Prayer of Healing & PW:S Nerf Seriously???

[Inkompetent]

PW:S NEEDS to be nerfed. At the moment disc priests are off the charts in healing effectiviness. I don't see any other healing class or spec even getting close to disc priests in healing after the buff to PW:S, so the new nerf is completely justified. I can't speak for PoH though, but priests definitely seem to do fine anyway.

[Bigslick]

Mm, well if you're trying to raid heal as disc, that's your problem right there. Disc is a TANK HEALER. You should not be spamming PoH at all. You should be spamming Penance.
And before you post replies, l2play.

What disc excels has been changing a lot this expansion. At the present moment disc is an exceptional tank healer and lackluster raid healer - though both roles can be tackled. And before telling someone to l2play, don't tell them that the way to play is to spam a spell that can't be spammed due to cd.

@OP, disc is still fine. For tank healing, we're exceptional. For raid healing, we are required to be intelligently selective about our spells. When do we prayer, whom do we PoM (not always the tank), when is it still appropriate to spam some shields (and yes, if you manage your cd's properly you can still blanket a fair number of people before some raid damage events) and when do we barrier. The nerf to the persistent spamming of PW:S simply makes it more difficult for people to steamroll shields and deliver high HPS via one spell with little consequence to lack of skill (not saying those who spammed shields lacked skill - there is a skill to it - but rather that the difference between them was minor).

[Deleted]

While I don't agree with all the point the OP makes he has a point.
Disc is lacking in power compared to others again after this nerf.
A powerful PW: S is THE ONLY thing that makes us competitive. Penance is nice for sure but it's on a realtively long CD.
For tank healing we are sort of in a good place since DA can be fully utilized and we have quite a few abilities that help alot when focusing on one or a few targets.

For raid healing though we are not in a good spot any more. Sure, if you count DA our group heals are actually quite good but the problem is that they are not used.
To fully utilize our absorbs we need to PRE SHIELD.
Ok I can understand those who are against one skill spamming but the reason we do that is the LACK OF OPTIONS.

I would love to have more tools that let us utilize our absorbs but the fact is we don't except for certain bosses where there is continious damage to the whole raid for a longer duration. In these situation we can actually do really well but are we supposed to only be viable for those fights?

Blizzard needs to sit down and really think this through. Personally I love the damage mitigation/absorb with strong spot healing play style but it needs some attention to be viable for different situations without being OP like it became for a short while after the patch.

[scandore8472]

What disc excels has been changing a lot this expansion. At the present moment disc is an exceptional tank healer and lackluster raid healer - though both roles can be tackled. And before telling someone to l2play, don't tell them that the way to play is to spam a spell that can't be spammed due to cd.

Disc has always been a fantastic tank healer, the buff to PW:S made them too good at doing both. The nerf to PW:S just goes to show that Blizz wants disc to be the 'tank heal' spec w/ good raid heal support. If you want to raid heal, go holy. It's better at it. Are there fights where pre-shielding is viable, yes, but those are the exception, not the rule.

[Bigslick]

Disc has always been a fantastic tank healer, the buff to PW:S made them too good at doing both. The nerf to PW:S just goes to show that Blizz wants disc to be the 'tank heal' spec w/ good raid heal support. If you want to raid heal, go holy. It's better at it. Are there fights where pre-shielding is viable, yes, but those are the exception, not the rule.

In early WotLK disc was a better tank healer than raid healer; in late WotLK that flipped - the argument that disc was a fantastic tank healer in H ICC lacks, unless you're basing it on the premise of their being a great second healer to support the main healer on the tank for EH purposes - but their greatest contribution would be realized focusing on the raid, not the tanks. That which a healer excels in can be shuffled around with talent revamps over time and even within an expansion.

The buff to PW:S did not make them too good at both -- we're in a good space on tank healing now but certainly not overpowered given our relative deficiency in raid healing. The nerf wasn't to say disc was a tank healing spec w/ good raid support, but rather that the raid support it does offer will not be in the form of shield spam. For the moment it's putting us into more of that focus, but it's highly unlikely Blizzard will leave our arsenal for raid healing as limited in range and effectiveness as it is today.

