[Movie/TV/Comic] Marvel Cinematic Universe: A place to talk all things Marvel

[Kellorion]

Is that confirmed thing, or just a general feeling?

[Shadowferal]

Yeah now those two have finally hooked up, Sharon is in for a disappointing night...

Maybe at first.
But think of his response as similar to when he gets in a fight; "I'd could do this all night."

How is his plan dumb or over-complicated? Get the Avengers on a leash and fighting
one another so he can avenge his family... pretty simple.

Hmf...How could Tony, as smart as he is, not see the manipulation? I saw that as a problem in the script right there.

Next movie that involves any Avengers will have to resolve what happened at the end of this movie. As it stands there are only 3-4 Avengers; Iron Man, may be War Machine, maybe Black Widow, and Vision. And all of them in doubt. While the others are all in Wakanda I guess.
Should be interesting.

[Immitis]

Is that confirmed thing, or just a general feeling?

they never outright say it, as that be admitting fiege thinks a product his company is actively creating and using to promote his own is trash

but when people are saying that behind closed doors, and when in interviews they keep praising the netflix series and hinting at them getting a cameo in infinity war meanwhile when asked about aos its always "well... its in the mcu isnt that enough?"

theres no logical reason why inhumans wouldnt be mentioned in civil war except that fiege doesnt want to

[Zoaric]

His entire plot revolved around getting his hands on a video clip that he could show Stark. I still absolutely do not buy at all that Tony would fight Bucky and Cap because of it either, especially not when there was so much reason for him to not do it. It is totally contrived that the Avengers end up fooling around with each other because of him framing Bucky, when it is super obvious that they could easily talk it out. It also made the whole Supervising Act pretty pointless to the Civil Skirmish.

Stark has often done things because of his ego or emotion rather than out of logic,
particularly when life is straining hard. And recently, he and Pepper have fallen into
relationship trouble due to all of the crazy stuff he does- something he sees a reverse
parallel with in his parents. Despite all of the crazy stuff his father did, his mother
always stood by him.

Further, Stark never got over the strained relationship he had with his father. Howard
Stark would constantly praise Captain Steve Rogers, the Star Spangled man, for being
a brave and righteous person. While in contrast, Howard was often on his son's back
for being a bit of a partying slacker compared to his full potential. Tony resented Steve
for seemingly being loved by Howard more than he, and at the time of his parent's death,
he was sore at them.

The man would be completely emotionally compromised if he found out that not only
were his parents murdered, but they were murdered by a guy he's never had any love
for, who's being protected by someone he still has lingering resentment towards. AND
if he found out that the guy he kinda resents also 'betrayed' him by not telling him that
all of this [I]and[/I] protecting the guy who did it. And reason for him not to fight Bucky?
The man was brainwashed. Looking past the things he did would require logic and time,
things that are gone when emotion take over.

Every bit of this, outside of knowing Steve knew Bucky had killed them, would be in the
files Black Widow leaked, or would be something he could gain access to publicly or via
more nefarious means.

As for talking it out, Steve tried. Repeatedly. But Tony kept dismissing anything said or
interrupting it with a fight. And while the act may seem pointless at the moment, if it
really were, why would Zemo react to Ross the way he did in the end? He still won. Even
if the Avengers didn't kill one another, half of them are criminals who're likely to be shot
on sight , and the other half are on a governmental leash- possibly preventing another
Sokovia. (Plus, it'll probably have ramifications throughout the later MCU films- meaning
that even if it had no effect on this story, it sets up later conflicts quite handily.)

[Immitis]

Maybe at first.
But think of his response as similar to when he gets in a fight; "I'd could do this all night."

Hmf...How could Tony, as smart as he is, not see the manipulation? I saw that as a problem in the script right there.

