Will warlocks suck for T1 in Legion ?

[Deleted]

Are locks really that doomed that even top guilds are abandoning them on their rosters?

Keep in mind that for top guilds it doesn't matter if it performs 5% or 25% worse than other classes/specs. Lower performance*, as long as it is consistently outside of very low tolerances, means it's not going to have a high representation.

edit: * = unless the class brings something crucial to the table, which we don't

[Thelxi]

I doubt warlocks will suddenly all reroll.

[Maleific]

Are locks really that doomed that even top guilds are abandoning them on their rosters?

Two posts down from the OP, Nordahl linked Serenity's roster and they're using 3 locks.

We're not gods, but we're far from unviable. Destruction has some almost disgusting cleave potential and still excels and raid mechanics ads etc.

We'll be fine.

[xpose]

Wait, are you whining that you actually have useful talents more than 1/row?

Our class has to pick and choose between being able to do ST or AOE through our talents while other classes keep their AOE untouched. It's a bit of bad class design.

[Istaria]

Are you sure? Serenity's roster still have warlocks?

https://serenity.gg/#!/roster

I don't think the roster page is up to date.
Pretty sure Furty will main a priest.

[xuros]

ok then please explain the new sims ?

http://i.imgur.com/yh0NKBc.png

or are you locks still hurdurdururudurudur we bad we need buffs hurdurdur like you always are ?

Could be worse. We could be all hurdurdurdur like people who take sims as gospel.

[Deleted]

Not so much that they are really awful, more that there are better choices for ranged dps. Fire mage for example just brings more to the table, and it really helps that fire mages, MM hunters for example aren't pushed into niches by talent builds.

They just don;t have to make such binary choices via talents as locks do.

But I would add this caveat, I think demonology really is that awful outside of single-target tunneling and even that tends to get seriously screwed by movement.

Demo will rarely achieve it's base potential because it;s just horrible mechanically unless you're doing Patchwerk

[Uzkin]

The Serenity roster page is probably outdated. Their warlocks don't seem too happy about the state of the class atm:
https://serenity.gg/forum/showthread.php?tid=140

Edit. Oh, I see the link was already posted on last page.

[Deathsknight]

I think destro and afflic will both be workable in raids. A pain in some areas but usable at least. Demo however needs a lot of work. Long ramp up time, to much tunneling and it sucks with even slight movement. They need to rework quite a bit for it to be really usable on any fight that isn't complete patchwerk style(all of them) and even then they are still not worth it.
The spec has potential they just really need to fine tune things.

[Deleted]

Our class has to pick and choose between being able to do ST or AOE through our talents while other classes keep their AOE untouched. It's a bit of bad class design.

Yeah, MM hunters have cleave as a passiv epart of their ST and they just aren;t forced to choose between AOE and single target, not least because something like Barrage is pretty good ST anyway, whereas say affliction's SOC or even more Sow the Seeds is utterly useless

Fire mages have slighter harder talent choices than hunters, but look at their artifact - their first Gold trait is Pheonix Flames. Three charges of an instant cast AOE which always crits, and the 45 second recharge means they'll always have a full three charges for the next trash or add pack.


Affliction and Destruction have to take talent combos to do AOE anywhere near that and sacrifice lots of ST to do so.

- - - Updated - - -

The Serenity roster page is probably outdated. Their warlocks don't seem too happy about the state of the class atm:
https://serenity.gg/forum/showthread.php?tid=140

Edit. Oh, I see the link was already posted on last page.

Progression raids have no reason at all to take a warlock. They just won't. Member sof progression raids are expected to have multiple chars for the same role, and they just stack the best classes and bench the rubbish ones.

Serenity won;t take warlocks, there is no point whatever, warlocks bring nothing unique to a raid that justifies there presence when you can take a mage or hunter and do considerably more dps.

Destruction is the most viable raid spec, and even it is middle of the pack. They will just take mages or hunters who can do everything a lock can do, only better.

I already know I am going to be the only warlock in my guild. The other guy rerolled mage.

[Fatbeaverlol]

So.. I guess its warlocks for pvp only as affliction ?

