I KNEW the movie would flop

[quras]

Actually it's EXACTLY like that:

In 1980, the average cost of marketing a studio movie in the U.S. was $4.3 million ($12.4 million in today's dollars). By 2007, it had shot up to nearly $36 million. If the MPAA still tracked spending on P&A, that number would be north of $40 million today for medium-size films like The Fault in Our Stars or Tammy.

Hollywood continues to wrestle with rising marketing costs, particularly overseas, which can make up 70 percent of a film's gross thanks to booming markets in Russia, Latin America and Asia. Two years ago, the cost had crept up to $175 million globally. Now, studios say it has hit the $200 million mark per picture -- a 33 percent increase from the $150 million spent in 2007 on the first Transformers.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...ruggles-721818

Although it's worth noting that the article says it was cheaper to market in China:

In only a few weeks, Paramount's Transformers: Age of Extinction has become the top-grossing film of all time in China, earning north of $300 million. What's more impressive is that Age of Extinction cost no more than $3 million to $5 million to market to Chinese moviegoers

But given the huge amount of advertising I saw in the UK across every platform / media type, this wasn't a cheap film to sell.

A bit cheaper to market in China yes but China pulled out all the stops to make sure this movie did well there. I've never seen anything quite like what this artice talks about and how they marketed it. You can bet money wasn't saved in marketing for China this time around. It was the one market they made sure to grab and sell to.

http://variety.com/2016/film/asia/te...-s-1201794300/

That was some over the top marketing. You can be assured they spent pretty close to 100M on marketing total if not more.

[rda]

Yeah that's not how things work in the real world.

450-500M. I've seen the number. It's an educated guess, nothing more. Certainly not the absolute you claim it to be, let alone be enough to declare flop or not. There are still a lot of untapped sources of money for the film to go trough, rent/pay per view/DVD/TV (obviously none as lucrative as cinema). You might be right that the revenue won't cover the expenses. But at this point in time, it's way too early to tell.

I'll just remark that sure, the figure of 450-500 mil to break even is an educated guess, but treating it like some kind of an upper limit - which you personally might not be doing, but many people who will read your post will - is a mistake. The number to break even can be lower than the educated guess, sure. But it can totally be higher as well. With that big percentage of money coming from Asia, chances are, the estimate of 450-500 mil to break even might easily be a lowball.

And it is unquestionable that if you start talking about money coming from rent / PPV / DVD, you should also talk about marketing costs for these things. Without marketing, neither of them will amount to anything. And marketing costs.

Sum total, yes, we don't have numbers to the last penny, and, yes, they can try and make more money after the movie completed its run in the cinemas, but it is pretty clear that the movie is not a success and won't become one.

PS: I won't even caveat "is not a big success", it's clear it's not a success at all. Maybe breaking even and maybe kind of making a couple of cents on the dollar is very far from success, investing money like this is a big waste of time.

[Feeline10]

Man, you spent 5 (FIVE!) posts repeating that you are stating basic facts in the sea of unknowledgeable idiots, all five times you made the same error of assuming that 160 mil production and let's say 500 mil of total earnings mean big profits (no, these numbers would mean that the movie just paid for itself, give or take), and it still took 6 (SIX!) replies pointing you to that error to make you finally see it.

It is downright comical.

Here, sit with us and watch another guy ride into the thread on the same horse of "it made much more than 160 mil already, so it's vastly profitable [and you all are just haters]". It will only take a page, I promise.

:-)

---
Just in case you still don't see it, this last phrase of yours -- "And the cut the cinemas take, again, is not astronomical to the point where 160million budget 500million gross ISN'T a profit." -- the cut the cinemas (and all other middlemen) take is big enough to reduce 500 mil to ~250 mil, and after you subtract advertisement (~100 mil in this case up to this moment), what's left is barely enough to cover ~160 mil production (perhaps not enough yet). And 500 mil didn't happen yet, and since the money are mostly from overseas, the middlemen might take more than half (which is just the rule of thumb), etc.

