[BETA] Destruction Warlock Discussion

[Baconeggcheese]

There's no SB:Haunt in Alpha? and you're right, chaos bolt is not filler? Not sure what your getting at dude... All I'm trying to say is in ST (granted my artifact isn't close to being full as Destro) I get bored, quickly; same with Affly. And yes, more bored than I usually get on live playing those specs in ST which I guess isn't saying a whole lot but it's a personal feeling which I've seen echoed by others.. it's subjective dude and I'm not looking for a constant argument on subjective semantics.

And the point was that it hasn't really changed much if at all from 5.0 forward, which is not subjective. It hasn't.

This is especially true of single target, so if you've found it boring from 5.0 forward then fair enough. If you didn't find it boring then this is the same with potentially a little more depending on talents.

[Xandy]

I didn't say it changed drastically, I said I find it more boring, which is entirely subjective.

[Baconeggcheese]

I didn't say it changed drastically, I said I find it more boring, which is entirely subjective.

The problem for a lot of us I think is that while it may end up being tuned just fine (and probably will) it just doesn't feel very fun.

If you enjoyed destruction from 5.0 onward I'm not sure why you wouldn't enjoy it now as it really doesn't play any different.

If you didn't enjoy it from 5.0 onward then nothings changed.

Uh the spec/rotation has changed in alpha mate? aside from having to juggle talents all the time the RNG resource generation is the source of my gripe

So we didn't have this conversation?

[Xandy]

There is no conversation to be had with you, I'm voicing my opinion and you don't have to be a dick and invalidate my opinion with your nonsense rhetoric. I never used the word "drastic" when describing the changes, I just don't like them. Either agree with me or disagree and move on..

[Baconeggcheese]

I never used the word "drastic" when describing the changes, I just don't like them.

Are you having a stroke? No one said you used the word "drastic"... you're literally the only person to even bring up the word... I have no idea what the fuck you're on about.

[Xandy]

Are you having a stroke? No one said you used the word "drastic"... you're literally the only person to even bring up the word... I have no idea what the fuck you're on about.

You inferred that my interpretation of the changes was drastic when you said "it hasn't really changed much." I know it hasn't changed that much. I don't like the changes anyway. That was all I was ever trying to say.. moving on...

[Baconeggcheese]

You inferred that my interpretation of the changes was drastic when you said "it hasn't really changed much." I know it hasn't changed that much. I don't like the changes anyway. That was all I was ever trying to say.. moving on...

You a "master forum interpreter" now? Inferring things from what I said besides just reading what was said.

The only thing I inferred was that it hasn't changed much, and if you liked it from 5.0 forward I'm not sure why you wouldn't like it now since it hasn't changed much.

[Xandy]

Well of course you don't understand, because you disagree! I really wasn't looking for a 3 day long debate on something so trivial. This is clearly the wrong place to voice my opinion.

[Scathbais]

Do you play with GoSac and does it feel viable? (i'd really love not to play with pets)

I am not sure GoSac is meant to be played entirely pet-free, perhaps I am wrong. Given we no longer get an ability from our pet when saccing, nor do we get a health buff/heal, there is no benefit over the other two talent choices to play with demon sacced 100% of a fight duration. Your regular imp with GoSac does the same dps as your regular imp with Service. Now for a standard fight or a fight with 2-min burn phases, the imp summoned by our GrimService cool down is very strong.

But... for fights with periodic adds, Sac has a 30 second CD. Perhaps with the Sac talent we are meant to start fight with imp, pop GrimSac on adds, AOE the adds with ROF/Cata/FNB (hopefully getting major procs from Grim of Sac), and then resummon Imp when adds are dead.

I am not yet in alpha, so I cannot try this in the test raids, but the way GrimSac is structured, there is no benefit to keeping it up 100% of the time.

[Uzkin]

I am not sure GoSac is meant to be played entirely pet-free, perhaps I am wrong. Given we no longer get an ability from our pet when saccing, nor do we get a health buff/heal, there is no benefit over the other two talent choices to play with demon sacced 100% of a fight duration. Your regular imp with GoSac does the same dps as your regular imp with Service. Now for a standard fight or a fight with 2-min burn phases, the imp summoned by our GrimService cool down is very strong.

But... for fights with periodic adds, Sac has a 30 second CD. Perhaps with the Sac talent we are meant to start fight with imp, pop GrimSac on adds, AOE the adds with ROF/Cata/FNB (hopefully getting major procs from Grim of Sac), and then resummon Imp when adds are dead.

