Retribution Paladins. 3.2

[highwind01]

I would gladly give all my spells for a holy version of the dk spells and abilities :P

dks are just as overpowerd as lolrets have been for a while now - they get their needed nerfs aswell

for the time being: try to compare ur abilities to kill a healer with the more "balanced" melee classes, warriors, rogues (I never thought I would say rogues a balanced, lol), enhancer shaman, feral druids, they all have a hard times killing healers, warrior vs priest might be the most doable thing of the melee vs healer but a warrior doesnt have an easier time killing a well geared and well playing resto druid than a lolret has, neither does a rogue, feral, enhancer


when it comes to 3.2 and arena I would be rather happy as ret to be a good addition to a 3vs3 team (2vs2 wont matter much more) that already has a healer and one of the ms classes because neither a second healer nor a second ms class really makes sense - what infact make sense is a class with burst on the one hand and strong defensive/supporting abilities on the other and that is where rets and dks fall in

rogue stun+ms combined with rets burst, cc and phyiscal bubble+hand of freedom for your own healer IS good

warrior distance closing+chainslowing+ms combined with dks burst, silences/amz and a defensivly used deathgrip to help out your own healer IS good

[Dekarn]

What bothers most people about lolrets is not the fact that they HAVE burst dmg but the fact that they dont have any need to time it or set it up.
Staying with your example, a blood dk doing 4x 13k hearthstrikes (u never do 13k crits on a resilienced non cloth target but anyways) needs the following:
both diseases up -> 2 gcds, pathetic dmg
1 deathstrikes used (for the the death rune, otherwise u cant chain HS) -> 1 gcd, not great dmg either
another 5-6 seconds to have all your runes restored
than u have about a 6-8 seconds window to unleash the 4 HS (before ur diseases fall of again)
so: you need preperation, you need timing, you need to hit a timed window
what does a lolret need ? hammer stun, faceroll keyboard, hoping the face hits all 3 keys bound to the dmg abilites, burst delivered, pathetic

You know what all a Ret's burst does verses a moderately well geared healer? Not a whole hell of alot... Downing a healer takes patience and timing.. I'm sorry if you get beat down by abunch of facerolling Rets.. Heaven help you when you meet a good one.

[highwind01]

You know what all a Ret's burst does verses a moderately well geared healer? Not a whole hell of alot... Downing a healer takes patience and timing.. I'm sorry if you get beat down by abunch of facerolling Rets.. Heaven help you when you meet a good one.

You know what all a Warriors/Rogues MS does versas a moderately well geward healer? Not a whole hell of alot... Downing a healer takes patience and timing... Im sorry if you get beat down by abunch of facerolling *insertclass here*... Heaven help when you meet a good one



Do u reallize that a MS isnt an autowin vs healers (as well as your burst is not)
Do u reallize that there are only 4 healing classes ingame and vs the remaining 6 burst dmg does a whole fuckin more than a retarded MS ?

[Ronark]

You know what all a Warriors/Rogues MS does versas a moderately well geward healer? Not a whole hell of alot... Downing a healer takes patience and timing... Im sorry if you get beat down by abunch of facerolling *insertclass here*... Heaven help when you meet a good one

So we have to time one stun every 40 seconds and make sure they die, while trying to keep them in melee range.

: /

[Dekarn]

Lol, wasn't talking about vs other dps classes... pretty sure we were just talking about healing... and if was an "Inst-win" vs healers... blizz would nerf it.. Just stating "Classes with MS are a BIGGER threat to a healer" than a Ret's burst damage..

As far as "So we have to time one stun every 40 seconds and make sure they die, while trying to keep them in melee range."

No... we have 2 stuns... you use repentance to get your judgement cool'd-down or closer to it and you save hammer for when their health is low but before the get a fresh set of hots up...

Ret paladins are burst dps... not sustained... that's how blizz made us... so keep'em as cc'd as our limited abilities will allow and try to get 2-3 full bursts in before they max their health bar... In a war of attrition.. the healer wins..

[Powell]

- if Ret paladins sacrifice lots of their burst, then they can have a MS effect.
Warriors do waaaay less burst then ret paladins and is balance out with MS effect
in a 1v1 situation warriors are gimped vs any dps class due to this, so its not that much of a blessing as it is a curse.

- if Ret paladins sacrifice their Pursuit of Justice and hand of freedom they can have a snare. Only 50%, not 60/70%
because all snares (cept crippling) are normalized to 50%.


It is just as hard for any class to take on a resto druid as it is for a ret paladin.
Ret paladins can already take on any non healer class, it would be pretty stupid if they could start zerking healers and just beat everyone. EVERY CLASS NEEDS COUNTERS.

