[TV] Doctor Who

[Gallahadd]

Was he wrong about that?

Technically, no. He’s correct that there isn’t a Christmas special this year. However, it’s not because they’re out of ideas, it’s because it’s been moved to New Years Day instead. Which seems like a REALLY bad idea, from where I’m sitting.

[eschatological]

It feels like they’re going out of their way to put the Doctor in situations where her new gender is a handicap, just so she can moan about it...

This is literally the first episode where I think the Doctor being a woman was a factor. And we're 8 episodes into a 10 episode series. It was barely mentioned in the pilot, and then that's the last time even acknowledging it seemed a thing.


It did come off as heavy-handed though. And the King James character would have been more interesting if they had delved into his old school deviancy and his struggles to be a godly man despite his latent homosexuality. That would have been an interesting examination of witchcraft, and his authorization of the KJV of the Bible.

[Deleted]

I saw this thread up. I see theres mixed reactions. I simply lost interest when i heard the next doctor is gonna be female. It felt forced and at odds with what i see the doctor as.
I do hope this chapter comes to a close sooner rather than later. I'd love to be interested again when they aren't forcibly changing characters sexes for no reason. Hopefully it doesn't kill the series outright.

[Moralgy]

I saw this thread up. I see theres mixed reactions. I simply lost interest when i heard the next doctor is gonna be female. It felt forced and at odds with what i see the doctor as.
I do hope this chapter comes to a close sooner rather than later. I'd love to be interested again when they aren't forcibly changing characters sexes for no reason. Hopefully it doesn't kill the series outright.

Why did it feel forced?

[Deleted]

Why did it feel forced?

I dunno... maybe the facts that the first what? 12 doctors were men?

It's like changing superman's sex after 60 years. It just feels forced.

I am of the same opinion with movies like Ghostbusters, for example. But it works the other way around too. I wouldn't be very happy with "Wonder men" instead of wonder woman. Characters just settle into their personas. Changing their sex is just a terrible way to artificially create something new in the old. But the thing is, it's so out of place that it just doesn't work.

[Sunseeker]

I dunno... maybe the facts that the first what? 12 doctors were men?

It's like changing superman's sex after 60 years. It just feels forced.

I am of the same opinion with movies like Ghostbusters, for example. But it works the other way around too. I wouldn't be very happy with "Wonder men" instead of wonder woman. Characters just settle into their personas. Changing their sex is just a terrible way to artificially create something new in the old. But the thing is, it's so out of place that it just doesn't work.

Wonder Man and his Manazons was FUCKING EPIC!


I mean, we're talking about a time-traveling alien space-person who regenerates into new versions of themselves who has previously stated they're sexually open-minded (in a conversation with/about Captain Jack) and has stated that being Irish(Scottish? I'm a dumb American.) is a bigger deal to than any of that. Whose arch-nemesis recently regenerated into a woman (best Master EVER btw).

Dr Who's main "trick" is literally creating something new from something old. And the woman part is so bothersome because....woman?

[MatadorMedia]

WTF is wrong with these people? They can't shit out 10 short stories in a YEAR?

Well, they haven't had 1 good story this season. So, I guess not...

Now I know that the first season of every Doctor is a little sketchy as they develop their own character - except Eccleston who is a God - but I mean we are 8 episodes in and Whitaker still has zero personality it's really frustrating. Wanting to save everyone and narrating what's happening only goes so far in Who-Land.

[Deleted]

Wonder Man and his Manazons was FUCKING EPIC!


I mean, we're talking about a time-traveling alien space-person who regenerates into new versions of themselves who has previously stated they're sexually open-minded (in a conversation with/about Captain Jack) and has stated that being Irish is a bigger deal to than any of that. Whose arch-nemesis recently regenerated into a woman (best Master EVER btw).

Dr Who's main "trick" is literally creating something new from something old. And the woman part is so bothersome because....woman?

I gave my opinion, if you disagree, it's your deal. I'm not really interested in this debate. He was always a man, with a certain personality about him that can't just be sex flipped. Shoehorning some things on later seasons to ease way for it doesn't in any way change that for me. I know the excuses and they don't change what is an obvious fact. The doctor was created a man and had 12 man versions. The time to make him an it, passed a long time ago.