[Deleted]

Destro / Affliction are not completely bad. Yes, they will probably not make the cut in the top 10 hardcore progression raids if they stay as they are right now, but that is actually only affecting 300 of 6+ million players. For all the others, locks are OK. We won't top the meters except maybe for a couple select fights (2-target cleave, without too much movement), but we ARE in fact viable.

Skill cap is actually higher than I originally thought, it just moved to timing of casts. Affli will be all about timing UA(s) right. Destro will be about timing Havoc, Roaring Blaze and Chaosbolts right. Demo is about timing the "this sucks, I quit" right

[Fatbeaverlol]

Destro / Affliction are not completely bad. Yes, they will probably not make the cut in the top 10 hardcore progression raids if they stay as they are right now, but that is actually only affecting 300 of 6+ million players. For all the others, locks are OK. We won't top the meters except maybe for a couple select fights (2-target cleave, without too much movement), but we ARE in fact viable.

Skill cap is actually higher than I originally thought, it just moved to timing of casts. Affli will be all about timing UA(s) right. Destro will be about timing Havoc, Roaring Blaze and Chaosbolts right. Demo is about timing the "this sucks, I quit" right

Well what spec do you suggest starting with ? I might do pvp only so that means i should go affliction ?

[Binaris]

honestly i doubt the class matters. if you are wearing t1 in legion, you will suck.

[Moggie]

Are people actually surprised by top guilds not bothering with locks? I even said they were bottom of the barrel back in July and was flat out told how wrong I was, demo was a beast, and my all-time favorite quote "on the sky is falling bandwagon." The class as a whole suffers from outdated artifact mechanics, outdated talents, and especially outdated AE mechanics. Especially when you compare to the other pure dps. What's even more silly is a blue finally saying something to Warlocks and the fact they're ignoring / have ignored 30+ pages of threads for each spec. Too little, too late. So, I'll repeat myself. The class is bottom of the barrel. There will not be some delusional "110/artifact will change things" I keep seeing left and right. Best the class can hope for are some very basic mechanical changes in 7.1 at this point. Not trolling. Just facts. And if you seriously take simcraft instead of in game performance at face value, then I feel bad for you. Good Luck in Legion!

[Favella]

Well what spec do you suggest starting with ? I might do pvp only so that means i should go affliction ?

If you are in doubt aways choose Afflic.

[Heaterz 88]

everyone is parroting shit without actual testing on the PTR. the class does VERY WELL dps wise. its just not fun to play. numbers ARE THERE. we are strong on cleave like no other. Affliction is insane on multidot fights, and demo is very very strong single target. im propably going 16/16/16 in all artifact weapons first and see if anything gets adjusted in the first three weeks.

this. no one is disputing our dps. its the gameplay that has the problem. afflictions burst aoe could use some tuning tho.

[Deleted]

So.. I guess its warlocks for pvp only as affliction ?

More or less. Demonology maaaybe for arena because of the burst. Affliction is solid and good to go.

[Coils]

If I had to bet, I'd agree with the consensus here and say that Warlocks will be viable, but in niches situations. They will absolutely be required to swap specs (whoops artifacts) to remain more viable for the tier overall than say, a MM Hunter..

- Affliction will be great on ST and Council fights, but will be subpar by a good margin on any fight with short-lived, high-target AoE.
- Demonology has too many issues with ramp-up to be successful relative to other specs on AoE or target-swap fights, but will also be good on ST.
- Destro will be fantastic on sustained cleave fights, but will likely be average outside of that niche.

Posters above are right - actual damage numbers aren't an issue, its just spec mechanics which will result in lower actual output in real-game situations.

[CuchuCachu]

everyone is parroting shit without actual testing on the PTR. the class does VERY WELL dps wise. its just not fun to play. numbers ARE THERE. we are strong on cleave like no other. Affliction is insane on multidot fights, and demo is very very strong single target. im propably going 16/16/16 in all artifact weapons first and see if anything gets adjusted in the first three weeks.

My issue is our antiquated and unnecessarily restricted mechanics