Vanilla Talent System

[Dadukester]

Just wanting to hear opinions, I personally think the current Talent System is over simplified and gives us much less diverse characters, but I know a lot of people complained about the Vanilla system being too complex, even though it gave us a TON of different combos and diversity.

I'm trying to make a basic MMO, and am planning on a talent system similar to Vanilla's where you get points each level up to spend wherever you want on the different trees (with tiers that unlock)

What do you guys prefer now? Current, vanillas, or a different rendition?

[Alvito]

Mote bad options is what it gave us. In the end you had less xhoice since the correct talents were obvious.

[randomnamegenerator16]

Vanilla system was never complex. All you had to do, is to take correct talents from cookie cutter build or else you had terribly build character. In the end, it was shit, I much prefer what we have now as it gives us some degree of choice.

Yeah... that +2% damage done from Curse of Agony was really inspiring and fun. Or something.

[Deleted]

Yeah, the old system was cool to a degree but there wasnt any meaningful choices. Passive stats are A. Not fun, and b. too open to cookie cutter. I like this idea that we change our talents on the fly, and they are mostly buttons that are in our rotations that change what we are good and bad at.

[Cæli]

The current talent system is fine to me.

Though the old talent tree is certainly needed again, it would fit perfectly for leveling, it would show what you can earn next, and you will feel more powerful with a +1 point to spent each level. And the background images were kind of part of the identity of the game. At the moment having spells popping out of thin air is a questionable design.

[Tziva]

I like the current talent concept much better than the old one. I like that I interact with and change my talents occasionally for ones that are situationally better. I never did that in the old system; I looked up the talents that mathed the highest, picked those, and otherwise never looked or touched them. I like that you don't have to go to a third party site and look up the "correct" build or be garbage otherwise (obviously it is still recommended for min/maxing but the disparity isn't as large and is still circumstantial for many talents).

I do, however, wish there were more tiers (maybe one every ten levels?). Picking talents is fun, and it was nice to have something to look forward to every-other-level in classic. I realise that is difficult for balance, it's probably hard to find ideas that aren't reminiscent of the old "check this box to gain a flat damage increase," and the leveling experience is much shorter nowadays, but it's the one thing I can think of that would make the current design better for me.

[Aux]

I like the current system due to letting me swap things on the fly.

The old system felt more rewarding, and it was pretty fun (I think it was Wotlk?) when you could spec into multiple trees. Once they locked you into one spec(cata?) it took away most of the fun.

[Serissa]

Vanilla system .... gave us a TON of different combos and diversity.

Can you stop spreading this bullshit please?

[Chrno]

Have a look at blade and soul talents. Thats a great way to do it

[slaise1]

I would prefer the vanilla talent system every day of the week. The reason is the sense of progression when lvling is a lot stronger if you have something each level than lets say... Every 15 lvls?

A modern implementation of the vanilla talent tree would be to make it wider to fit more play stiles and not as narrow as the original one. This would of course also include passive talents .

[anaxie]

Just wanting to hear opinions, I personally think the current Talent System is over simplified and gives us much less diverse characters, but I know a lot of people complained about the Vanilla system being too complex, even though it gave us a TON of different combos and diversity.

I'm trying to make a basic MMO, and am planning on a talent system similar to Vanilla's where you get points each level up to spend wherever you want on the different trees (with tiers that unlock)

What do you guys prefer now? Current, vanillas, or a different rendition?

Vanilla trees are a relic of the old MMO design that gave the issulsion of builds. You have vast amounts of customization now. back then your choice was Oh do I want 4% more armor or 6% healing taken with my left over 3 points.

So intense and hard choice!

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I would prefer the vanilla talent system every day of the week. The reason is the sense of progression when lvling is a lot stronger if you have something each level than lets say... Every 15 lvls?

A modern implementation of the vanilla talent tree would be to make it wider to fit more play stiles and not as narrow as the original one. This would of course also include passive talents .