Feel free to be open minded. I have no problem if you like it. Good for you. But i don't, and nothing you say can change that.

PS: I'm not answering anymore questions on this topic. Respect other people's opinions as they do yours.

[Sunseeker]

Well, they haven't had 1 good story this season. So, I guess not...

Now I know that the first season of every Doctor is a little sketchy as they develop their own character - except Eccleston who is a God - but I mean we are 8 episodes in and Whitaker still has zero personality it's really frustrating. Wanting to save everyone and narrating what's happening only goes so far in Who-Land.

Personally I think the big issue is character bloat. A story only has so much room for developed characters, and the more you add in, the more you take away from the other characters. Like, drop Ryan and give the Doctor back some goofy "I'm an alien, I don't get it!" moments. Drop Yaz and give the Doctor back the "I'm a big bad space-time cop!" Drop Graham and give the Doctor back that obnoxious optimism. You'd also make room for the remaining companions to have more character of their own.

I also GREATLY dislike episodic shows, especially when they are continuations of serialized shows. There IS an underlying story to all of Doctor Who, that's part of what makes us tune in next week! To strip that out and just do one-shots is IMO, missing what the show really has to offer.

And no, the episodes aren't great. Sure, they've got some good moments, but I can watch Captain Planet and basically see the same thing.

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PS: I'm not answering anymore questions on this topic. Respect other people's opinions as they do yours.

Then go find another board. This is a public discussion board, if you don't like getting your opinion challenged in a respectful way (which I was), don't post.

[Deleted]

[I]


Then go find another board. This is a public discussion board, if you don't like getting your opinion challenged in a respectful way (which I was), don't post.

Oh you can challenge all you want, but i don't have to engage in "No, i'm right! No, you!" discussions. It's childish and a waste of time.

[Sunseeker]

Oh you can challenge all you want, but i don't have to engage in "No, i'm right! No, you!" discussions. It's childish and a waste of time.

And yet, your post was literally that.

[eschatological]

I gave my opinion, if you disagree, it's your deal. I'm not really interested in this debate. He was always a man, with a certain personality about him that can't just be sex flipped. Shoehorning some things on later seasons to ease way for it doesn't in any way change that for me. I know the excuses and they don't change what is an obvious fact. The doctor was created a man and had 12 man versions. The time to make him an it, passed a long time ago.

Feel free to be open minded. I have no problem if you like it. Good for you. But i don't, and nothing you say can change that.

PS: I'm not answering anymore questions on this topic. Respect other people's opinions as they do yours.

What about the Doctor's personality was so male-centric that his sex couldn't be changed?

Hint: No personality trait is solely the domain of either sex.

[Deleted]

And yet, your post was literally that.

So was yours. Blatantly denying the obvious and telling me cause they added a female one last season it's all good. But alas.

Why are you even so touchy about it? I don't like it. Does it make me like it if i were to accept the excuses? No, i still wouldn't like it. The excuses are enough for you, but they aren't for me. There is no further discussion to be had. There is no logic, there are only opinions. So, we can debate who can be stubburn the most or we can move on. Blame me for being practical.

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What about the Doctor's personality was so male-centric that his sex couldn't be changed?

Hint: No personality trait is solely the domain of either sex.

I don't agree. I think the Doctor is a flirty, boastful and clever guy. A woman doing the same doesn't quite come across the same way as there are behaviours that are seen as more acceptable on a gender than the other and even how to express those behaviours.
For example, flirty can be comical or silly for guys but seen as slutty for women atempting the same stunt. It resonates differently with the audience.

[Doctor Funkenstein]

My prognostication came true, the viewership is collapsing, it was inevitable. Get woke go broke.

It had nothing to do with that.

It was the shitty writing and the awful casting (especially of the Doctor). If they had cast someone like Michelle Gomez (who played Missy) -- you know, someone who's actually good with some real on-screen charisma and whose accent didn't make her sound like a mentally-defunct dipshit that can't even remotely pretend to sound intelligent -- and the writing wasn't completely shitty, then it'd be fine. The "woke" stuff had fuck-all to do with why this series is awful. They just made wretched choices with the cast, including the companions.

