I can see high elves existing in both Factions

[Mace]

Screw it...just make high elves a sub race for blood elves and I'd be happy I suppose...at this point I just want a cute elf with those soft blue eyes.

That's the spirit

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That idea is atrocious.

One thing I don't understand is how people can say that High Elves can't be playable because there aren't many left.

The Darkspear Trolls were refugees as far as I remember, and were also getting messed up pretty bad by murlocs until Thrall came along and helped them out, but there were still enough left to make them playable.

The Gnomes nuked their capital city causing a massive radioactive disaster killing off a lot of their dudes and turning a ton into lepers, but there were still enough left to make them playable.

they just clinging to arbitary excuses that mean nothing, seeing that blizzard can pull entire continents out of thin air, no, entire worlds! and retcon lore, reveal new stuff, kidding themselves if they think population would be a consideration to developers. Can you imainge? Developer "Oh no, we can't give this race we want to add because they have to few numbers" ... lol, yes I just /rolledeyes

[Obelisk Kai]

omg.. it had me roflmao .. the language he uses.. "being that beautiful pale-skinned elf" not just once but so many times.

at least he is straight up about it.

Remind me again Mace, was it you or Ravenmoon that had the unstoppable obsession with male night elves? I seem to recall a regular stream of topics regarding their appearance during the character model reinvention, some of which were only the vaguest variations on the same topic. Basically, you shouldn't comment on other people's perceived insecurities.

Regardless, let me flat out say it. Some Alliance players don't like the dark skinned elves they have and would prefer the pale skinned elves they were denied. That's why pale skinned is bolded. And if you can tell me that isn't a factor for some people then I think you're being naive.

And such believe is stupid. I want playable High Elves exactly because of lore and nothing else and I am pretty damn sure I don't concoct any weird schemes to make it happen because I have a hard on them. I main a male gnome and certainly not because of his attractiveness, lol.

Ask yourself a question, do you honestly believe that if Blizzard had added some other race, not Blood Elves, to the Horde who would had been super sexy and attractive, the people who ask for High Elves now would had asked for the Allience variant of that race instead?

You can't want them because of lore. If you acknowledged lore you'd not be agitating for them. You'd accept they are already playable Horde side. You'd acknowledge the story blizzard wrote detailing their exit from the Alliance. Instead, pro High Elfers twist the lore with their own headcanon and try and get an outcome the story itself seems to preclude.

And do I believe that? Yes, but not on the same level. The difference here is you feel you have an 'in'. You feel you have permission to agitate for this because of the High Elves. Let me ask you this. If blizzard had just had the High Elves keep calling themselves the High Elves instead of Blood Elves, would you still be agitating for them?

[Mace]

WoW can't even write night elves and you want them to focus on some of the most whiny two faced characters still in lore?

They're trying, they've at least made them a lot more interesting in Legion with the nightborne and demon hunters - maybe they just needed time to get them eventually/

If it was all about the money Blizzard would have already done this beyond sad request for Blue eyed Blood elves.

okay, fair enough it's not really about money, I think it's more about the fantasy. Originally the high elves of WC2 were driven by the tolkein high elf fantasy, and a lot of people like that. People also like that blood elves were made and you had the pretty elves have a bad boy side to them too. No harm in having both around right? makes the race more interesting, your world richer, now you can do more interseting things like make them operate in the same faction.. that would be interesting -- come on you must admit! put your prejudice aside - think about political intrigue, power struggles, moral struggles dark side versus light side. Could be very interesting.

A group that Wanted to work alongside the Blood elves but wouldn't renouce it's ties to the Alliance wouldn't be welcomed into Quel'Thalas either, only to visit the Sunwell.

Not necessarily, that may have been the case at the start of TBC, but things have changed, Blood elves have been shown since their redemption to want re-connect all their kin, at least some of them, furthermore we've seen blood elves team up with other allianece races like The Shattari - restoring the sunwell would be a huge boon to friendly relations.

