Finland drafting legislation to ban cosmetic and religious circumcision.

[Chelly]

ITT: People who like penis cheese

I guess you're bad at cleaning your penis. It's not hard to teach a boy to touch his weewee during showers/baths.

[jaakkeli]

I don't know how old you are, but I'm 29

Actually not that much older then (32)...

You should know at least one - Ben Zyskowicz!

I used to vote for him, actually.

It's not acceptable to Jews and Muslims, and that is the problem.

Apparently Muslims tend to find it acceptable to delay it. It's only Jews that require infant circumcision.

It's true. And there weren't much Muslims in Germany those days.... I assume Muslims were just collateral damage for the nazis. Muslims(arabs) generally don't fit the nazi aryan profile really.

There were some Tatars in Poland and the Baltic states, lots of Tatars in Ukraine and then Tatars, Chechens etc in Russia. The Russians accused basically all of them of collaborating with Germany and entire ethnic groups were almost killed off in massacres and mass deportations. The Crimean Tatars in the news right now are one example, they are a tiny people in Crimea living miserably now but they didn't use to be.

Tatars don't look at all like Arabs. They look mostly European with a bit of Central Asian in the mix depending on the group.

[TirielWoW]

There were some Tatars in Poland and the Baltic states, lots of Tatars in Ukraine and then Tatars, Chechens etc in Russia. The Russians accused basically all of them of collaborating with Germany and entire ethnic groups were almost killed off in massacres and mass deportations. The Crimean Tatars in the news right now are one example, they are a tiny people in Crimea living miserably now but they didn't use to be.

Tatars don't look at all like Arabs. They look mostly European with a bit of Central Asian in the mix depending on the group.

Well, um, you have to understand that Russia had a long history of hate-ons with the Tatars. Accusing them of collaborating with the Nazis was more of an excuse than a fact.

[PACOX]

Uh...this thread went full on religion and you guys are bad discussing it.

[Mnevis]

I don't accept that American circumcision is areligious in nature. I'm not going to prove it to anyone who disagrees, I know.

The Christian portion of the Bible is extremely clear that the sacrificial ritual of circumcision is abolished for the new religion, but in the period of history when circumcision became prevalent for us anglo xians, John Kellogg and his ilk were very clear that the effect on sexuality was the primary goal of the procedures he advocated for little boys and girls who liked their privates too much. That's, to me at least, clearly rooted in Puritanical attitudes towards sexuality.

Of course we don't openly say we want it done now for Puritanical reasons, we've adopted reasoning based on what's prettiest, what Dad or the other kids at school are like, protection against diseases (because teaching your kids about condoms, or teaching him to wash his 'thing' is just, icky, right).

Even stripped of intimations that it pleases deities, I think our modern treatment (in circumcising cultures) fits under the etymological umbrella of religion. From the wikipedia article on the word religio:

Modern scholars such as Tom Harpur and Joseph Campbell favor the derivation from ligo "bind, connect", probably from a prefixed re-ligare, i.e. re- (again) + ligare or "to reconnect," which was made prominent by St. Augustine, following the interpretation of Lactantius.

Dad was cut, grandad was cut, baby will be too. It's the way we do it. It's better, cleaner, a morphology that will gain him a long, healthy life.
It's a sign he was born in a hospital, not a field like some savage.
The guys in the white coats say it's good.
It's not a mutilation, because we like it.

I'm not saying this to piss off people that think definitions are doing yoga in this thread, that's honestly how I feel.
I think those Victorian circumcision advocates were products of their environment and when they got all extremist (read what Kellogg wrote on the subject and tell me he'd not be in jail today), the environment was right there with them, ready to adopt anti-sexuality procedures to 'protect' their kids from the evils of the flesh.

Since then, the environment's changed somewhat, many, but not enough people are able to look at it with a clean slate and say "Wait, you want me to give you my baby, so you can take a knife to his privates? Wait just one god-damned second. He's fine the way he is."

