Be honest, your dps against GOOD players

[Quintessence]

I get beat in Ulduar (not Naxx) by good rogues, hunters and Im on par with locks, dks, and Im pretty much above everything else. How about you? Please dont post if you didnt get past mimiron.

[Sedative]

There's a thread for this already but yea...

rogues, locks, ferals should always beat mages (I say should as its in context for todays gear/content)

Hunters and Mages are very close right now. Probably the two closest classes with Boomkins in there somewhere but for those three hunters usually come out on top.

Melee are their own breed with the exception of feral druids who are just ridiculous right now.

[Sporatik]

Depends on the fight really, some classes fare better than others on different encounters.

[Bloodlover]

As a rogue, my only competition on a standstill fight are hunters and other rogues

[Sedative]

Depends on the fight really, some classes fare better than others on different encounters.

Which is why meters mean less today than they ever have before. The only time they're even remotely useful is when you have intelligent raid leaders discerning the information properly from them...which is maybe uhhh....5% of the time. The other 95% of the time you have the kids spamming gchat with top 20 in attempt to show how good they are 'cause they got #1 on XT.

[Jayded1]

On my elemental shaman I beat.....nevermind

Its funny in pugs my 4.5-5k stand still dps usually takes #1-#3 in my guild its 10th-15th depending on weather or not people die.

[Brudish]

There's a thread for this already but yea...

rogues, locks, ferals should always beat mages (I say should as its in context for todays gear/content)

Hunters and Mages are very close right now. Probably the two closest classes with Boomkins in there somewhere but for those three hunters usually come out on top.

Melee are their own breed with the exception of feral druids who are just ridiculous right now.

Thats a load of crap, good mages can always be number 1.

[Sedative]

Thats a load of crap, good mages can always be number 1.

At least kill Thorim, Mimi, and Gen before you pretend to know anything.

[kperkins1982]

I believe meters are a way to determine how good you are doing, i.e. another mage has 2k more dps than you, so you might wanna see what he's doing different, i.e. rotation, spec, and so on.

However, what is more important than the meters is the mechanics of the actuall boss fight itself.

For example, on Noth, or Saph mages may need to stop dps to decurse, but dont' because they are so focused on dps.

Or on Ignes in Ulduar not moving in bad places because they are focused on dps.

When I raid I ask that nobody posts meters it is useless if the fights aren't going well anyway.

[Risura]

Our DPS is good, simple as that, you need to take into account the type of boss fight, I can get 6k DPS one fight yet another I will be down at 3.9, RNG does not help either.

In our casual raiding guild I only completed Hodir and Thorim last night (the guild itself got them both last week and around 3 weeks ago on 10 man).

Usually ranged friendly fights we see the hunters (2), mages (2-4) locks (1-2) and a shammy in top 5-9 or so, depending on which guild members have signed up.

Mellee fights can be a mixture, but we see the DK's Rogues and Warriors taking up the top 5, the odd caster can usually split some of them apart.

In terms of mixing things up in a pug, VoA being the only pug I do now, when you get some genuinely good players from more established guilds I find my DPS actually goes up, but I have less chance of being in top 3 as their gear does make quite a bit of difference.

In all honesty however I have failed to see another caster totally blow me away yet with their DPS (1.5k+ over what I do would fall into this catagory).

I have certainly never witnessed any of the 7k+ DPS (single target) which some people boast with similar gear levels to me whether it be another mage, lock, hunter or whatever, maybe its just the circles I travel in.

[a[izen]

as a warlock i can burst out end the 3k-halfway the 4k.
i mostly end up somewhere in half (healers/tank not included) sp o guess i pretty much suck balls ^^
the rogues in my guild r mad though, always top of the chart

[Baever]

Boss encounters themselves have probably the greatest impact on performance, but don't spew bullshit about 'ideal situations,' since zero movement fights such as Patchwerk are ideal for every class when it comes to single target DPS, not just mages.

From what I have seen personally, and heard from Algalon-clearing players who confirm, is that ferals, rogues and warlocks are consistently leading the charts, mages doing well on gimmick fights and gimmick fights only. This goes back to the 'ideal situation' argument; it's one thing to *potentially,* under quintessential circumstances still be a contender on the meters, but it's completely ridiculous and uncalled for to have to rely on handicaps just to compete.

Personally, I believe it has much to do with the terrible reliance on RNG, an atrocious four-piece Tier bonus in Ulduar content and quite possibly, the same curse that drove mages up a wall TBC; awful scaling as gear progresses, when compared to other classes.

