as well by cyanide injection, then you must be a bible loon.

The existence of centrists must be defying all logic for you, guys.

I am not sure what your nonsense rant has anything to do with my point or reality. uncontrolled abortions have never been on the table or a thing. If a mother terminates a baby in the third trimester it's usually because of a life and death medical situation. You are clearly living in a fictional world and don't understand what centrism means or what I was replying to.