Next movie that involves any Avengers will have to resolve what happened at the end of this movie. As it stands there are only 3-4 Avengers; Iron Man, may be War Machine, maybe Black Widow, and Vision. And all of them in doubt. While the others are all in Wakanda I guess.
Should be interesting.

as ive been saying since age of ultron, there will be two teams until infinity war.

by the time infinity war roles around the official avengers will be comprised of almost entirely newcomers, spider-man, dr strange, black panther, ect.

the leader was either gonna be dr strange or captain marvel. after infinity war most of the older avengers will either be retired for awhile, recast, or at the very least wont be avengers anymore.

granted this is pre ikes removal plan.

this movie was originally going to end with steve dead or seemingly dead and bucky taking up the shield and then being ressurected for a final hurrah in infinity war.

the working title for civil war was fallen son as up until relatively recently this was going to be caps final solo movie under evans

[Zoaric]

Hmf...How could Tony, as smart as he is, not see the manipulation? I saw that as a problem in the script right there.

Tony's an egotist running on emotion. He wanted the Accords to go through, and Cap
didn't- that already sets Cap as the enemy. Everything else is kindling for the fire.

[Chrysia]

Maybe at first.
But think of his response as similar to when he gets in a fight; "I'd could do this all night."

Hmf...How could Tony, as smart as he is, not see the manipulation? I saw that as a problem in the script right there.

Next movie that involves any Avengers will have to resolve what happened at the end of this movie. As it stands there are only 3-4 Avengers; Iron Man, may be War Machine, maybe Black Widow, and Vision. And all of them in doubt. While the others are all in Wakanda I guess.
Should be interesting.

It wouldn't be the first time we've had two Avengers teams. [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secret_Avengers"]They even have the perfect name for Rogers' team.[/URL]

[Zeek Daniels]

Some things were okay about Zemo, but he represents most of the problems I have with the film, and his plan is pretty dumb and over-complicated for what he wanted to do. The fact that it worked is also a big black mark on the film.

This is exactly what im talking about. You just dont understand his plan. No one on the planet is able to take on the Avengers. No one is strong enough to stop them, Aliens have tried, Robots have tried. Individual villans have tried. Zemo uses the UN's new accords which again is a blessing because there is no way he knew that was going to happen. But his goal is to break apart the avengers and hopefully get some of them to kill each other. Sure the accords already had the avengers on different sides but nothing was going to get them to fight. Cap was willing to step down until he saw his friend in danger. Black Panther was in full assassin mode and lets Cap know, he is going to kill Bucky the first chance he gets. Its enough to get Cap to go against the accords and against Tony.

Zemo knows Caps and Buckys backstory. Hes sokovia's version of the CIA. He knows Cap will jump to defend bucky. This whole movie hes trying to find what happend that night during that mission so he can use it to further his plan.

Again his plan is simple. Frame A for terrorism, Get A to incriminate himself more, Send mysterious Tape to B to have B kill A so that B and C can never be friends anymore. Not an overly complicated plan.

[Arrowstormen]

snip

Trying to kill somebody because they killed your parents while brainwashed, and having just been told that doing so is somebody's goal to tear you apart, is too firmly rooted in the realm of idiocy for me to believe that Tony would do it, no matter how emotionally unstable they might try to sell him to be. Some people might buy it, but personally, I don't.

[Shadowferal]

There aren't any movies involving any Avenger that was in this Civil War until the Black Panther movie in Feb 2018.

Which makes sense. As it's likely that BP will resolve and unify the Avengers.


On a more curious note; Charlie Cox (Daredevil) and Adrianne Palicki (Mockingbird) are contractually obligated to show up in any film if asked.

[Zoaric]

Trying to kill somebody because they killed your parents while brainwashed, and having just been told that doing so is somebody's goal to tear you apart, is too firmly rooted in the realm of idiocy for me to believe that Tony would do it, no matter how emotionally unstable they might try to sell him to be. Some people might buy it, but personally, I don't.

His parents died. Twenty five years later, all in one moment, he found out that they
were actually murdered, the man who did it is standing in front of him, AND his friend
covered it up. You're telling me that you think it's weird that he then attacked the guy
who murdered his parents?

"I don't care, he killed my mom."

[Immitis]

There aren't any movies involving any Avenger that was in this Civil War until the Black Panther movie in Feb 2018.

Which makes sense. As it's likely that BP will resolve and unify the Avengers.