It doesn't help that it's clear both her and Chibnall were planning on bailing ASAP from the very start.

[eschatological]

So was yours. Blatantly denying the obvious and telling me cause they added a female one last season it's all good. But alas.

Why are you even so touchy about it? I don't like it. Does it make me like it if i were to accept the excuses? No, i still wouldn't like it. The excuses are enough for you, but they aren't for me. There is no further discussion to be had. There is no logic, there are only opinions. So, we can debate who can be stubburn the most or we can move on. Blame me for being practical.

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I don't agree. I think the Doctor is a flirty, boastful and clever guy. A woman doing the same doesn't quite come across the same way as there are behaviours that are seen as more acceptable on a gender than the other and even how to express those behaviours.
For example, flirty can be comical or silly for guys but seen as slutty for women atempting the same stunt. It resonates differently with the audience.

That you see those behaviors as different in men than women is probably why people wanted a female Doctor. Next you'll say an angry Eccleston is badass, but an angry Whitaker would just be a bitch.

There is no difference between a female Doctor being flirty, boastful, or clever, from any of the male Doctors. The last two are especially egregious, and belies your belief in "what women should be."

[Torto]

It had nothing to do with that.

It was the shitty writing and the awful casting (especially of the Doctor). If they had cast someone like Michelle Gomez (who played Missy) -- you know, someone who's actually good with some real on-screen charisma and whose accent didn't make her sound like a mentally-defunct dipshit that can't even remotely pretend to sound intelligent -- and the writing wasn't completely shitty, then it'd be fine. The "woke" stuff had fuck-all to do with why this series is awful. They just made wretched choices with the cast, including the companions.

It doesn't help that it's clear both her and Chibnall were planning on bailing ASAP from the very start.

If they had to go with a female (they didn't), I'd probably been happier with someone like Joanna Lumley. At least she is engaging and worth watching.

[Kokolums]

Why did it feel forced?

I think many will feel its forced due to timing.

Had they cast a female doctor in 1996, or 1999, or 2005, it wouldn't feel forced and more accepted. When Joanna Lumley briefly played a female doctor, people just welcomed it because there wasn't a political cloud hanging over it. The problem comes when one political party / ideology in particular suddenly has pushed women's rights very high up on its list of priorities in recent years, followed swiftly by many TV shows and films adding more female leads. THAT makes it feel forced to many because they believe they didn't cast her because she was the best choice, but because politics. With Lumley in 1999, there was a more unified view that she was the best choice for that moment, but with Jodie Whitaker in 2018, now you have a significant contingent that will say this is political. Then there is the accusation from the other side that this isn't about women's rights at all, its just about trying to divide the public on an issue to win votes, and this issue just happens to be men vs women. So you get tons of resentment incoming.

If you want to prove to people that its just about hiring the best person, then do it when men vs women isn't a big political issue at all. Otherwise, it opens a can of worms and a lot of hate getting thrown around.

[Wezmon]

I think many will feel its forced due to timing.

Agree with what you have said and to add I think social media doesn't help. Back in the late 90s opinions were mostly kept to themselves, whereas now they are voiced globally from your living room. Add to that, no matter how odd your opinion, you can always find plenty of others that will share it. This is the same with in walks of life nowadays, its one reason why the US (and others) is getting so divided politically and ideologically.

[Nattwenny]

The new Doctor is great and I'm digging the companions as well. Especially Graham.

[Kokolums]

Agree with what you have said and to add I think social media doesn't help. Back in the late 90s opinions were mostly kept to themselves, whereas now they are voiced globally from your living room. Add to that, no matter how odd your opinion, you can always find plenty of others that will share it. This is the same with in walks of life nowadays, its one reason why the US (and others) is getting so divided politically and ideologically.

There wasn't politics intertwined into Sigourney Weaver starring in the Alien franchise, so people just accepted a female action star in a major film. Had that casting been made today in 2018, there would be plenty of anger and resentment because people would see it as a political move.