So, thanks, Finns, for making a few people think twice about how acceptable taking a knife to a perfect baby should be.

[Dispraise]

That's, to me at least, clearly rooted in Puritanical attitudes towards sexuality.

That may be when/why it became popular, but that's not when it became prevalent. Shit was far too expensive in Victorian times. Didn't start being common until after WWII, when America was freakin' loaded. By that point, some of the puritanical basis had worn off. It owed some popularity to the fact that circumcisions had come to be something of a status symbol.

[Elite Peon]

Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting ....any female should vote that foreskin gets cut off IMO....I can Imagine any woman who has had one thought she was being attacked by a tube worm..

[Dispraise]

Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting ....any female should vote that foreskin gets cut off IMO

The foreskin rolls back during erection, and it looks basically the same. Should men be insisting that women mutilate their genitals to look more appealing?

[Deleted]

Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting ....any female should vote that foreskin gets cut off IMO....I can Imagine any woman who has had one thought she was being attacked by a tube worm..

As a gay man I can say that you are wrong.

[Mnevis]

It owed some popularity to the fact that circumcisions had come to be something of a status symbol.

Yeah, I touched on that with "Sign that he was born in a hospital, not a field like some savage". I don't know whether that thinking had become passe by the time I was born (protection for my partners against cancer was the reasoning given at that particular stage in the evolution of justification for circumcision).

Status symbol, a mark of being "one of the group", doesn't conflict with the point I was trying to make about it growing to a secular ritual, with explicit roots deep in puritanism.

[muto]

As a gay man I can say that you are wrong.

He said female.

[Fexus]

Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting ....any female should vote that foreskin gets cut off IMO....I can Imagine any woman who has had one thought she was being attacked by a tube worm..

Noses look disgusting. I think all babies should have their noses cut off to serve my aesthetic whims.

[Deleted]

Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting ....any female should vote that foreskin gets cut off IMO....I can Imagine any woman who has had one thought she was being attacked by a tube worm..

Just remember the vast majority of the world is uncut, and the women prefer uncut.

Then deal with the implications of that statement by cradling your cut up junk and sobbing into that anime plushie.

[Deleted]

He said female.

Right, and females know more or less about cocks than gay men?

[Dispraise]

He said female.

He opened with "Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting".

Right, and females know more or less about cocks than gay men?

This sounds like one of those trick questions they put in standardized tests. Is the answer C?

[Themius]

I feel sometimes that circumcisions are blown out of proportions, it's not like it's a damn subincision, there you have mutilation and it just doesn't make any sense.

[Fexus]

Right, and females know more or less about cocks than gay men?

Females would be AT HIGHEST 4th on the list of cock knowledge behind straight men, gay men, and urologists.

EDIT: this, of course, is if we're distinguishing sexual preference for cock knowledge rankings.

[Fexus]

Are urologists genderless?

I guess if you qualified urologists with gender and sexual preference, non-urologist straight woman would rank 7th.

[Jinali]

Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting ....any female should vote that foreskin gets cut off IMO....I can Imagine any woman who has had one thought she was being attacked by a tube worm..

Circumcised dicks look disgusting.

[Mnevis]

Uncircumcised dicks look disgusting ....any female should vote that foreskin gets cut off IMO....I can Imagine any woman who has had one thought she was being attacked by a tube worm..

Besides the obvious rebuttals that
A) It's retractable.
B) Most of the world's men are in possession of a foreskin and their women are fine with it.
C) The concept of aesthetic amputations of erogenous tissue on a baby should be repulsive.

The idea that women need less penis to pleasure, to manipulate, to...deal with... is also repulsive and sexist. Men can handle playing with stretchy, squishy, mobile, (even odorous!) genitalia, but women are in such need of a perfectly taut, clean organ that we must strap down and forcibly modify our children? How do you propose that nature made such a horrible error when it came to designing the male parts?