Try and play a 80 warrior in arena, BGs and duels for a few weeks, then try n play your paladin, you can defo feel the difference.

your theory on "this class has that so i want it too" is bullocks, if you want a game that has no difference between other players then go play counterstrike.


edit:
a good disc priest beats any class in a 1v1 situation
a good resto druid beats any class in a 1v1 situation
a good prot paladin healer beats any class in a 1v1
a very good holy paladin is in a 50/50 zone
a good shaman gets facerolled

[pomterri]

/flame
/harsh
/harras

Lets give 20k instant dmg on crusader strike on 100 yard area. What the fuck you want for your idiot facepalm class? It is already op and you are still whining?
Go play on your own private server and kill even Dummies in capital cities. !!!

[Dekarn]

- if Ret paladins sacrifice lots of their burst, then they can have a MS effect.
Warriors do waaaay less burst then ret paladins and is balance out with MS effect
in a 1v1 situation warriors are gimped vs any dps class due to this, so its not that much of a blessing as it is a curse.

- if Ret paladins sacrifice their Pursuit of Justice and hand of freedom they can have a snare. Only 50%, not 60/70%
because all snares (cept crippling) are normalized to 50%.


It is just as hard for any class to take on a resto druid as it is for a ret paladin.
Ret paladins can already take on any non healer class, it would be pretty stupid if they could start zerking healers and just beat everyone. EVERY CLASS NEEDS COUNTERS.

Try and play a 80 warrior in arena, BGs and duels for a few weeks, then try n play your paladin, you can defo feel the difference.

your theory on "this class has that so i want it too" is bullocks, if you want a game that has no difference between other players then go play counterstrike.


edit:
a good disc priest beats any class in a 1v1 situation
a good resto druid beats any class in a 1v1 situation
a good prot paladin healer beats any class in a 1v1
a very good holy paladin is in a 50/50 zone
a good shaman gets facerolled

Mage... It's the pally killing class, especially Frost... or it is for me (This of course is an considering equally geared and relatively skilled mages)

Yeah, I really don't pay attention when I'm dealing with a warrior. Sorry, but Retadin > Warrior... (Again equally or maybe 1 total gear level higher)

And still... 3rd time I've said this... MS is a major bump vs healers.... In a 1v1 vs a healer MS basically doubles your dps... now if that just gets you to the point where your dps = an average Ret... well... sorry bout your luck

And exactly what spec of shaman are you refering to? Elemental Shammies are nasty, Resto Shammies are.. prolly the easiest healer to kill... but that doesn't mean it's easy to kill them.. And Enhance shammies... are stepping into the same place a warrior's standing in... sorry

[Powell]

Mage... It's the pally killing class, especially Frost... or it is for me (This of course is an considering equally geared and relatively skilled mages)

Yeah, I really don't pay attention when I'm dealing with a warrior. Sorry, but Retadin > Warrior... (Again equally or maybe 1 total gear level higher)

And still... 3rd time I've said this... MS is a major bump vs healers.... In a 1v1 vs a healer MS basically doubles your dps... now if that just gets you to the point where your dps = an average Ret... well... sorry bout your luck

And exactly what spec of shaman are you refering to? Elemental Shammies are nasty, Resto Shammies are.. prolly the easiest healer to kill... but that doesn't mean it's easy to kill them.. And Enhance shammies... are stepping into the same place a warrior's standing in... sorry

i was refering to resto shamans, elemental shamans do hurt, but resto shamans have no escape other then just healing themselfs oom, unlike druids/priests/paladins who can actually defend themselfs more offensive.

and yes MS is great vs healers, but then again, its useless vs 1v1 dps classes such as mages/rogues/warrior
not so much vs paladins/dks/locks, but they still manage to win vs a warrior

80% of the paladins want MS, a snare... -> reroll a warrior or a rogue

and my dps isnt to the "average ret", have you fought ret paladins past 2200?
99% of them wear pve gear, increasing their burst ENORMOUSLY while keeping their survivability up.

[Ronark]

/flame
/harsh
/harras

Lets give 20k instant dmg on Mutilate on 100 yard area. What the fuck you want for your idiot facepalm class? It is already op and you are still whining?
Go play on your own private server and kill even Dummies in capital cities. !!!

See what I did there?

[Gilgemesh]

ya... you try running by an earthbind totem with a frost shock jammed up your ass... unless you got blessing of freedom you are... slow LOL

[iktankniet]

ya... you try running by an earthbind totem with a frost shock jammed up your ass... unless you got blessing of freedom you are... slow LOL

and HoF can be purged afaik

[Gilgemesh]

good point...
and good signature...