So much writing for nothing. The movie has has already turned a profit. Only a fool or someone without basic knowledge of money, production, and cost of making movies couldn't see that.

[Deleted]

I'll just remark that sure, the figure of 450-500 mil to break even is an educated guess, but treating it like some kind of an upper limit - which you personally might not be doing, but many people who will read your post will - is a mistake. The number to break even can be lower than the educated guess, sure. But it can totally be higher as well. With that big percentage of money coming from Asia, chances are, the estimate of 450-500 mil to break even might easily be a lowball.

And it is unquestionable that if you start talking about money coming from rent / PPV / DVD, you should also talk about marketing costs for these things. Without marketing, neither of them will amount to anything. And marketing costs.

Sum total, yes, we don't have numbers to the last penny, and, yes, they can try and make more money after the movie completed its run in the cinemas, but it is pretty clear that the movie is not a success and won't become one.

Don't you ever get bored with shit talking anything blizzard related on these forums? Genuine question seeing thats all you seem to do, day in day out..

[Feeline10]

107 pages discussing something that's way too complex to get an accurate estimate of.

There are way too many variables involved for anyone here to make an accurate claim. Nobody knows exactly how much money was poured into the project on top of production costs. Only the 160M number is known. And we will never know down to the penny what was poured in either. There're simply too many people, stakeholders, companies etc. involved. Plus, most people seem to completely forget there's a thing called taxes. For a movie ticket at the cinema, here in the Netherlands 6% is the tax fee. I'm sure other countries around the world have taxes that need to be paid too.

Here is what we do know:

Movie budget = $160M

Tickets sold world wide add up to $400M + and taxes are the first thing that get paid from that income.

That's it. Anything else is speculation. Is it enough to cover all costs? Probably somewhat close. But now we're back to guessing.

Exactly.

We know the movie cost 160 million to make and has already grossed over 400 million. For anyone on this forum to claim it hasn't turned a profit is simply a salty kid who early on in the thread thought the movie would fail.

[peterpan007]

Its clear that this franchise will make a killing in Asia.

Therefore for the sequels it would make more financial sense for any future sequels to be made in Asia rather than in the US.

[rda]

So much writing for nothing. The movie has has already turned a profit. Only a fool or someone without basic knowledge of money, production, and cost of making movies couldn't see that.

ROFL

I get a feeling you are just an alt of Jaylock. It takes special powers to be ignoring all the replies and continuing to come in blind with bold phrases like "only a fool".

[Feeline10]

I am not sure why you need to keep repeating that you did not like the film, your opinion of it has nothing to do with whether it is profitable or not. If the film takes $500 million at the box office, the cinemas will need to take their cut, after they have taken their cut what is left goes to the production companies. Just for argument's sake say the cinema's take a 50% cut, at $500million this would leave $250million for the production companies of which $160million are the production costs. If the marketing cost less than $90million they have made a profit.

Because I have no dog in this fight. I just want some uneducated folks to realize that a movie that costs 160 million dollars to make which has already brought in over 400 million has turned a profit. Period. The reason I keep repeating that I didn't like the movie is because I don't care whether the movie fails or succeeds. I don't care whether sequels are made or not. I just want to point out some facts to some extremely salty individuals who are upset that the movie didn't flop. Why they care so much, I have no idea.

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ROFL

I get a feeling you are just an alt of Jaylock.

Not sure who Jaylock is, nor do I really care. I don't sit on MMO forums all day trolling..

I'll point it out again. I don't care if the movie fails or succeeds. I don't care if sequels are made. But a movie with a budget of 160 million which has already grossed over 400 million and will most likely hit 500+ million has turned a profit. Period. End of story.

[rda]

I'll point it out again. I don't care if the movie fails or succeeds. I don't care if sequels are made. But a movie with a budget of 160 million which has already grossed over 400 million and will most likely hit 500+ million has turned a profit. Period. End of story.