I am not yet in alpha, so I cannot try this in the test raids, but the way GrimSac is structured, there is no benefit to keeping it up 100% of the time.

Yeah, I can see it. All the sucky things from the past are making return so why not the pet swapping, as well.

[Turturin the Warlock]

Yeah, I can see it. All the sucky things from the past are making return so why not the pet swapping, as well.

Would be nice if they made it function like a soulswap-like toggle. So that you could sacrifice your bet but then call it back instantly. balanced around minimum sacrifice duration (something like 30secs to 1 minute) to prevent abuse or it becoming rotational

[Gaidax]

Would be nice if they would just keep sacrifice as it is for those who do not want the damned pet around, we are saccing our pet for many many years in raids, as a matter of fact - I think the cumulative time in WoW where we were raiding without pet is greater than that when we had it around.

I only think it to be fair to have Sac to be a viable permanent alternative.

[Duckz0rs]

But... for fights with periodic adds, Sac has a 30 second CD. Perhaps with the Sac talent we are meant to start fight with imp, pop GrimSac on adds, AOE the adds with ROF/Cata/FNB (hopefully getting major procs from Grim of Sac), and then resummon Imp when adds are dead.

At the moment it has a 30 second CD on live as well, maybe it's just something they didn't want to change? Personally I think part of the issue with Sac is that it's a proc. It seems to work a lot better for Affliction because it can proc off of individual DoT ticks. The main complaint for Affliction is that we lost the pet skill somehow. Granted, there's some weird double dipping (or is it gone?) with Soul Effigy but that's for the Affliction topic.

If they have the same proc rate Sac will be a lot worse for Destro, because Affliction has more DoT/Channel ticks over a given time than destro has DoT ticks and direct hits. It could be balanced by the proc rate, but I think a main gripe is that it's a specific AoE damage proc. It's not as powerful on single target and spread cleave, so it makes it less likely Destro can have a petless option in any scenario.

[Roujeaux]

I am not sure GoSac is meant to be played entirely pet-free, perhaps I am wrong. Given we no longer get an ability from our pet when saccing, nor do we get a health buff/heal, there is no benefit over the other two talent choices to play with demon sacced 100% of a fight duration. Your regular imp with GoSac does the same dps as your regular imp with Service. Now for a standard fight or a fight with 2-min burn phases, the imp summoned by our GrimService cool down is very strong.

But... for fights with periodic adds, Sac has a 30 second CD. Perhaps with the Sac talent we are meant to start fight with imp, pop GrimSac on adds, AOE the adds with ROF/Cata/FNB (hopefully getting major procs from Grim of Sac), and then resummon Imp when adds are dead.

I am not yet in alpha, so I cannot try this in the test raids, but the way GrimSac is structured, there is no benefit to keeping it up 100% of the time.

If that's how they want GoSac to function it seems like it'd just be much easier to replace it with GoSyn.

[bio347]

They've only just started looking at any sort of serious tuning, so it's entirely possible that Sac will come up in the future.

[traumabrew]

With the changes for handling pets/demons and the way Blizzard seems to be going back to the way locks were, I wouldnt be surprised if we had to sacrifice a raid member to summon our Doomguard.

[Soulzar]

I'd rather pet twist between ST and MT with Supremacy than Sacrifice. Its actually really strong for Demo since DE buffs the shit out of infernal dmg.

They have mentioned being able to Enslave in dungeons, so Sac may have some sweet sweet use there too.

[Esinar]

TBH, I think I'd rather have GoSynergy for all 3 specs atm. 30% increased damage to OUR AoE seems better than random procs of damage whilst also losing our pet.

[Maleific]

If that's how they want GoSac to function it seems like it'd just be much easier to replace it with GoSyn.

Basically, this is how I feel about GoSac in legion. Can't use command demon anymore, changed to damge proc. Just give us GoSyn and be done with it.

[gruxxar]

TBH, I think I'd rather have GoSynergy for all 3 specs atm. 30% increased damage to OUR AoE seems better than random procs of damage whilst also losing our pet.

I'm kinda torn on that that topic as well. Currently i'm using Implosion + soul conduit to aoe. So i'm rather inclined to use Syn as well to buff implosion. the other option is to use GoSup for always present AOE instead of rng syn buff.

EDIT: thought this was the demo thread because of Soulzar's post, my bad