[TV/Books] Game of Thrones ***SPOILER Discussion***

[Dystemper]

I am not sure if I am too soon to jump the wagon, but I feel like this is yet-again "identity politics" in action. Plaguing art with something as shallow as identity politics should be considered crime.

I think it was just lazy ass writing, and making Bran King to justify " not giving fans what they expect" . They might as well made Drogon king, or Just for shits and giggles, Nymeria the wolf

[Endus]

There is really no way you can elevate his story since most of what happened had no witnesses that are alive to verify it. "Hey guys I am the 3 eyed raven! Trust me I i know things and can control birds" Everyone else " Fuck off ya little cunt" . The people didnt see him do shit other then be creepy as fuck. " Take our word for it people, Bran did some shit yo!"

"The people" don't know anything about Bran, and have no say in the first place, so why even bring them up? They'll know the stories they get told.

This is what I meant by not paying attention to Tyrion's speech.

The entire premise of picking the next king based on Story value is very flawed. JHe has said time and again he no longer feels, he no longer sees himself as a human or as a stark. He has no emotions. A King that lacks emotions or Empathy is not long for the throne as someone will put a dagger in his throat . And most of the other houses that need to support him know jack shit about a 3 eyed raven, or Bran stark who was presumed dead for many years prior .

This is you demanding that certain things be told in those stories, when there's no reason they would be.

Again, you weren't listening to Tyrion. He wasn't talking about the facts. He was talking about story.

All of his support is in the North who now has no responsibilities to the 6 kingdoms at all . Everyone in the south would see that arrangement as sketchy as fuck.

This is just overtly, factually wrong. He was chosen by acclaim by all the lords present, including the lords from the Southern Kingdoms.

[Shadowferal]

So...we have a few defenders...of what exactly? Writing? Story?

[Torgent]

There is really no way you can elevate his story since most of what happened had no witnesses that are alive to verify it. "Hey guys I am the 3 eyed raven! Trust me I i know things and can control birds" Everyone else " Fuck off ya little cunt" . The people didnt see him do shit other then be creepy as fuck. " Take our word for it people, Bran did some shit yo!" The entire premise of picking the next king based on Story value is very flawed. JHe has said time and again he no longer feels, he no longer sees himself as a human or as a stark. He has no emotions. A King that lacks emotions or Empathy is not long for the throne as someone will put a dagger in his throat . And most of the other houses that need to support him know jack shit about a 3 eyed raven, or Bran stark who was presumed dead for many years prior . All of his support is in the North who now has no responsibilities to the 6 kingdoms at all . Everyone in the south would see that arrangement as sketchy as fuck.

It's almost like they know what the Three-Eyed Raven is and does. Almost like they live in a world where magic exists and has existed forever.

[ParanoiD84]

Felt rushed for sure, could have needed one or two seasons more. All in all season 1-7 was amazing and season 8 was a big disappointment.

I feel like you would want the last season to be best as that's what people will remember more, so i can see they get alot of flak for rushing this, probably because they got the star wars thing to do, shame.

[Endus]

So...we have a few defenders...of what exactly? Writing? Story?

I mean, I hope you're not referring to me. The last season was stupidly rushed and it felt like a lot of necessary development was simply skipped over.

But some of the complaints people are making don't hold up.

[Dystemper]

"The people" don't know anything about Bran, and have no say in the first place, so why even bring them up? They'll know the stories they get told.

This is what I meant by not paying attention to Tyrion's speech.



This is you demanding that certain things be told in those stories, when there's no reason they would be.

Again, you weren't listening to Tyrion. He wasn't talking about the facts. He was talking about story.



This is just overtly, factually wrong. He was chosen by acclaim by all the lords present, including the lords from the Southern Kingdoms.

I woulddnt say he was chosen by acclaim. They went along with it because they didnt seem to have any alternative. And Sansa was not real keen on that even pointing out Brans got a broken dick. I get the impression they were just thinking " This is fucking stupid, lets go with it and watch the shit show". If they were just going to sell the people a story, They could have literally chosen others and made up a better story about them to be king . Someone much more appealing and a easier sell then some crippled kid who has no emotions now.

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It's almost like they know what the Three-Eyed Raven is and does. Almost like they live in a world where magic exists and has existed forever.

