Classic World of Warcraft Discussion [Megathread]

[Kyanion]

The entire difficulty curve is so whack it needs an entire overhaul with LFR being consolidated into Normal, Heroic being rebalanced and Mythic becoming cross-realm to stop the massive folding of guilds. Getting the players shouldn't be the barrier for not doing the absolute hardest content in the game. I won't go into boss design because that's an entirely different story but just know that I am not a fan of the design that has been the standard since Cata.

Legion has the right idea but there's something missing and I can't put my finger on it.

I really think LFR needs to stay but it needs to be made more difficult. Not that I see it happening but I'm not against some people being able to see the story/content on some level. It is already designed where raiders don't really have to step in LFR anymore and that is fine. (Well besides that attempt at making us go there early on for valor).

Mythic raiding IS cross-realm, I think it took a bit too long to be enabled as such but has been this way for a few months at least now for the current raid. No argument here though, forced 20 man mythic when some servers had low pops was way too brutal.

[Perkunas]

Yeah and are no more male teens going to school nowadays? Hint, the majority of gamers are either teens or young adults. Maybe WoW catering to people with a family + a job and have no time for it is the reason why it is dying

This is a great point here. Warcraft shouldn't have had to change what it was in order to keep people who can no longer dedicate time to it. These people should have moved on and let the next generation enjoy what they did for years. Instead they've jealously clung to the game forcing, through their constant stream of tears on the forums, Blizzard to change the game to accommodate them instead of simply "moving on" to something more casual. They are the ones who've poisoned the well and Blizzard is only now slowly starting to realize that they've made the game too simplistic and too convenient. Ghostcrawler has been so on point since he left it's been absolutely staggering.

[Pwellzor]

Learn some grammar and syntax.

I am going to save this for later for when someone tells me I have no argument.

[Atelniar]

You just said you don't like petitions and admit people can easily sign it more than once and yet again are going to use it as a fact?
Does your mouthy hurt talking out of both sides of it?

I used it as a fact to showcase there is genuine interest. Which there is, how high it is can be debated (I never argued it was proof of endless demand). My sole argument is the existence of private servers and their success in terms of how high the demand actually is. And that is, if I choose to neglect all the potential people who could be interested but avoid private realms. You, sir/miss, are on deep water if you bring up the idea of splitting those between WotLK and TBC as well, as I said: those big private servers numbering half a dozen are Vanilla exclusive, only.

[Pwellzor]

This is a great point here. Warcraft shouldn't have had to change what it was in order to keep people who can no longer dedicate time to it. These people should have moved on and let the next generation enjoy what they did for years. Instead they've jealously clung to the game forcing, through their constant stream of tears on the forums, Blizzard to change the game to accommodate them instead of simply "moving on" to something more casual. They are the ones who've poisoned the well and Blizzard is only now slowly starting to realize that they've made the game too simplistic and too convenient. Ghostcrawler has been so on point since he left it's been absolutely staggering.

So which is it. Is the average player a teen or 35. Because you and akka seem to be arguing in two different directions. Pick one.

[Kyanion]

No it doesn't. I cannot set up a McDonalds without paying the parent company. The fact that they allow restaurants who do pay to use their IP makes no difference.

You really just seem to be making stuff up because you have some kind of irrational hatred of private servers.

Blizzard isn't McDonalds and letting people use the 'special sauce' for Big Macs isn't the same as people handling your code. And also McDonalds screens people that want to start up a franchise. They just don't auto-accept people. Thus Blizz not taking on the Nost people and letting them go wild with the code.

[Triks]

I really think LFR needs to stay but it needs to be made more difficult. Not that I see it happening but I'm not against some people being able to see the story/content on some level. It is already designed where raiders don't really have to step in LFR anymore and that is fine. (Well besides that attempt at making us go there early on for valor).

Mythic raiding IS cross-realm, I think it took a bit too long to be enabled as such but has been this way for a few months at least now for the current raid. No argument here though, forced 20 man mythic when some servers had low pops was way too brutal.

LFR is built in such a way as to have 5-6 raiders carry the rest of the raid. If you have things like legendary quest items, relevant alt upgrades, valor or artifact progression behind raiders will do it. Consolidate it into Normal - the difficulty isn't that far off and it will be a bit more enjoyable for people.

I haven't been subbed since June of last year so I can't comment on the current Mythic situation. If they did that - kudos.

Well, from (what admitedly little) I've seen, it still seem to be the same Hollywood-arcade mindless spam railroading instead of a MMORPG... That could be it

I think that's implied

[Atelniar]

So if they have never said they have plans, what is this discussion about? Oh yeah...



Something they are not planing on doing, especially while they are working on an expansion that's going to release after The World of Warcraft movie... Yeah I can see it now, new subs everywhere thinking how amazing this game is, if only it had Legacy servers /sigh

Oh yea, do Blizzard have to approve on my stance for my stance to hold merit on its own? No, they fucking don't. Legacy servers can be profitable if implemented correctly, and trusting Blizzard's excuse that think they aren't as evidence of the opposite could be deemed somewhat... naive... in a lack of a more subtle term?