[Deleted]

My guild is trying yogg atm, but tbh, we got a bunch of nonskilled players

Like a month ago, me and this dk did around 18-20% of the total dmg done in each raid, and im serious ..
Like on Auriaya, Kologarn, Razorscale etc we did 10-11% both of us, dno why really..
In naxx i used to be 3rd and our CLmage who topped recount each fight, but for some reason he has sunken down to 8-10th place ??? ???

Nowadays, i do around 5-6,5k dps on each boss, and even on Vezax, where i am on of the main interrupters (didnt focus on my rotation at all, just some sinisters and slice and dice once in a while..) , i was 6th on recount, above some casters ...

Edit: Whops, my bad, didnt see it was mage forums rofl ;D ;D ;D

[Silverbreeze]

Usually Blood DK / Fury Warrior / Rogues / Fire Mage share the top 5 for our guild.

[Sedative]

Boss encounters themselves have probably the greatest impact on performance, but don't spew bullshit about 'ideal situations,' since zero movement fights such as Patchwerk are ideal for every class when it comes to single target DPS, not just mages.

From what I have seen personally, and heard from Algalon-clearing players who confirm, is that ferals, rogues and warlocks are consistently leading the charts, mages doing well on gimmick fights and gimmick fights only. This goes back to the 'ideal situation' argument; it's one thing to *potentially,* under quintessential circumstances still be a contender on the meters, but it's completely ridiculous and uncalled for to have to rely on handicaps just to compete.

Personally, I believe it has much to do with the terrible reliance on RNG, an atrocious four-piece Tier bonus in Ulduar content and quite possibly, the same curse that drove mages up a wall TBC; awful scaling as gear progresses, when compared to other classes.

/thread

[DocQuantum]

Disclaimer: my guild isn't "hardcore" (we're a 10-man guild; Yogg-phase 3 two weeks running but haven't quite sealed the deal). The following is anecdotal from our raids and PUGs of Vault/Uld-25/etc.

Typically, I see rogues/'locks on top, with the occasional feral/mage/hunter.
Below them are the ferals/mages/hunters.
Below them are the boomkins/elementals/enhancements.

Warriors are all over - but that's mostly because my server seems to have a low DPS-warrior population, so the statistics aren't good enough to base anything off of.

If it matters, I (destruction 'lock) tend to run 5 to 5.5k DPS on single-targets in standard raids (not counting gimmick fights); that puts me somehere in the top 3 damage per fight, typically. We've got three 'locks (counting myself) and two rogues that like to vie for top position.

[Sedative]

Disclaimer: my guild isn't "hardcore" (we're a 10-man guild; Yogg-phase 3 two weeks running but haven't quite sealed the deal). The following is anecdotal from our raids and PUGs of Vault/Uld-25/etc.

Typically, I see rogues/'locks on top, with the occasional feral/mage/hunter.
Below them are the ferals/mages/hunters.
Below them are the boomkins/elementals/enhancements.

Warriors are all over - but that's mostly because my server seems to have a low DPS-warrior population, so the statistics aren't good enough to base anything off of.

If it matters, I (destruction 'lock) tend to run 5 to 5.5k DPS on single-targets in standard raids (not counting gimmick fights); that puts me somehere in the top 3 damage per fight, typically. We've got three 'locks (counting myself) and two rogues that like to vie for top position.

That sounds about right for a typical 10-man, although I'd be curious to know how well geared/skilled the feral druid is...

[Xevec]

Which is why meters mean less today than they ever have before. The only time they're even remotely useful is when you have intelligent raid leaders discerning the information properly from them...which is maybe uhhh....5% of the time. The other 95% of the time you have the kids spamming gchat with top 20 in attempt to show how good they are 'cause they got #1 on XT.

XT is probably the WORST fight for a mage to get top DPS in(if you are not doing hard mode). It truly sucks because when we don't kill the heart, and it goes STRAIGHT into the second heart phase, only melee is allowed to DPS the heart, while most mages will go on add duty. So lame.

[jontaxe]

On my elemental shaman I beat.....nevermind

Its funny in pugs my 4.5-5k stand still dps usually takes #1-#3 in my guild its 10th-15th depending on weather or not people die.

No kidding, man. I'm wrist slashing depressed about elemental DPS atm. I used to think it was me sucking, too, but we got a second elem and on few times we run with both we are with ~3% of each other. So either we both suck exactly equally or.... wtb elem buff. Esp. as we sit and watch our buzzsaw enhance shaman come in near the top in every fight.

Us: Our cat drood(s), sometimes our rogue, our enhance shaman, and usually a mage(s) will round out the top 5. Our best arcane mage beats our best fire mage every single time, but by a really slim margin. (He's 3 in fire, frost to icy veins, and the rest in arcane. Dunno if that's a cookie cutter spec or not)

[Jaqera]

Thats a load of crap, good mages can always be number 1.

Agree