The Blood elf identity is no longer wrapped up completely in the horde, and for this reason , it is quite conceivable to see provision made for a high elf group led by someone as passionate for her people as Alleria Windrunner Ranger General of Quel'thalas, especially when it is clear she puts family (her people) above her friends. Not everything has to be black and white in the conflict. ALL the alliance doesn't have to hate ALL the horde, and all the races in the horde don't have to love each other completely , same with the alliance. There is room for nuances, varying degrees of hurt. Not all individuals are even hurt the same way.

It's not lore breaking like magically pulling helves out of thin air so the vocal minority can stop crying, doesn't mean its a good idea either.

might you be saying that because of bias?
[/QUOTE]

[Florena]

Lore wise I think that high elves could work as a neutral race. It won't happen though because of out of game reasons. They're not going to take the Horde's most played race and make a neutral version of it with blue eyes and slightly paler skin. It's just not going to happen.

[Mace]

Remind me again Mace, was it you or Ravenmoon that had the unstoppable obsession with male night elves? I seem to recall a regular stream of topics regarding their appearance during the character model reinvention, some of which were only the vaguest variations on the same topic. Basically, you shouldn't comment on other people's perceived insecurities.

Regardless, let me flat out say it. Some Alliance players don't like the dark skinned elves they have and would prefer the pale skinned elves they were denied. That's why pale skinned is bolded. And if you can tell me that isn't a factor for some people then I think you're being naive.

it was Ravenmoon, but hey, who am I to get in the way of man's sexuality issues or identity. That was also incredibly funny. you have to admit though there is a degree of humour to see guys so wrapped up in the detail. Sometimes it is funny, I found the way you emphaised beautiful, pale-skinned elves very telling and hilarious .. you can just feel the vanity of players. Very...honestly put if I do say so.

Oh and it wasn't a criticism of you at all, it was just funny. It is precisely because it is a huge factor for people is why it was so amusing being spelled out so plainly.

[Friendlyimmolation]

e Blood elf identity is no longer wrapped up completely in the horde

Jaina pushed them to be as Horde as Horde can be.

might you be saying that because of bias?

Its not bias pointing out how much lore breaking/bending would occur to make High elves a playable race, not to mention how ridiculous many would find it.

[Mace]

Considering they are the same race, it would be change for the sake of Change. Which is never a good idea.

not if you were making them a playable sub-race, there for the purpose of allowing players to have different customisations and play a different fantasy.

High elves exist on the Alliance the same way Leper Gnomes exist on the Horde. Neither necessitate a playable race because a small force went against the grain.

THat's true they don't, but having this game isn't really necessary if you think about it, but here it is, having playable anything is often desirable for a fantasy. This is essentially what they want.

[Cien]

Remind me again Mace, was it you or Ravenmoon that had the unstoppable obsession with male night elves? I seem to recall a regular stream of topics regarding their appearance during the character model reinvention, some of which were only the vaguest variations on the same topic. Basically, you shouldn't comment on other people's perceived insecurities.

Regardless, let me flat out say it. Some Alliance players don't like the dark skinned elves they have and would prefer the pale skinned elves they were denied. That's why pale skinned is bolded. And if you can tell me that isn't a factor for some people then I think you're being naive.



You can't want them because of lore. If you acknowledged lore you'd not be agitating for them. You'd accept they are already playable Horde side. You'd acknowledge the story blizzard wrote detailing their exit from the Alliance. Instead, pro High Elfers twist the lore with their own headcanon and try and get an outcome the story itself seems to preclude.

And do I believe that? Yes, but not on the same level. The difference here is you feel you have an 'in'. You feel you have permission to agitate for this because of the High Elves. Let me ask you this. If blizzard had just had the High Elves keep calling themselves the High Elves instead of Blood Elves, would you still be agitating for them?

probably yes as there's constant high elves popping up in alliance quests, cities etc, a constant reminder of our bitter denial QQ

edit: vereesa is just fire, she makes me wanna helf <3

[Friendlyimmolation]

edit: vereesa is just fire, she makes me wanna helf <3

Vereesa and her kids should be wiped away, to save us from the chance of another Knaak book.

[Graden]

Lore wise I think that high elves could work as a neutral race. It won't happen though because of out of game reasons. They're not going to take the Horde's most played race and make a neutral version of it with blue eyes and slightly paler skin. It's just not going to happen.

