The time has come.... for Sleep

[Tankkuun]

oops i forgot to mention i already knew this so that oh-so-clever nerds couldn't call me out on it.

oh wait i did mention it, and you just didn't read my wall of text

troll harder

He wasn't trolling. He is just an idiot

[BHD]

As someone stated, priests can MC and let the other mobs kill it, plus they have shackle. I didn't think of those ^^ I do remember the effectiveness (and the fun) when the priest mind controlled a mob like that.

Hm. From a Healer PvP perspective;

Druids - Cyclone (they don't need to worry about leaving Tree Form anymore) + Entangling Roots
Shamans - Hex + Earthbind Totem
Paladins - Hammer de Justice and Divine Shield (I need to see what they do with DS though)
Priests - Psychic Scream

Druids have a Spammable (3 times before DR = immune?) and a snare.
Shamans have arguably the best "sheep" and have a good escape plan (Totem -> Ghost Wolf)
Paladins have a stun and an immunity bubble.
Priests have a 30s fear which fears a target for 10 seconds which is easily dealt with (especially by Warriors, or Rogues who CloS and DKs who AMS).

I'm obviously biased here, but I do see Priests and Paladins as the weakest in this area.

I see your point on this one, but just to save what could be an interesting discussion, for a better thread, the CC he suggested was for shadow only. So there's no point in bringing up different healers and how well they CC in arena (:

[Devanox]

i dont think a spammable CC is what spriests need, Fearbomb when used on CD and catching more than one person at a time is game-breaking most of the time and normally forces trinkets.

umm, several ideas for CC would be...

make shackle a 10 secs root on a short CD. (general priest CC)

A talent in Shadow that would change mind Control to do something shadowy
Ex.1: When you MC someone in shadowform, you channel a dot/drain that also returns mana to the Spriest/sec

Ex.2: When you MC someone while in shadowform, the MC'ed target becomes infused with shadow energy allowing the target to use three new shadow abilities for the duration of MC. (this will make MC more dynamic in PvP and also works for PvE to a certain extent)

Four abilities: Shadow blast (arcane blast sort of move), Shadow release (depletes charges of shadow blast to give a %damage buff on the spriest when MC breaks), Shadow Implosion (slows all targets in a 15 yrd radius around the MC'ed toon and explodes causing large aoe damage, channeled)

i dont know some ideas i just came up with xD

[Annesh]

i'm abandoning this thread, mostly because i only wrote it up while bored at work

i still believe it would be cool and fun and totally not impossible or even hard to balance at all

but the important thing is that even if i campaigned hard for it, here and on the official forums and everywhere else, it has about a 0.00001% chance of being seriously considered by the devs, and even less chance of making it in, especially in the form i'd like to see it have

edit: pipe dream. yeah, that's what it's called.

sleep is my pipe dream.

[Bigslick]

As someone stated, priests can MC and let the other mobs kill it, plus they have shackle. I didn't think of those ^^ I do remember the effectiveness (and the fun) when the priest mind controlled a mob like that.

Good times in shadow labs, I remember thee well... (trash packs before Blackheart)

[Repo123]

Shadow doesn't need any more CC. They are borderline OP'd as is.

[Frizer]

Err... they could make MC less stupid... it cc us aswell. or at least lower the cast time. 3 seconds is waaay too much.

[Annesh]

Shadow doesn't need any more CC. They are borderline OP'd as is.

/facepalm

[Thrayne]

i'm abandoning this thread

Oh, Alright

/facepalm

/facepalm

[Annesh]

/facepalm

/facepalm

/palmface

[Ultima]

Yeah, that's stopping there.

[Twoflower]

Where every class and their dog's mother's kitchen sink has crowd control... One class... Is left alone...

Fear and shackle aint enugh cc ?

[Direshadow]

I can already pretty much keep a caster locked down with series of CC's and silences... adding another form of CC would make us overpowered.


Scream

Horror

Silence

Sleep

Scream again?

[Vook]

IMO Priest has enough CC:

Instant, short-CD AoE fear
Undead shackling (DK pets)
Mind Control
Disarm/Horror

Any more CC's and people will QQ that priest has too many CC's.

[Blackmorgrim]

There are several issues with Priest CC that have been longstanding problems for the class.

Psychic Scream: The CC has 8 yard range, and probably the lowest damage threshhold of all fears. Since warlock fears are single target, they generally have no problem giving you a full spread of dots for 5 or so seconds, refresh the fear, while they heal to full from drain life. Psychic Scream's effect however, will usually break after 1 tick of VT.

8 yard range wasn't so bad back in vanilla. Then when BC came around rogues whined and complained that priests could fear them at melee range before they could sap them. Now, nearly all melee can instant CC a priest at range, preventing fear from even being used at close range. Several classes also can make themselves immune or break fear at will, plus there's pvp trinkets or racials. With a least 23 seconds between every use of psychic scream, that's more than enough time for a melee to kill a priest several times over, before scream is up.

On top of that, its not like Psychic fear can keep an opponent at range like most other caster CC's. A target needs to get in melee range to be hit by it. Where it can usually be broken out of fairly easily, allowing them to stun, slow, silence, and otherwise beat a priest to a pulp while they're defenseless.