[Perkunas]

So which is it. Is the average player a teen or 35. Because you and akka seem to be arguing in two different directions. Pick one.

I never made the claim that the "average player" is anything, really. I think that the vocal morons on the forums who bitched about Cata heroics, demanded 10 man and 25 man parity during Wrath, and cried when flying got gated in WoD are people who have done far more damage to the game than good.

[Gadzooks]

No it doesn't. I cannot set up a McDonalds without paying the parent company. The fact that they allow restaurants who do pay to use their IP makes no difference.

You really just seem to be making stuff up because you have some kind of irrational hatred of private servers.

M'kay.

/10chars

[Pwellzor]

Legacy servers can be profitable if implemented correctly

This is where the armchair engineer/accountant/marketing director wins this argument every time. I have no ground to stand on speaking with someone of such universal expertise.

[Atelniar]

ah god dammit, you know everytime you use the word strawmen we have to drink right?

Can I join? Everytime someone tries a strawman on me, I have to drink. Oh fuck, I am already drunk...

[Kyanion]

LFR is built in such a way as to have 5-6 raiders carry the rest of the raid. If you have things like legendary quest items, relevant alt upgrades, valor or artifact progression behind raiders will do it. Consolidate it into Normal - the difficulty isn't that far off and it will be a bit more enjoyable for people.

I haven't been subbed since June of last year so I can't comment on the current Mythic situation. If they did that - kudos.

Yeah I feel it is one of the reasons mythic participation numbers have spiked up a bit and more guilds are getting kills. Those guilds that can manage 17-18 can find a few people to raid with them from off-realm and maybe just become perm guildies without having to actually transfer. My guild had a couple of those people before they transferred over.

Yeah like I said I really dislike the current design of LFR. I think there should be no reason for normal/heroic/mythic raiders to ever have to go in LFR unless they bump up the difficulty or introduce real tier in there again. Otherwise let us stay out of there (I can't help what people do with alts).

[Triks]

I am going to save this for later for when someone tells me I have no argument.

Are you seriously that stupid to not understand the meaning of a phrase such as "had been and continue to have"? If you have read any book in your life you would know the purpose of this phrase and the underlying meaning which is to acknowledge past and present members, objects and situations.

I can't believe that I am sitting here and teaching, supposedly, intelligent people basic English. By the way, I know Greg left for Riot.

[Deleted]

Blizzard isn't McDonalds and letting people use the 'special sauce' for Big Macs isn't the same as people handling your code. And also McDonalds screens people that want to start up a franchise. They just don't auto-accept people. Thus Blizz not taking on the Nost people and letting them go wild with the code.

Oh Gosh, letting them go wild with the code! What, like dozens of private servers do already?

If they want to screen companies, fine. I didn't suggest they shouldn't. You seem to be constructing all kinds of ridiculous reasons to prevent any kind of legacy server from existing ever, even when such a thing would help Blizzard.

[Kyanion]

I never made the claim that the "average player" is anything, really. I think that the vocal morons on the forums who bitched about Cata heroics, demanded 10 man and 25 man parity during Wrath, and cried when flying got gated in WoD are people who have done far more damage to the game than good.

Hey I think 10/25 man parity was one of the good things about Cata/MoP. Forced 20 man mythics isn't that amazing imo.

[Atelniar]

This is where the armchair engineer/accountant/marketing director wins this argument every time. I have no ground to stand on speaking with someone of such universal expertise.

Calling me an arcmhair engineer, accountant or marketing director doesn't win you any prizes for superious logic. It just goes to show you can't argue against logic properly. Theories about how something can be done does not equate to nonsense just because you wish it so. Especially when proper logic has been applied to the possible demographic and what kind of payment models could be effective (anything that isn't a 15 dollar-scam, basically).

But you are cute, for trying to keep up.

[peterpan007]

Gamespot gives Vanilla WOW a score of 9.5 - a higher score than it gives WoD

[Kyanion]

Can I join? Everytime someone tries a strawman on me, I have to drink. Oh fuck, I am already drunk...

at least you are only drunk. I think I might die if I see it again.

- - - Updated - - -

Gamespot gives Vanilla WOW a score of 9.5 - a higher score than it gives WoD

Wow what a shocker. A groundbreaking game like WoW comes out and people go nuts for it. Game only got BETTER in TBC and WotLK. But people clamor for Vanilla....you know that still confuses me. Even funnier is that they didn't even get a 10. Thank god I've never put any faith in Gamespot and other bs sites like that.

[Tuesdays]

Oh yea, do Blizzard have to approve on my stance for my stance to hold merit on its own? No, they fucking don't. Legacy servers can be profitable if implemented correctly, and trusting Blizzard's excuse that think they aren't as evidence of the opposite could be deemed somewhat... naive... in a lack of a more subtle term?

If it could be implemented and profitable, don't you think Blizzard would have done it? Or are they not doing it, just to piss people off?

Are you saying you have knowledge in business that Blizzard doesn't?