LOL, no, this is not the case.

Read the replies as to why.

[Feeline10]

Don't you ever get bored with shit talking anything blizzard related on these forums? Genuine question seeing thats all you seem to do, day in day out..

Is that what this kid's shtick is? I don't visit the forums enough to know people, but just from the responses on here.. he seems like a very, very salty kid. Why he cares so much that Warcraft has done well worldwide and turned a profit is well beyond me.

[Deleted]

Is that what this kid's shtick is? I don't visit the forums enough to know people, but just from the responses on here.. he seems like a very, very salty kid. Why he cares so much that Warcraft has done well worldwide and turned a profit is well beyond me.

He reminds me of this guy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpy1FlGKYz0
Just a constant stream of hate just to make him self feel better about his shitty life.

Anyway, I haven't seen the movie yet as I been busy in the last few weekends but I heard it was a very enjoyable movie from most of my friends and family (non of them played WoW). So I am looking forward to go see it, might wait till its out on DVD though not to fuzzed!

[Feeline10]

He reminds me of this guy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpy1FlGKYz0
Just a constant stream of hate just to make him self feel better about his shitty life.

Anyway, I haven't seen the movie yet as I been busy in the last few weekends but I heard it was a very enjoyable movie from most of my friends and family (non of them played WoW). So I am looking forward to go see it, might wait till its out on DVD though not to fuzzed!

I don't understand why he'd come on a Blizzard forum and trash Blizzard all day. But to each his own.

The movie isn't terrible, it's just not awesome. Enjoy it!

[Pann]

Because I have no dog in this fight. I just want some uneducated folks to realize that a movie that costs 160 million dollars to make which has already brought in over 400 million has turned a profit. Period. The reason I keep repeating that I didn't like the movie is because I don't care whether the movie fails or succeeds. I don't care whether sequels are made or not. I just want to point out some facts to some extremely salty individuals who are upset that the movie didn't flop. Why they care so much, I have no idea.

At this point I feel that your responses are some kind of a wind up or a form of attention seeking. It is what the production companies receive that determines whether or not the movie is profitable not what the retailers have taken through their tills.

[rda]

^^ Waiting in suspense to see if the reply is going to be "you, too, are a hater" or a repeat of the usual "anyone with a brain realizes that a movie that cost 160 mil to produce and made 400 mil turned a big profit". Banking on the latter.

[Feeline10]

^^ Waiting in suspense to see if the reply is going to be "you, too, are a hater" or a repeat of the usual "anyone with a brain realizes that a movie that cost 160 mil to produce and made 400 mil turned a big profit". Banking on the latter.

I see what's going on now. Over 11,000 posts on a gaming forum crapping on Blizzard all day. The other guy was right. A quick look at your history and all you do is trash Blizzard.

Any single solitary person OUTSIDE of this forum would laugh in your face if you said that a movie which cost 160 million to make and will hit 500+ million is not profitable. It's just that simple.

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At this point I feel that your responses are some kind of a wind up or a form of attention seeking. It is what the production companies receive that determines whether or not the movie is profitable not what the retailers have taken through their tills.

However you want to spin it is fine. A movie with a budget of 160 million which will make 500+ million is profitable. I don't need spin, you do.

[Mystrome]

I'll just remark that sure, the figure of 450-500 mil to break even is an educated guess, but treating it like some kind of an upper limit - which you personally might not be doing, but many people who will read your post will - is a mistake. The number to break even can be lower than the educated guess, sure. But it can totally be higher as well. With that big percentage of money coming from Asia, chances are, the estimate of 450-500 mil to break even might easily be a lowball.

And it is unquestionable that if you start talking about money coming from rent / PPV / DVD, you should also talk about marketing costs for these things. Without marketing, neither of them will amount to anything. And marketing costs.