Well, they already exist in game as a neutral race, just not as a playable one. I mean, as an Alliance player I've seen plenty of High Elves in my faction, we even have a mage trainer in Stormwind.
They could indeed introduce the Blood/High Elves even as a neutral, playable race, if the Blood Elves weren't already a part of the Horde (like the Pandaren).
But now, no, it's not gonna happen. But imo having them in our faction, even if they're not playable is more than enough.

[Florena]

Well, they already exist in game as a neutral race, just not as a playable one. I mean, as an Alliance player I've seen plenty of High Elves in my faction, we even have a mage trainer in Stormwind.
They could indeed introduce the Blood/High Elves even as a neutral, playable race, if the Blood Elves weren't already a part of the Horde (like the Pandaren).
But now, no, it's not gonna happen. But imo having them in our faction, even if they're not playable is more than enough.

Honestly I wish the high and blood elves would reconcile so we don't get another expansion where alliance highelves get more exposure than neglected races.

[Mace]

Blizzard will do whatever they please, if Hleves are destined to be playable they eventrually will.

Personally I believe that adding any elf to Horde was artrocius idea.

very wise words, you're not the only one, but if they didn't people wouldn't play them, and they designed their game to require even sides and fuelled it on mutual hate. So they effectively tripped themselves up. They're trying considering.

[Mehrunes]

Rhlor what the fuck?????

My eyes are bleeding.

[Xylense]

Blood elves are High Elves. The name change didn't change their race. They should've reconciled by now, or have had (Some, not all) blue eyed elves remain loyal to Silvermoon and join the Horde with their kin. I mean, their eyes are green cause as a side effect of fel energy, but I don't see why an elf could've watched, been like "hmm I don't really want to do that myself" while still being loyal to Kael'thas (before events of WoW). I get that a lot of high elves who refused the fel turned wretched, but obviously not all since HElves still exist, some should have remained loyal.

On the flip side, there should be Green Eyed Blood Elves who regret or resent their actions and rejoin the human Alliance. There's reasons for both green and blue eyed elves to be in either faction given how much time has passed lore-wise. Besides, eventually, the green eye will disappear. Blood Elf or High Elf, the name is strictly cultural.

[Mace]

It wouldn't be any less weird for them to be on the Alliance.



The only thing that makes sense is for them to rejoin their people in Quel'thalas, but not be hostile toward the Alliance, like what Auric is doing. Similar to how Jaina claimed to be not hostile to the Horde while she was a member of the Alliance, except the High Elves would actually be not hostile to the Alliance.

Finally.. why can't they see that! It can believably work this way.

I dind't think it would be right or believable to use the Silver Covenant High Elven group without using another extinction event (like Legion) to cause diffferences to be put aside, and it seems they are doing an intentional thing by having a portion of the high elves still in the alliance. The only way it could work would be if a separate group that is not mired by the recent squabbles so able to be ambassadors to tehirpeople and reflect true distinctive high elven qualities that haven't really been shown in wow at all yet and not been seen/shown in the Silver Covenant. I mean i'm sure they're in the Silver Covenant, it's just that the only side we've seen is the side the blood elves see, hate filled.. that would need time to work out.

It allows high elves for alliance boys to not be in an uproar, because the alliance is not losing high elves even though they still remain playable, and it allows a workable version of high elves to exist in the horde as a unique envoy to the blood elven people. They would exist as friendly to blood elves, and unfrinedly to horde, neutral to alliance. And should they become playable on the horde, it would be an "individual" thing not the whole group that is exploring the horde. Allowing the player to be unfriendly to horde and having to work reputation up would drive the point home too. Also allowing the player to be neutral to alliance players but if flagged for pvp able to attack or be attacked by them would help too. Sure they can visit alliance cities, but they can't grab quests, they can only group with horde players etc, they are playing on the horde side, it's just they have slightly modified entry relations with the factions..

Btw.. did you write that quote? or you quoted from someone?

[Melsiren]

For fucksakes people, Highelves are not a race, just a pretentious political group.