Magic had been absent in the TV show for well over 400 years, when the Dragons died out. The 3 eyed raven was a story mostly in the far north forgotten by most. Even in the series, no one believed in Dragons or magic any more , even when Melisandre was using it. The stories about the dragons were being dismissed in Westeros until they actually saw one

[Byuiso]

Probably. Bran was the one character who's motives should have been revealed more in this season.

I agree.

He turned out to be the most important character in the series and he had maybe 1 paragraph worth of dialogue in the final season. If anything us as the reader/viewer can be led to believe that Bran orchestrated everything.
He knew what the Night King wanted.
He knew how the Night King would die.
He knew Dany would go mad and directly because he had to tell Jon he was the true king which was not mentioned at all in the final episode.
He knew he would be king.

Makes us believe he drove Dany to madness and did it intentionally and the only one who could stop him was the Night King.

[RobertoCarlos]

And Sansa was not real keen on that even pointing out Brans got a broken dick.

Sansa has 0 chill.

[Dystemper]

I agree.

He turned out to be the most important character in the series and he had maybe 1 paragraph worth of dialogue in the final season. If anything us as the reader/viewer can be led to believe that Bran orchestrated everything.
He knew what the Night King wanted.
He knew how the Night King would die.
He knew Dany would go mad and directly because he had to tell Jon he was the true king which was not mentioned at all in the final episode.
He knew he would be king.

Makes us believe he drove Dany to madness and did it intentionally and the only one who could stop him was the Night King.

There was that period when Brandon Said " I am going now" that was never explained to what he was doing. Was he fucking with her? Was he fucking with time again in the past? Another plot point that was glossed over

[Jastall]

after giving it some though i would like to divide this episode into 2 part .

first part up to deaths of Dany - this was good cinema - expected but good.

after her death its one WTF .

the only way the ending makes sense if indeed 3 eyed raven took over Bran and played everyone .

wouldnt be surprised if this is the ending Martin intends but D&D completly fucked it with making this 6 episodes instead at least 2 seasons where s8 would be battle with night king and s9 would be dany slowly descending into madness and Bran playing people from shadows

Same here. The lead up to and including Dany's death was great, save for the woman herself going full Hitler. Jon coming to his decision was actual, proper character build-up. The council was kind of a joke however, with tons of stupid ideas, or ideas that might make sense on paper but came out of left field and suffered from very improper build-up.

The big plot is hole is why the Unsullied didn't execute Jon on the spot. Grey Worm was personally slitting the throat of surrendered soldiers he had 0 beefs with, I have a very hard time seeing him not drawing and quartering the guy who slew the queen he idolized.

[Dystemper]

I have a suspicion that in at least 1 or 2 of the spin offs, things will be resolved. At least I hope so, The only Spin off we know about takes place like 1000 years before this, I think . But they easily could do a Arya spin off and a Jon Snow spin off.

[crakerjack]

Didn't even bother reading on because none of this is true. You're basing your whole whateverness on an idea from the book.

The show NK is not a necromancer, he's just a random guy we know nothing about. But that doesn't matter at all. Everyone kept telling us how the dead beyond the wall were the big end game. Doesn't matter if you like it or not, everyone was willing to put politics aside in the ultimate battle of life against death. He was the endgame... until they decided that this wouldn't be the case anymore. Nothing about this is audience expectations, it's literally what the show'S been telling us for 10 years.

What I read was "I think the night king is the coolest villain in the series, so therefore he must have a bigger role to play than any other villain." You didn't even bother to make an argument, you just reiterated your opinion that you like him more than the others. I don't know why but that's ok. Also, not "Everyone" was talking about the night king. The only people talking about it prior to season 7 was Jon and his followers. Maybe I missed something, but Jon and his gang of wildlings aren't "Everyone" right? What other renowned houses helped with Jon because they believed in him? Dany didn't even believe him at first, she just wanted him to bend the knee.

You must be neck deep in fan fiction if you're in this much denial.

[Dystemper]

Same here. The lead up to and including Dany's death was great, save for the woman herself going full Hitler. Jon coming to his decision was actual, proper character build-up. The council was kind of a joke however, with tons of stupid ideas, or ideas that might make sense on paper but came out of left field and suffered from very improper build-up.

The big plot is hole is why the Unsullied didn't execute Jon on the spot. Grey Worm was personally slitting the throat of surrendered soldiers he had 0 beefs with, I have a very hard time seeing him not drawing and quartering the guy who slew the queen he idolized.

