75 y/o sentenced to life for growing a few marijuana plants to combat chronic pain.

[Hiricine]

Those that rebel against unjust laws are brave heroes. Those that accept unjust laws are both tyrants (the enforcers) and stupid (the enforced).

I do get what you are saying, however, that both heroes and tyrants can be stupid in HOW they do things, leading to not WINNING the battles they fight.

But a tyrant who wins is still a tyrant and a brave hero who loses to a tyrant is still a brave hero and a stupid coward that accepts a tyrants rule is still a stupid coward.

I don't completely disagree with you, of course, but if the unjust law is that you get shot in the head for giving someone the finger, and then you proceed to give someone the finger and get shot in the head, you might be a brave hero, but you're still pretty stupid. In this extreme example, there are much better things worth dying for, just as there are much better things to rebel against and go to jail for than laws that prevent you from growing cannibis.

Also I don't think you can make rebelling against unjust laws as a heroic action a universality, even though there are many cases where it is. Though based on the definitions you're putting forward, I don't think someone that is scared of the consequences of what really isn't a very potentially beneficial action is a coward, and I don't think someone growing weed in their backyard for personal use (or selling) is a hero.

[Deleted]

The guy had over 34 plants.

And? What do you know about horticulture?

Marijuana use isn't a necessity to live

"I happen to live like this so every person should follow my example. Also this is the law so he shouldn't help himself because that's illegal."

This thread makes me incredibly sad.

[Sunseeker]

looks like alabama needs to rework its laws.

Mandatory sentencing, zero-tolerance policies, anything that allows the justice system to overlook the facts of the case in favor of some kind of uniform punishment has always been an absurdity.

[Fasc]

"I happen to live like this so anybody should follow. Also this is the law so he shouldn't help himself because that's illegal."

This thread makes me incredibly sad.

It isn't a necessity so that rules out any human rights or undue restrictions.

It is a drug so unless we're going to overturn how the government regulates food/drug entirely, the government can regulate it.

That's about as clear cut as it gets. Your sadness is duly noted but irrelevant, and he and his son were trafficking despite his claim it was purely for self-medication, so that honestly makes his "I have chronic pain" excuse speculative as well.

[Synadrasa]

If you're 75, a year in jail could be a life sentence.

Could also be 30

[Fasc]

Could also be 30

Could be, but isn't, hence the good that can come from this situation. He's elderly so the minimum of 3 years would likely be a life sentence anyway, and there is ample media attention and political clout being thrown about that will see (hopefully) mandatory sentencing revisions for the state of Alabama. His son got the same punishment but didn't have the four prior felonies.

[Deleted]

he and his son were trafficking despite his claim it was purely for self-medication

This is an assumption as well, isn't it?

[Fasc]

This is an assumption as well, isn't it?

Only if you treat convictions as assumptions.

[Deleted]

Only if you treat convictions as assumptions.

If I steal a woman's purse, I should be convicted of theft, not rape. Is there a proof he was dealing? If not, you are just making an assumption.

[Manabomb]

Follow. The. Laws. Of. The. Land.

Marijuana use isn't a necessity to live, even when coping with pain. And before you go with the nonsense of "you don't know" I'm a disabled veteran having played Chicken with gravity one too many times during Airborne training/missions and eventually gravity won. Pain can be managed a LOT of different ways that don't require excessive money for therapy/prescriptions or breaking the law to grow "personal use" marijuana. The guy is obviously not someone who cares much for the laws, even if he thinks they're inappropriate, so I see no issues with his imprisonment. Mandatory minimums are problematic and this is a good example, but that's irrelevant to the specific crime (illegal marijuana possession).

They raided his son's home, found $92,000 worth of pot across 42 plants, and that was that. Given his four prior felonies this isn't exactly a simple first time offender, but like I said, the mandatory minimums involved here are excessive. On the other hand, he's 75 and Alabama law would necessitate a minimum of 3 years and $25,000 fine for trafficking between 2.2 and 100 lbs of marijuana, which is what they busted him and his son for originally. 3 years at 75 and supposedly chronically in pain/ill might as well be life in prison for him, which is a win/win for Alabama to be able to reevaluate their minimum sentencing laws without having someone young stuck in jail indefinitely.