There's so few of them they are not even a god damned culture.

[Mace]

no. this game already has enough fucking elves and enough fucking races. its time to develop the ones we have and have some proper raceinteractions horde and alliancewise, also cementing the belfs in the horde to finally make it clear that they are just as horde as everyone else in the horde!

that's what sub-races do, they develop the races you have becasue they are a part of that race and they give depth to that race too.

Also, if you are a real Elf lover shouldn't your stance be more for the independence of the ELves? Their identity not wrapped up in the horde? Elves first , horde second rather than seeing themselves as horde?

you wouldn't want blizzard to fasten anything, because it's horrible that wow still is locked to 2 factions, each race should essentially be a faction and different races teaming up at different times over different things.. that's what you want. In WC3, it was really interesting to have more factions - Night Elf faction, Forsaken/scourge faction. if you fasten blood elves to the horde too tightly you're locking in horde and alliance too much where I feel you should actually be making the races more their own thing.

[Mehrunes]

He's not a Blood Elf fan, he's just sick of Alliance players crying for High Elves. Admit it, you still can't get over the fact that you lost the Blood Elves to the Horde. And i'm not saying this to offend you, but you have to get over it. It's done man.

Right now, adding High Elves to the Alliance as a playable race makes absolutely zero sense. No matter how old or 'inaccurate' for some people is, we have an official response from Blizzard for that matter, and it clearly states that High Elves to the Alliance = not possible. So unless they are going to change their minds and recton the shit out of it, you have to get the fuck over it.

I mean, it's been a decade and people are still bitching, Jesus Christ.

Wait, are you saying what you think you're saying? That the Alliance player's tears don't have the power to alter reality? Damn, my whole life is a lie. And my tear-harvest farm full of Alliance crybabies lost its status as a slave labor camp. Sad times.

[Deleted]

You can't want them because of lore. If you acknowledged lore you'd not be agitating for them. You'd accept they are already playable Horde side. You'd acknowledge the story blizzard wrote detailing their exit from the Alliance. Instead, pro High Elfers twist the lore with their own headcanon and try and get an outcome the story itself seems to preclude.

What is that lore that makes it impossible for a race that is already part of Alliance and is present almost everywhere to be playable? That population BS again? Please let's stop with these excuses for hate. If a few adventure seekers from a Wandering Isle can be a playable race, on both factions no less, a military wing of Dalaran can be as well. The only real argument of them not being playable is their similarity to Blood Elves which is a gameplay issue and that's it.

And do I believe that? Yes, but not on the same level. The difference here is you feel you have an 'in'. You feel you have permission to agitate for this because of the High Elves. Let me ask you this. If blizzard had just had the High Elves keep calling themselves the High Elves instead of Blood Elves, would you still be agitating for them?

You are delusional then. And yes, if all that blood elf-high elf split wouldn't have happened and high elves simply would have joined the Horde I personally wouldn't have been agitating for them since it is impossible for a race to change a faction for obvious reasons.

[Melsiren]

you wouldn't want blizzard to fasten anything, because it's horrible that wow still is locked to 2 factions, each race should essentially be a faction and different races teaming up at different times over different things.. that's what you want. In WC3, it was really interesting to have more factions - Night Elf faction, Forsaken/scourge faction. if you fasten blood elves to the horde too tightly you're locking in horde and alliance too much where I feel you should actually be making the races more their own thing.

This...I agree with.

Horde vs Alliance bullshit needs to stop, racial tension can exist without two factions.

What is that lore that makes it impossible for a race that is already part of Alliance and is present almost everywhere to be playable? That population BS again? Please let's stop with these excuses for hate. If a few adventure seekers from a Wandering Isle can be a playable race, on both factions no less, a military wing of Dalaran can be as well. The only real argument of them not being playable is their similarity to Blood Elves which is a gameplay issue and that's it.

Your argument seems great, until you educated yourself on the fact that not once has Blizzard ever stated how many Pandaren lived on Shen-zin Su That Island wandered for 9,200 years with no real threats to the population. Unlike Highelves which have been stated by multiple sources to be scarce, and rare, and not even a gods damned culture.