On a more curious note; Charlie Cox (Daredevil) and Adrianne Palicki (Mockingbird) are contractually obligated to show up in any film if asked.

theres some rumours going around that black panther might be a prequel

[xcess]

Trying to kill somebody because they killed your parents while brainwashed, and having just been told that doing so is somebody's goal to tear you apart, is too firmly rooted in the realm of idiocy for me to believe that Tony would do it, no matter how emotionally unstable they might try to sell him to be. Some people might buy it, but personally, I don't.

I guess you didnt buy it in Age of Ultron where maximoff twins wanted to kill Tony when they blame him for killing their parents ? He should eventually move past it since he has been on the other side of the coin himself. Also when Thanos comes Tony knows he needs all the help he can get. Bucky wont be on Iron mans christmas card list anytime soon but I think if Bucky isnt there, the Cap and Iron man can at least work together to bring down a common universal threat. Maybe Hulk and Thor can smack some sense back into them

There aren't any movies involving any Avenger that was in this Civil War until the Black Panther movie in Feb 2018.

Which makes sense. As it's likely that BP will resolve and unify the Avengers.


On a more curious note; Charlie Cox (Daredevil) and Adrianne Palicki (Mockingbird) are contractually obligated to show up in any film if asked.

I am guessing Infinity war part 1 will work towards that too since that comes out before the Black Panther movie

[Kellorion]

Sorry but what were zemos words/reaction at the end again?

[Arrowstormen]

I guess you didnt buy it in Age of Ultron where maximoff twins wanted to kill Tony when they blame him for killing their parents ?

That's also kinda weak yes. "Guy kills my parents with a gun, better get revenge on the manufacturer of the gun."

- - - Updated - - -

His parents died. Twenty five years later, all in one moment, he found out that they
were actually murdered, the man who did it is standing in front of him, AND his friend
covered it up. You're telling me that you think it's weird that he then attacked the guy
who murdered his parents?

"I don't care, he killed my mom."

Rolled my eyes at that line, struck me as very out-of-character, because the guy in question was BRAINWASHED.

[frogger237]

I haven't seen Civil War yet but have read the Wikipedia summary but have a question:

Why wouldn't Tony just use Extremis from Iron Man 3 on War Machine then cure it instead of giving him robotic crutches?

[Zoaric]

Podcast with the writers explaining choices they made and answering some related
questions here.

It's fairly long though, so here's a link to a Reddit post summarizing it all for those
of you without the time or desire to listen to it all.

[xcess]

I see that War Machine is actually a secret Avenger in the comics, I guess they arent going with that in the movies

[Immitis]

Podcast with the writers explaining choices they made and answering some related
questions here.

It's fairly long though, so here's a link to a Reddit post summarizing it all for those
of you without the time or desire to listen to it all.

tbh, the real reason bucky is on ice is probably because the entire plan they had laid out for him doesnt really work if hes not captain america.

i still firmly believe bucky will end up picking up the shield after infinity war, even if we end up with a comic situation where theres two caps or a batman beyond type situation.

either that or bucky will be relegated to more of a side character. i could see him having a costar type role in a black widow movie similiar to bw in winter soldier but i dont see him getting his own solo winter soldier movies

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Captain America 3: Civil War - 9/10

My most favorite Marvel film yet; absolutely loved how it broke the formulaic Marvel movie plot progression with an antagonist who's not really a big bad (he did more damage to the Avengers with just google translate, a book and a homecooked bomb in a van than Ultron or Loki did with their almighty plans!) and the true threat are the Avenger's themselves, fueled by indifference, revenge and logical extremes. As said before, Black Panther stole the show (would love to see a movie about him *cough* Black Widow movie *cough cough*), too bad the rest of the gang didn't get screen time (Hawkeye, Vision, Wanda and Black Widow) but that's forgiveable since it's a Cap film, not an Avenger's film.

Starting to get burnt out on Marvel films though; the plot of this movie really illustrates just how recycled the Marvel film franchise plots are becoming. Infinity War will probably be the last Marvel movies I'm guaranteed to see before I bail out on exhaustion.