Psychic Horror: Its a great CC with a lot of potential. Unfortunately, nearly all melee classes have a talent that reduces disarm time by 50%. There's also metas that reduce it further, as well as weapon chains. (not that they are commonly used by all classes) So in pvp terms, the length of the effect is a mere 5 seconds, on a 120 second cooldown. The 36 yard range helps it immensely, allowing you to DoT up a target in relative safety. If the target is already DoT'ed it can be combo'ed with Mind Control, allowing the DoTs to continue to tick for 10 seconds, and preventing a healer from healing them. If its cooldown were taken down to a minute, I feel it would be on par with similar CC's. Like HoJ.


Mind Control: It has a lot of potential, which is usually overshadowed by the spell's short range, long cast time, and the fact that it CC's the caster as well. Prior to death grip, this one of the few ways to pull a ranged target from a safe vantage point. With longer range, and/or a shorter cast time, Mind Control could very well become good. Even more so if Blizzard made use of tech they currently have, allowing Mind Control to give use of player abilities along the lines of the main specs.

The main issue I have with most Priest CC is the fact that they are on insanely long cooldowns compared to their effect, or CC the caster as much or more than the target (mind flay reduces the target's speed by 50%, and mine by 100%). I feel the damage cap placed on fear either needs to be removed, or stuns need to have a similar one put in place. Also, given a priest's lack of movement abilities, and melee's ability to place slowing effects on a caster almost as fast as they are removed... this puts a priest in a very bad position, considering none of its CCs do a good job at keeping a melee target at range. Even further reducing this effectiveness is the priest's lack of instant damage, and the need to stand still to do any real damage, combined with nearly all melee having a way to move within melee range quickly or disable a priest's ability to cast at range.

Also keep in mind, in Cataclysm, EVERY healer build will have the ability to dispel magic. This means all priest CC can be dispelled by any healer.

[Dyra]

I don't think we really need another CC to go with the ones we already have, seeing as shadow PvP would then have too many, but I would like Shackle to be expanded and CC either demons or elementals as well as the undead. Forgive me if I'm wrong, as I'm part of the no beta club, but there doesn't seem that there will be much in the way of undead mobs to shackle, while there is the potential for a great many demonic or elemental mobs to CC. Even though I'm a healer I like to be part of the CCing action, which rules out Mind Controlling too. Which just leaves the fear bomb, which more often than not will lead to me getting my ass kicked approaching the trash mobs or them running wildly across the room and pulling even more mobs. As a shadow priest I won't mind doing the occasional Mind control, especially if the mob gives some sort of awesome buff, but that effectively means I won't get to be a shadow priest. I'll be a renegade trash mob contributing very little in the overall scheme of things, while the other 4/9/24 members of my party get to do what they do best.

[Abandon]

I can already pretty much keep a caster locked down with series of CC's and silences... adding another form of CC would make us overpowered.


Scream

Horror

Silence

Sleep

Scream again?

You are assuming that Sleep would basically be a stun where you can keep damaging them. I don't think Sleep would tip the scales and make you overpowered against casters if it was a 1.5 second cast single target CC that broke on damage, it wouldn't really make much of a difference against the person you are killing since it would get broken by your DoTs anyway. It could be more like Polymorph where you use it for control on a target you are not trying to damage or in PVE.

[Deyus]

8 yard range wasn't so bad back in vanilla. Then when BC came around rogues whined and complained that priests could fear them at melee range before they could sap them. Now, nearly all melee can instant CC a priest at range, preventing fear from even being used at close range. Several classes also can make themselves immune or break fear at will, plus there's pvp trinkets or racials. With a least 23 seconds between every use of psychic scream, that's more than enough time for a melee to kill a priest several times over, before scream is up.

As with the OP, I think there's too much focus on the current state of the game. Blizzard has been pretty adamant about reducing the "arms race" of CC / anti-CC abilities in the game, so we can probably expect that some of the ways that we are currently locked down or have fear mitigated by melee will disappear in Cataclysm.

That said, I don't see why "sleep" would be needed. As someone else noted earlier in the thread, we already have a great spammable CC spell in Shackle. Maybe the right solution is to allow it to act on all mobs instead of only undead?

If it's shadow priests that we're primarily worried about, one thing that I think would be a very cool (and in the same spirit as a PVP CC ability) would be a "shadow prison" similar to what the Blood Prince Council has on heroic mode. Something that gives melee a penalty for chasing us, and allows us to do a bit of damage while trying to kite them. At the very least it would be unique!

[Pyronius]

I'm not actually interested in discussing the balance issues of it quite yet

Then.. No. No they shouldn't.

[Zoulis]

maybe because its a pure healer class and not a hybrid yet they do some of the highest dmg of any class and i got cc locked and nuked to death with 1224 resilliance from 100%-0% in the space of 10 seconds

stfu please priest cc is fine.

We don't need another CC for sure ... + i wouldn't trade any of the CCs we have atm for sleep.
now ... if u're bad enough to stay in the open and let the priest free-cast with no CCs etc then u deserve to be nuked down in 10secs.... i mean come on .. i don't know what class u are but the only class that can get that is a resto sahmmy and in duels even if he is good because..well there is nowhere to hide.
But come on if u're telling me that in arena a shadowpriest can nuke u down from 100%-0 in 10secs either u or ur partner(s) or most likely both(all of u) of u are doing something terribly wrong.
Now the pure healer class statement reminds me of lvl 30 instances ( OMG u're a priest u can't be dps'ing u must be healing ! ) are u joking? we are a hybrid ...
Anw no we're not OP ... come on we can still die really quickly our defensive CCs are on a minimum 23sec cooldown that's for pvp i won't talk about not being OP in pve cause it's pretty obvious.
so come on be realistic... no we don't need another CC but the points u gave aren't valid sorry.
Cheers
Zoulis