Sum total, yes, we don't have numbers to the last penny, and, yes, they can try and make more money after the movie completed its run in the cinemas, but it is pretty clear that the movie is not a success and won't become one.

PS: I won't even caveat "is not a big success", it's clear it's not a success at all. Maybe breaking even and maybe kind of making a couple of cents on the dollar is very far from success, investing money like this is a big waste of time.

Oh yeah, I'm certainly not treating it as any limit. Costs could indeed turn out to be higher (or lower). I'm just stating we don't know. And of course, investments will have to be made to ramp up a revenue from any source, cinema, rent, ppv, dvd, tv (and we're only at the 'cinema-stage' right now).

As for succes, it's a relative term. From an investor's perspective it might be a disappointing result if the movie only breaks even (if at all). From Blizz's perspective it might be a succes when all costs are at a minimum covered. From the fan's perspective I'd say it's a succes already, judging by it's IMDB score of a 7,5 (which is a bit too generous I'd say and expect it to drop a little).

Looking at the potential of sequels (and back to more guessing) I'd say there's a big potential. This whole project demonstrated a couple of things: it showed there's a big market out there interested in the brand but also that the film has quite a bit room for improvement left. I wouldn't be surprised if Blizz manages to learn from this experience and invests in a sequel that'll deliver a higher quality. After all, that's how they treat the game as well.

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Exactly.

We know the movie cost 160 million to make and has already grossed over 400 million. For anyone on this forum to claim it hasn't turned a profit is simply a salty kid who early on in the thread thought the movie would fail.

I'm not so sure it actually has turned a profit, yet, if at all. All I've said is that the numbers don't add up right now, simply because most numbers are either a guess or incomplete (still ramping up).

[Zoneseek]

Any single solitary person OUTSIDE of this forum would laugh in your face if you said that a movie which cost 160 million to make and will hit 500+ million is not profitable. It's just that simple.

No regular joe outside of this forum gives a shit how much the movie made. For some reason the userbase on here bases their enjoyment of warcraft games/movies/etc based on their popularity, like they're so insecure about liking a certain game or movie that they need everyone else to like it too and have it make shittons of money or they're just not satisfied. I really don't get why people give a crap, its just weird.

[Feeline10]

No regular joe outside of this forum gives a shit how much the movie made. For some reason the userbase on here bases their enjoyment of warcraft games/movies/etc based on their popularity, like they're so insecure about liking a certain game or movie that they need everyone else to like it too and have it make shittons of money or they're just not satisfied. I really don't get why people give a crap, its just weird.

Agreed. I have no idea why people care so much. It's bizarre. Why people care so much that movie has been a success worldwide and not the flop as predicted.. it bugs some people. It flopped here in the US for sure.. but worldwide it's been so profitable. It bothers some people and I just don't get why.

[Deleted]

I don't understand why he'd come on a Blizzard forum and trash Blizzard all day. But to each his own.

The movie isn't terrible, it's just not awesome. Enjoy it!

I have not played wow for some years and I really enjoyed the movie. Like, 7/10 or so. Deffinatly worth a watch.
Also wether other people enjoyed it has no interrest to me. Thankfully.

[rda]

No regular joe outside of this forum gives a shit how much the movie made. For some reason the userbase on here bases their enjoyment of warcraft games/movies/etc based on their popularity, like they're so insecure about liking a certain game or movie that they need everyone else to like it too and have it make shittons of money or they're just not satisfied. I really don't get why people give a crap, its just weird.

It's easy to explain: WoW lately was bad in the eyes of many, many, many people. Many of the things Blizzard are doing have been questioned. What they did with this movie has also been questioned (actor play, CGI, etc, and don't get me started on the lore). So, when the movie turns out to be more or less a flop, it is tempting to go the forum and write "told you so". (Then we get funny fanboys who keep writing the same nonsense like "the movie turned a profit, because 400 mil is greater than 160 mil, you all can't do math" for ten posts in a row, and it all can continue for a long time, producing hundreds of pages.)