Yeah lets go with Vanilla where you have 1-2 attacks to use all the way to 60 VS having 8+ abilties now.

Fucking clown.

[Chrno]

Can you stop spreading this bullshit please?

There were def options. 99% of the people were just to lazy to bother with respeccing. If we would've been able to switch talents like we do now it would've been sooooooo much better. Paying 50g sucked

[anaxie]

Can you stop spreading this bullshit please?

nah you totally had the choice to see if those last 4 points went into more armor or more healing taken.

So intense

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There were def options. 99% of the people were just to lazy to bother with respeccing. If we would've been able to switch talents like we do now it would've been sooooooo much better. Paying 50g sucked

It's funny because the talents now offer vastly different playstyles VS the old system.

This the epitome example of quality over quantity.

[Dadukester]

Sorry I should have rephrased it, originally vanilla was cookie cutter or crap, but gave lots of choices, would we prefer all those choices and points over the current 7 or so tiers/choices that we currently have, if it were better implemented? My main goal here is feedback as to what your ideal talent system would be

[anaxie]

The current talent system is fine to me.

Though the old talent tree is certainly needed again, it would fit perfectly for leveling, it would show what you can earn next, and you will feel more powerful with a +1 point to spent each level. And the background images were kind of part of the identity of the game. At the moment having spells popping out of thin air is a questionable design.

Open your spell book. look when you unlock abiltities

There is your carrot. Fuck old talents.

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Sorry I should have rephrased it, originally vanilla was cookie cutter or crap, but gave lots of choices, would we prefer all those choices and points over the current 7 or so tiers/choices that we currently have, if it were better implemented? My main goal here is feedback as to what your ideal talent system would be

Well now it's going to be 14 talents in WoD with two trees.

Old system was shit.

[SoulSoBreezy]

Just wanting to hear opinions, I personally think the current Talent System is over simplified and gives us much less diverse characters, but I know a lot of people complained about the Vanilla system being too complex, even though it gave us a TON of different combos and diversity.

I'm trying to make a basic MMO, and am planning on a talent system similar to Vanilla's where you get points each level up to spend wherever you want on the different trees (with tiers that unlock)

What do you guys prefer now? Current, vanillas, or a different rendition?

These days, the fact that you can swap talents on the fly makes the system superior. It means encounters and situations can be dynamic, knowing that players will switch their "loadout" as they needed to.

Before this, we could go to class trainers to fix our spec, but largely there was a "best" spec based on balancing at the time.

Oh right, your design.
IMO blizzard did right with this design, where the old "passive talents" were baked into leveling based on the player's spec. This way, because the skills and stat bonuses are mostly "under the hood," it's more manageable and less impactful on player opinion when balance tweaks are made.

[snaxattax]

the only thing I liked about the vanilla (really, cata and before) system was that it gave more consistent rewards as you leveled. in the new talent system, some classes/specs will go 25-30 levels before they get a new ability or talent that actually makes them do more damage. that's just ridiculous and anti-fun - it just makes leveling even more of a mindless slog.

[slaise1]

Vanilla trees are a relic of the old MMO design that gave the issulsion of builds. You have vast amounts of customization now. back then your choice was Oh do I want 4% more armor or 6% healing taken with my left over 3 points.

So intense and hard choice!

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Yeah lets go with Vanilla where you have 1-2 attacks to use all the way to 60 VS having 8+ abilties now.

Fucking clown.

You do realise that all the talents/spells/abilities/mechanics added throughout World of Warcrafts history wouldn't just "magically" disappear right? It would just work differently from how it is right now. I'm not sure who of us is the clown here.

[Zoneseek]

Complexity does nothing but ensure everyone is using the same cookie cutter templates

[kalaratic]

the old talent system is loved by ppl just because leveling used to take so long. when it took u like 7 hours to hit a level where u didn't even learn a new spell, u at least got something, whether it was 1% crit or something more powerful. that kind of system would never work nowadays since u level so fast, it wouldn't feel as rewarding