Did they count the stems and the leaves in their calculations of 92,000$ worth of product? Did they count immature plants? Did they count the oils or butters he was likely making?

This is what I'm saying and you're apart of the problem. You. Have. Literally. No. Idea. What. You're. Talking. About. You and people like you that make these laws and charge these people for these crimes without any actual knowledge on MJ and its medical uses and try to regulate it without any professional opinions.

I get that pain can be managed different ways and I'm glad you're a serviceman. But you're not a doctor. You're not a botanist or a horticulturist. You have -literally- no idea how MJ should be effectively regulated and neither do the people putting these laws into place. They have no idea what is a usable part of a plant, they have no idea what THC and CBD content is and why that is much more important than the weight of the product.

It's not even a matter of the individual thinking these laws are inappropriate. It's a need of reform and revision because science and innovation have once again outpaced regulation, especially considering the current regulation is based on unfounded or a lack of data.

[Fasc]

If I steal a woman's purse, I should be convicted of theft, not rape. Is there a proof he was dealing? If not, you are just making an assumption.

He was CONVICTED of trafficking. If you steal a purse and are convicted of theft, you're a thief. If you steal a purse and rape a woman and are convicted of theft and rape, you're a thieving rapist.

[Rooflesstoofless]

That'll tech him! Maybe next time he'll just make bathtub gin and drink himself blind because that is ok in the eyes of society.

They should have just let him sit at home and get stoned. Now the state gets to pay for ALL of his medical needs for the rest of his life.

[Manabomb]

Only if you treat convictions as assumptions.

Yeah, you're making assumptions based on your own narrative, much like your other post.

Your ignorance is the problem. Go read a book.

[Steve French]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/14/op...av=bottom-well

This is just wrong in so many ways.

I personally think this is crazy, that a sick old suffering man can't use medicine that will help him because of fucked up laws. But holy shit 3 dozen plants? 36 plants!? I smoke like crazy and only need to grow 3 plants at a time to keep myself supplied, wtf was he doing with that many plants.

[Fasc]

Did they count the stems and the leaves in their calculations of 92,000$ worth of product? Did they count immature plants? Did they count the oils or butters he was likely making?

This is what I'm saying and you're apart of the problem. You. Have. Literally. No. Idea. What. You're. Talking. About. You and people like you that make these laws and charge these people for these crimes without any actual knowledge on MJ and its medical uses and try to regulate it without any professional opinions.

I get that pain can be managed different ways and I'm glad you're a serviceman. But you're not a doctor. You're not a botanist or a horticulturist. You have -literally- no idea how MJ should be effectively regulated and neither do the people putting these laws into place. They have no idea what is a usable part of a plant, they have no idea what THC and CBD content is and why that is much more important than the weight of the product.

It's not even a matter of the individual thinking these laws are inappropriate. It's a need of reform and revision because science and innovation have once again outpaced regulation, especially considering the current regulation is based on unfounded or a lack of data.

Oh. I get it. You're under the assumption that absolutely zero people with medical knowledge have EVER been consulted or used to confirm the regulations of the US Government on any number of controlled substances to include but not limited to marijuana... /snicker

Throwing out a number of hypothetical possibilities is nice and all but without a detailed report, your guess is literally as good as mine, which is to say not of value whatsoever. You're assuming the cops, the judges, the legislatures, the voters, and any medical/pharmaceutical experts involved are 100% in the dark. We get it, you like pot, but this is absurd. You have no idea what my profession is, what my schooling/training is, what 2nd hand experience I have because of my wife's schooling/profession/training, etc, and I have the distinct feeling that even if I displayed my pharmacist license you'd just blow me off as yet another ignorant fool about the miracle of life that is marijuana.