[Rocap]

Wow there is a lot of hate going on here. Like wow...
He may not have constructed his post as well as he could have... But L2P as every single reply?
Anyway, he is correct for some of it. They nerfed everything that was going somewhere for disc. Where I don't think bubblespam is where its at, or where it should be, theres a lot of haters hatin on it. It does cost quite a bit of mana to push out a few shields. Spam no, I said a few. You should be able to keep up 3-4 shields going, given normal raiding conditions apply, but you cant. I think the raid healing is actually ok to be honest, POH gets huge buffs from aegis. Given im only offspecing normal mode raids... I keep up when I need to. Its by no means easy though. Paladins are tank healing better, and the same paladin is raid healing better at the exact same time.

[Vook]

Wow there is a lot of hate going on here. Like wow...
He may not have constructed his post as well as he could have... But L2P as every single reply?

It's because he's freaking out and QQing that "OMG DISC SUCKS SOOO BAD QQ QQ QQ WANNA QUIT WOW QQ", when Disc is not horribly nerfed/unviable at all. That's why there's so many l2p posts, because, well...it's the truth, in this case. Doesn't help that he's being extremely rude in his replies to peoples' posts. I'm assuming he's trolling.

[Spike`]

lol at disc now, i played disc pre 4.0.6 raid wise and mostly tank, also played holy

now? holy is 200% better on raid and 150% better at tank, with the gear and holy capable of way better mana regen with chacka serenity on the mix, holy is now way more faster and efficient on tank heal

but i know, will get flamed aswell of l2p etc etc, get gear and then play tank with holy and be prepared to the easy mode and way more mana at the end of the fight

(this on Heroic mode 10 man)

i really like more disc but now simply playing disc on hc is only for barrier

[Bigslick]

now? holy is 200% better on raid and 150% better at tank, with the gear and holy capable of way better mana regen with chacka serenity on the mix, holy is now way more faster and efficient on tank heal

Holy better at raid healing than disc right now? Sure, I'll grant you that. They need to fix the imbalance disc is experiencing after our ability to shield the raid was nerfed without consideration for giving us additional tools beyond a lackluster PoH.

Holy better than disc for tank healing? Holy doesn't match the HPS that disc can deliver (including absorbs), nor does it have the wealth of CD's to use for additional mitigation / throughput.

[kronpas]

Ive been a Disc Priest for many years and ive never seen Blizz do such a piss poor job with Disc. Half our Talents are geared around PW:S now its nerfed really badly to the point without even bubble spamming its causing serious mana issues. So I was like looks like Im gonna have to go back to my old Raid Heal spec pre 4.0.6 of using Prayer of healing as my go to spell only to find out that has also been nerfed to the groun aswell.

Maybe Blizzard should just rename the spec from [Disc] to [Sloppy Tank Healer] Without Prayer of Healing and PW:S Combo Disc is left with what Greater Heal?
I dont even know what my place is anymore in a Raid. Im sure im gonna get some QQ more responces or reroll Holy but I dislike holy its a cookie cutter boring spec. I mean why even have Disc is Blizz is Making Holy so much more universal.

Blizzard is lucky Guildwars 2 or SWTOR hasnt launched yet cause I would have jumped ship by now.

very very sloppy hotfix Blizz

Definition of "many years"? Before WotLK, it was a pure pvp spec.

During WotLK, it had it ups and downs, was at its best in Ulduar then became a gimmick spec in ICC due to terrible scaling. It suddenly became the better raid healer thank to 30% buff and plethora of damage aura ablities, which made raid shield blanketing the best "heal" in the game. But being the only shielding healer brought up an issue: it required specific situations and abilities to be viable, otherwise it was a subpar healing spec. And above all, it was boring. Shield shield shield shield penance FH repeat ....

Blizz made adjustment to the spec in Catac - better heal scaling, weaker shield (partly to prevent an OP shield in pvp), quite a tank heal spec. It turned out undertuned, then it was buffed in last patch and just overnight shield blanketing strat became heated debate across forums. Honestly I didnt think how a high HP shield with spam-able manacost made sense.

now? holy is 200% better on raid and 150% better at tank, with the gear and holy capable of way better mana regen with chacka serenity on the mix, holy is now way more faster and efficient on tank heal

Properly geared (crit/mastery), disc is better at single target healing than holy. Im not a theorcycrafter nor my math English is better, so dont count on me to prove it though =)

[Chob]

1. Spellcheck, get it.
2. Grammar and punctuation, use them.
3. "pre WoTLK including ICC even all the way through BC" ? I hope you're trolling.