It had great imagery . Her walking in front of Drogon and looking like she sprouted Wings was fucking awesome. My only issue between Jon and Dany in the Throne room was she had no guards with her at all

[Florena]

Having the night king as the end game of a big evil 'will wipe out life as we know it' bad guy was a bit cliche for GOT anyway IMO. Not that I think the ending was great but I wouldn't want him to be be the endgame of this series. GOT the show and ASOIAF the books deserve better than an ending of 'unite to kill the dark lord, in comes an age of peace.'

[Endus]

I woulddnt say he was chosen by acclaim. They went along with it because they didnt seem to have any alternative.

They all agreed without any dispute or protest. That's what "acclaim" means, in this context.

And Sansa was not real keen on that even pointing out Brans got a broken dick.

That was about his inability to father an heir, not his ability to rule. And this was an advantage to Bran's being chosen. As they explained.

Magic had been absent in the TV show for well over 400 years, when the Dragons died out. The 3 eyed raven was a story mostly in the far north forgotten by most. Even in the series, no one believed in Dragons or magic any more , even when Melisandre was using it. The stories about the dragons were being dismissed in Westeros until they actually saw one

This is wildly untrue.

The Three Eyed Raven has been around, and he's not the only one with Greensight.
Warging was fairly well-known among the Wildlings.
Melisandre and (we can presume) other priests of the Lord of Light have magical powers.
There's a witch in early seasons in Essos; her magic's responsible for Drogo's death and Daenerys losing her child and becoming barren.
The Faceless Men have weird magical powers, as well.

It's a low-magic setting, not a no-magic setting.

[Fixxit the Gnome]

Don't have problem in the direction of the story or how it ended.

However, I feel it was severely rushed.

[Dystemper]

What I read was "I think the night king is the coolest villain in the series, so therefore he must have a bigger role to play than any other villain." You didn't even bother to make an argument, you just reiterated your opinion that you like him more than the others. I don't know why but that's ok. Also, not "Everyone" was talking about the night king. The only people talking about it prior to season 7 was Jon and his followers. Maybe I missed something, but Jon and his gang of wildlings aren't "Everyone" right? What other renowned houses helped with Jon because they believed in him? Dany didn't even believe him at first, she just wanted him to bend the knee.

You must be neck deep in fan fiction if you're in this much denial.

For most of the series the entire point of it was that the NK was the big bad that was going to wipe out all of mankind, and the need to get everyone onboard to fight him. Because fucking Winter was coming. That theme was hammered home time and time again. They even captured a wight to bring before Cersei Lannister to show her the dire threat the NK made

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I doubt any of the main cast want to continue working with the show. They have been at it for 10 years.

I believe bot Kit Harrington and Masie Williams both said they would be open to spin offs. They not stupid and like to get paid

[crakerjack]

For most of the series the entire point of it was that the NK was the big bad that was going to wipe out all of mankind, and the need to get everyone onboard to fight him. Because fucking Winter was coming. That theme was hammered home time and time again. They even captured a wight to bring before Cersei Lannister to show her the dire threat the NK made

And what did she do? She scoffed at them and wished them the best of luck. Even she didn't perceive it as a bad enough threat to lay her differences aside. She was ready to take on the dead by herself. Yes they talked about winter throughout the series, but just like every other story arch, the night king was no different. You convinced yourself that he was the ultimate threat and so did many others, but the real villain was the throne. Mans desire to rule, regardless of how they do it or what justifications they use. Lets just go w/ the alternate reality that the night king is the final villain. Lets say the forces at Winterfell didn't hold but enough were able to flee south to kings landing where Cercei reluctantly aids them and they all fight together. Since it wouldn't make sense for the night king to win, lets say the good guys take heavy losses but Jon eventually gets his 1v1 with the night king and kills him.

What then? The show ends because the humans survived? There has to be someone to rule them all, there has to be a king/queen. Who cares? The big culprit is that they didn't do 2-3 more seasons to stretch this all out. That's it. They should have dedicated a whole season to surviving the night king battle, but him not being the main antagonist was the right choice.

[Torgent]

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Magic had been absent in the TV show for well over 400 years, when the Dragons died out. The 3 eyed raven was a story mostly in the far north forgotten by most. Even in the series, no one believed in Dragons or magic any more , even when Melisandre was using it. The stories about the dragons were being dismissed in Westeros until they actually saw one

None of what you said is true. The children of the north were revered as magical beings. Dragons were known to have existed, nobody doubted that. Nobody doubted Melisandre's magic, they doubted the source,