BTW, when you can sort out the aberrant hippocampus problem associated with marijuana, I'll see your demand for deregulation entirely with some measure of seriousness.

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah, you're making assumptions based on your own narrative, much like your other post.

Your ignorance is the problem. Go read a book.

/snicker

He. Was. Convicted. Of. Trafficking.

So unless you have a soap box to hop on about the judicial system and the evidence presented against him and his son... he was a trafficker of marijuana and wasn't using it strictly for his own personal use. The end.

No amount of whining changes that... perhaps you should study the law better instead of trying to find every way in which the US is evil for regulating your precious weed.

[Manabomb]

I personally think this is crazy, that a sick old suffering man can't use medicine that will help him because of fucked up laws. But holy shit 3 dozen plants? 36 plants!? I smoke like crazy and only need to grow 3 plants at a time to keep myself supplied, wtf was he doing with that many plants.

Depends on the person. Depends if he was making butter or oils (you need a lot of plant to do either).

36 plants sounds like a lot, and in general is a lot, but I know of and have met people that treat their pain using more. (A friend I know has like, 6 mother plants alone because she loves the different strains.)

And that's another thing. Mother plants should not be regulated like budding plants. They are completely different because they don't actually produce product, they are just clone farms.

[Wyrt]

We need to end the war on drugs already. This shit is ridiculous.

[Mistame]

While the sentence is harsh and the "crime" effectively nonsense, a six month sentence may be "life" for that guy.

[Deleted]

He. Was. Convicted. Of. Trafficking.

I am not a native english speaker, so does trafficking mean just sale, or it includes illegal production and transport as well? If yes, you are still making an assumption.

[Manabomb]

Oh. I get it. You're under the assumption that absolutely zero people with medical knowledge have EVER been consulted or used to confirm the regulations of the US Government on any number of controlled substances to include but not limited to marijuana... /snicker

Throwing out a number of hypothetical possibilities is nice and all but without a detailed report, your guess is literally as good as mine, which is to say not of value whatsoever. You're assuming the cops, the judges, the legislatures, the voters, and any medical/pharmaceutical experts involved are 100% in the dark. We get it, you like pot, but this is absurd. You have no idea what my profession is, what my schooling/training is, what 2nd hand experience I have because of my wife's schooling/profession/training, etc, and I have the distinct feeling that even if I displayed my pharmacist license you'd just blow me off as yet another ignorant fool about the miracle of life that is marijuana.

BTW, when you can sort out the aberrant hippocampus problem associated with marijuana, I'll see your demand for deregulation entirely with some measure of seriousness.

- - - Updated - - -



/snicker

He. Was. Convicted. Of. Trafficking.

So unless you have a soap box to hop on about the judicial system and the evidence presented against him and his son... he was a trafficker of marijuana and wasn't using it strictly for his own personal use. The end.

No amount of whining changes that... perhaps you should study the law better instead of trying to find every way in which the US is evil for regulating your precious weed.

I am under the assumption that ignorance and lobbying have kept MJ from being decriminalized and legalized federally. And thus far, I have been pretty much 100% correct.

But please, present your license, tell me that I'm wrong. Because I've been studying for 6 years as an apprentice horticulturist specializing in MJ and I'm pretty fucking certain I know a lot more about what stages of the product actually matter for consumption than you and literally any law maker that has ever signed a law regarding MJ into effect.

He was convicted ~INTHEPAST~ for trafficking. Please don't tell me you're one of those people that believes that "once a user always a user" bullshit.

You're absolutely absurd for thinking for a second that someone should be rationally charged for the rest of his life for the possession and growing of a medical pain killer simply due to ignorance regarding the laws in place. That is a complete disregard for morality and what science and medical advances stand for. You should be ashamed at your own opinions as a "pharmacist" just like any person of science should be.

And again, you're proving my point. You and many people like you still have either very little or no knowledge regarding MJ and supporting laws based on that ignorance purely because they are "laws" is a whole new level of ignorance. Self fulfilling ignorance is what I'll call it.