Chill of the Throne, Tanking, and You!

[Einari]

DRUIDS

BYE BYE

[thomiek]

Bare durids have http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=62600 guise

[Iselian]

Lower incoming damage... makes me wonder what kind of damage we're looking at. My current EH gear puts me around 40k health, unbuffed, with around 1500 block value. My pure-block set puts me at 3.5k sustained BV, but sacrifices quite a bit of health (though some re-gemming could fix that).

If we're eyeing raw, 15k hits and I can cut that down to 12 to 11k with block, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw block becoming somewhat valuable, akin to the lighter Ulduar fights.

[Casteroc]

It's a flat percentage decrease to dodge. Unless you have less than 20% dodge, this isn't going to reduce the value of dodge on gear at all. It also doesn't affect druids more than other tanks...if a druid had 40% total avoidance before, all dodge, and a warrior had 40% total avoidance as 25% dodge and 15% parry, the druid will now have 20%, all dodge, and the warrior will have 20%, 5% dodge and 15% parry. Adding 5% more dodge via dodge rating on gear would bring both back up from 20% to 25%. So, how is this making parry more valuable than dodge and affecting druids more than other tanks unless there are tanks out there with less than 20% dodge now (certainly not true of any even non-druid tank capable of tanking ICC)?

^^ Knows what he is talking about. Please read.

[zizimonster]

How come people are saying this is a very thought out idea?!?? What about Bear tanks! Their main defensive stat is DODGE. So bear tanks aren't going to be useful at all in Citadel?

My main spec is healing and I hate spiky damage but you can't just forget about tanks that can't use shields ffs

[ralphie]

OR MAYBE, you shouldn't have gone nuts with the jump in stats this xpac to begin with. JUST MAYBE?

Ah well, sry droods. Guess they want you healing or dpsing.

[treston323]

Not only will this screw DKs dodge.. but it will also screw their threat up too because of rune strike.

[Tankyouverymuch]

I don't see this as a bad thing. If they're adjusting boss damage accordingly, at the end of the day it should even out. That is to say, you should see the same amount of damage taken/second on the tanks over time, but this damage will be apportioned more predictably rather than in one massive smashing blow.

The idea here is that rather than having long periods of time with 0 damage followed by short bursts of massive damage averaging out to, say, 5000 DTPS, you're looking at a much more consistent and flat damage line that averages out to 5000 DTPS. Reducing damage variance makes life a lot easier for both tanks and healers.

[Shinshiva]

Wooooooooooooooot!!!!!! I'm going from 46% dodge to 26% dodge when I step into the final raid of the expansion! After all the work I put into getting myself properly sorted and ready!
Thanks Blizzard Developers for once again coming up with a stupid way of fixing the scaling problems you create with your "extra tiers" of raiding. So what if the bosses don't hit as hard? That's not the damned point! The point is, they fucked up with the fact that our avoidance is too high once again; and they have no idea how to fix it. Cue: Sunwell Radiance 2.0

[Deleted]

So instead of adopting the whole "We don't want another Sunwell Radiance" and coming up with a creative solution to the problem, they just cheese it with the same stupid mechanic.

AT LEAST IT HAS A DIFFERENT NAME!

[Ghost-Flight]

I guess it means more stam stam stam stam for my bear

[SoulPoetry]

^^ Knows what he is talking about. Please read.

except ferals don't have the same avoidance from dodge as other tanks have from everything.

[Mantrik]

Looks like healing is going to be bit pain mainly in hardmodes than current ones.

[Thaak]

A couple people mentioned just having the boss attack faster but do less damage, the problem with that is it trivializes content. First it makes block overpowered due to current block mechanics. Second if the boss is throwing out the same dps, but 2 or 4 times as fast attack speed, its mathematically the same in the long run, but its the short term that really matters. I'll throw out some "round" numbers for easy math.

Tank health 52k.
Tank avoidance 60%
Boss damage 12.5k dps, 2 sec swing= 25k hits every 2 seconds.

Basically with no heals it takes 3 hits in a row to kill you. 4 seconds from time of first hit.

You have a 40% chance to get hit once.
16% chance to take 2 in a row.
6.4% chance to take 3 in a row.

Boss damage 12.5k dps 1 sec swing 12.5k hit every second.
No heals = 5 hits to die. 4 seconds from first hit.

You have a 40% chance to get hit once.
16% chance to take 2 in a row.
6.4% chance to take 3 in a row.
2.56%chance to take 4 in a row.
1.024% chance to take 5 in a row.

Both setups "worst case" you die in 4 seconds. However in the first scenario you're over 6 times more likely to hit that worst case scenario, than you are with the lower damage faster swings. And we all know its not the long term average damage that kills a tank, its the burst.

[Moridius]

It's a flat percentage decrease to dodge. Unless you have less than 20% dodge, this isn't going to reduce the value of dodge on gear at all. It also doesn't affect druids more than other tanks...if a druid had 40% total avoidance before, all dodge, and a warrior had 40% total avoidance as 25% dodge and 15% parry, the druid will now have 20%, all dodge, and the warrior will have 20%, 5% dodge and 15% parry. Adding 5% more dodge via dodge rating on gear would bring both back up from 20% to 25%. So, how is this making parry more valuable than dodge and affecting druids more than other tanks unless there are tanks out there with less than 20% dodge now (certainly not true of any even non-druid tank capable of tanking ICC)?

Quoting this again.. if only this could flash before anyone posts something about druids getting the shaft.

[Naydie]

Nice to see Blizzard learns from mistakes they made in the past. :-X

[Tankyouverymuch]

except ferals don't have the same avoidance from dodge as other tanks have from everything.

If only ferals were compensated for this in some way.

[loftus]

if all the bear tanks posting in this thread are as dumb as they sound i dont think ICC is really on the agenda.

[Amgyn]

its funny tho half the topics on this site bash blizz for not having swp level raids, then they do this and everyone freaks cuz its gonna be hard like swp.

qft.... can't please everybody.

[Moridius]

except ferals don't have the same avoidance from dodge as other tanks have from everything.

But don't druids have better armor mitigation than warriors and paladins? I thought this was the trade off with blocking...

I'm not going to comment on DKs, as I know nothing about them, other than I hate it when I see I have to heal one now.