World First Race:

[vizzle]

To people advocating that 10 and 25 should be the counted on the same race... you guys have to get it out of your heads that this is about 10man bashing. It's not. It's about basics. Out of every 25man group, there will always, always, always be the best 10. If we're not even going to consider 25man as different from 10man anymore (which is stupid, because they are different), then for the sake of pure world first competition, anyone who is raiding 25man is wasting their time, because they could just cut their 15 lesser players and keep the best 10 out of their already amazing group.

[Deleted]

Are you the ripslyme from Tichondrius in vanilla?

no im not

[TJ]

A guild who actually got a World First on a tier end boss are not in the "big guns" group but Blood Legion are?

Yeah, sounds stupid but at the same time it makes sense. They didn't win out of outplaying the others, they won because they were able to stack more arcane mages with legendaries because of the resets they had and defeat the cockblock fight. If you want to count that as a world first then go ahead but I personally won't.

[Ashrr]

Yeah, sounds stupid but at the same time it makes sense. They didn't win out of outplaying the others, they won because they were able to stack more arcane mages with legendaries because of the resets they had and defeat the cockblock fight. If you want to count that as a world first then go ahead but I personally won't.

So Stars were the true winners of T13?

[TJ]

So Stars were the true winners of T13?

Can't remember if TW were in the same situation as KR in regards to the T12 lockout so I can't say.

[Crashdummy]

I'm going to take this completely out of context, but civil rights movements would like to have a word with you.

Nice there, i should clarify that i'm talking about race in the meaning of competition to get first to somewhere, and not as a species specification, even when i have the feeling you got the idea right, one never knows who can really belive otherwise.

[Deleted]

Will see how it goes, so far there weren't many hard bosses so the american 1 day head start pretty much makes them "the winners". Though Method's efforts are impressive, catching up so fast in 25man.

As for the whole 25 vs. 10... Arguing they are similiar is ridiculous to say the least. I don't want to get into the whole discussion, I will just say that if anyone cares enough to watch the 10man progression (and apparently you do?) then separate it. Call it world's 1st 10man and be done with it. The same goes for a World's first 25man kills.

[Crashdummy]

Because the MMO Champion community is the supreme judge about counting or not.

10 man does count. If i was fighting for WFs how could i possible say i was first, if i was in a 25 man guild, if someone beated the same before me? I did it in the largest way but they did it first.

/10char

MMO Champ is not the supreme judge, but since its the place where we are in... i think its relevant what the community we are in said about this last expansion.

[Smoopie]

Can we sticky this thread and merge all the trash posts into this thread? it will help clean up the forums of all the fanboy posts

[Cedimedi]

FTH is raiding with old people again...
http://www.gaming-insight.de/stream/Mogi

But i doubt it they get into top5

[Niyar]

Kin Raiders, in my opinion, only got world first because they had more legendarys than Stars and Blood Legion and had an entire reset worth of loot over Paragon and Method. However, they are obviously an amazing guild but just not on par with the big guns like Method, Stars and (the old) Paragon.

probably be called an smartass for pointing it out but. "(the old) paragon?" man i didn't even know they existed until late wrath. while method is probably one of the oldest "big" raiding guilds around.

[Tharkkun]

how can you even count Paragon? It's stupid, they're 10 man, stop fanboying them please.
Only guild sofar that have shown GOOD progress in Envy, and they'll prolly get a good rank, even if this terd thinks Envy is Ensidia xP

Blizzard flat out said to your face they are the same by merging the server 1st achievements. But keep holding onto the Myth that 25man is somehow better. We'll enjoy watching the race!

[SamR]

Currently raiding, there are 7,346 guilds with boss kills associated to their names. Of this 7,346 only 897 are 25 man, which translates to about 12.2%, implying 87.8% of guilds currently raiding are 10 man.

And yet as of this moment, 27 guilds have killed at least 2 Heroic bosses and only 8 of those guilds are doing 10-man. So there's vastly more 10-man raiding guilds, but most of the hardcore raiders at the top are in 25 man guilds. That's why a lot people care more about 25-man progression than 10-man progression.

[Deleted]

Why attacking guilds that arent your favorite people?
I don't think that anything people say against Paragon, Blood Legion, KIN, For the Horde etc, is taking anything of their value away.

And ofc scoring a tier world first is great and all, but a guild with constant presence in top 5s and top 10s is of equal value and certainly of greater value than a guild that scored a single world first "tier X" and vansished right after.

This tier is quite importand, due to the size of it (16 bosses), due to be the one that is finilizing the future of 25s (for better or worse), due to it taking place in a new continent that altered wow as a game.

I am going to enjoy watching it, in anticipation of the changes it will bring when blizzard sees the numbers of 25s shrinking even more.

Right now according to wow progress, with majority of purely casual guilds not even having scored a kill (and casual = 10 and 10 alone for the last 22 months):

Teams that scored an entry normal boss, kill:

1058 did it in 25 or 9,25% of the kills

10388 did it in 10 or 90,75% of the kills

So with teams able to score a kill within a bit more than the first week a raid is available in mind, aka the guilds that are a bit more serious about it, the ratio is already over 10 kills in 10 for every kill in 25 at entry boss.
I expect this time for the ratio to go as high as 20 to 1 at entry level, when more casual guilds (that stand no chance under the current model to be 25) come into play.

Paragon's no1 in a fake 10/25 race that even the members of paragon keep saying that doesn't exist, will only speed up the process of destroying the last remaining 25s.

[Grubjuice]

i think dragons or trolls can be considered the first race on the world of azeroth

but it's hard to say if you include things like old gods or elementals as 'races'

[stomination]

Blizzard flat out said to your face they are the same by merging the server 1st achievements. But keep holding onto the Myth that 25man is somehow better. We'll enjoy watching the race!

Blizzard dodged being attacked by the 10 man group and achievement whores by doing that. But you can go ahead and believe what you said


enjoy watching the race. FAPFAPFAPFAPFAPFAP OHOHHHHHHHHHHHHHOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH they KILLLLLLLLLLEDDDDDDDD IT

[Swirling Black Lilly]

did Paragon take a break from raiding or are they still busy?

[Farora]

So 4th boss is hard?

[Swirling Black Lilly]

So 4th boss is hard?

Very hard it seems, although I don't know which guilds are sleeping/taking a break. But it seems the third is as well cause the top 4 is standing for a long time

[Ryme]

So 4th boss is hard?

Probably a gear check of some kind.