Disc isn't nerfed, stop complaining. Blizz doesn't want Disc priests spamming 1 button for best healing. Your situation is best fit with the response of: l2p and stop trying to raid heal with a single-target healing spec.

The 'I'm holier than thou' attitude gets tiring fast on these forums, when do people learn that not everyone has english as a mother language?

on-topic: Discipline spec is not an easy spec to master, but if you play it right it is a viable spec that brings enough tools to the table. I do agree Blizzard might have slightly overnerfed us, even with the 7 % rapture fix, but if that's the case I trust them to bring it back in line in the next content patch. I've also been playing discipline for a long time, from tempest keep, to black temple, to sunwell to where we are now. Discipline has changed often and strong, but rarely has the spec ever been so broken as the OP is suggesting. Perhaps you need to adjust your playstyle?

At people screaming pre-wotlk discipline was just a pvp spec: it was more viable for pvp than it was for pve, but it wasn't useless for pve either. I've never liked holy spec, and as such have been discipline for pretty much the entire lifetime of my priest which is since early tbc.

[Deleted]

I like were disc is at the moment. We're not overpowered yet not weak and we actually have to use all our spells, raid healing gives you a mix of Smiting, PoHing and shielding while throwing penance and maybe some gheals on the tank.

No more one button spam, that's good right?

[nagina]

If i remember correctly, DISC became PVE spec when "prayer of healing" could be used on groups, not only your own!

[Tyraldie]

To be honest, disc is in a really poor state at the moment, I run 3 Baradin Hold runs every week - every time I bring a disc priest in he does 1/3 of the healing (absorbs included) than the other healer. I am using Skada's Absorb+Healing done meter and discs are always at 20-25% of total healing+absorb done, whereas the other healer is at 65-70% healing done.

[Deleted]

PW:S NEEDS to be nerfed. At the moment disc priests are off the charts in healing effectiviness. I don't see any other healing class or spec even getting close to disc priests in healing after the buff to PW:S, so the new nerf is completely justified. I can't speak for PoH though, but priests definitely seem to do fine anyway.

its nerfed already if you didnt read the patchnotes. a shield costs now like 6-7k mana per shield so yeah i call that a huge nerf

[Chob]

To be honest, disc is in a really poor state at the moment, I run 3 Baradin Hold runs every week - every time I bring a disc priest in he does 1/3 of the healing (absorbs included) than the other healer. I am using Skada's Absorb+Healing done meter and discs are always at 20-25% of total healing+absorb done, whereas the other healer is at 65-70% healing done.

That is clearly the player, not the class. I've been running BH every week since launch and I'm always the one sitting at 65-70 % healing done. Yes, after 4.0.6 too.

[Kacie]

Every post i see is saying disc is bad, but i went disc for cho'gall last night just shielded the tanks mostly and some melee taking damage, they are very strong tank healers, the greater heals disc can pull out is alot stronger than holy.

Holy is a very strong raid healer, but if people want to raid heal, go holy, if you want to tank heal go disc both are very useful, but the poster saying holy is a stronger tank healer than disc is wrong.

[Tyraldie]

That is clearly the player, not the class. I've been running BH every week since launch and I'm always the one sitting at 65-70 % healing done. Yes, after 4.0.6 too.

Weird that I've seen 4 different disc priests heal that badly

[Chob]

Weird that I've seen 4 different disc priests heal that badly

I don't know what to say. I can promise you disc priests are not underpowered. Slightly undertuned, maybe!

If disc priests are performing that bad in BH, it's probably a combination of poor play and pvp/bad pve gear. It can't be that other healers are very good and sniping heals away from the priests, because disc priests are the ultimate heal snipers due to absorb. If you ever get a disc priest in your BH and he's failing bad, give him the following tips.

- If mana allows for it, pre-cast prayer of healing to build DA stacks before meteor slash hits
- time PoH to land right after meteor slash hits, and cast it twice per group
- use shield on cd, on tanks only, or in the fire phase on people who are dropping hp fast
- penance on cd on people who are low hp
- do not touch flash heal, do not touch renew, use PoM in fire phase but I wouldn't bother with it in normal phase


Baradin Hold is the definition of predictable damage, which means disc priests can shine there.

[Deleted]

Disc is still an awesome tank healer spec and PvP spec. It doesn't HAVE to be an awesome raid healer spec as well.