Outlaw or Assassination for Main raid spec?

[Crayonz12]

We'll first things first. New sims I checked show outlaw outperforming assasination in 840 ilvl (Link:[I cannot post links but its just simcraft results.)

In my raids comp, I and another rogue will be gluing ourselves to priority targets or bosses. We seldomly take part in AoE, Cleave, or adds.

Now that my role in my raid has been established.. Would it be worth full on swapping to Outlaw? Orginally I went ass like the sims suggested for the start of legion. My Artifact's power is currently lvl 15.

I also leveled Outlaw's up to run mythics with my grp we needed more cleave so it's currently lvl 14.

I was talking to my GM today about it and he got rather frustrated because I was asking if I should swap to outlaw (Don't want to mess up the comp by swapping. He said pick the highest single target DPS and play that.)

With what I've done in mythics Outlaw hasn't even touched the DPS I pull in assassination. I'm fishing for bones correctly. I don't have the best trinkets but still. At Ilvl 844 I can burst at nearly 600k dropping down and holding 190k-240k (Depending on the fight). With outlaw I've only had seldom moments where I touched the consistent DPS I can pull in assassination. With burst being around 200-350k and dropping down to 150k- 200k.

Now my final question, With the role I'll be playing in raids, Is outlaw or assassination best suited?

[Deefame]

It seems that Outlaw and Assa are pretty equal in sustained ST at the moment gathering from all sources. However, the sims would imply that Assa scales much worse than Outlaw with gear. It's impossible to say at the moment which will be the best single target dps 2 months from now. Currently I'd say that good Outlaws beat good Assas more than the other way around. That's just my experience though.

[Goron24]

It seems that Outlaw and Assa are pretty equal in sustained ST at the moment gathering from all sources. However, the sims would imply that Assa scales much worse than Outlaw with gear. It's impossible to say at the moment which will be the best single target dps 2 months from now. Currently I'd say that good Outlaws beat good Assas more than the other way around. That's just my experience though.

Don't the sims usually assume BiS raid gear, so the sims would be from T19?

[shaunika123]

Don't the sims usually assume BiS raid gear, so the sims would be from T19?

there are sims for 840 865 and 880 gear

in all of which outlaw is winning by a landslide

[Deleted]

there are sims for 840 865 and 880 gear

in all of which outlaw is winning by a landslide

But the real is slight, assa even pulls ahead on mythic 840-850 item range.

[elfporn]

But the real is slight, assa even pulls ahead on mythic 840-850 item range.

No, it doesn't.

[shaunika123]

But the real is slight, assa even pulls ahead on mythic 840-850 item range.

nope

the only time it pulls ahead is like 810-820

[Deleted]

Guys you should stop believe to calcs which cant proven before the raids are starting.
Go use booth specs on mythic runs, try it out on training dummys for atleast 5 minutes.
Then say again outlaw outperforming assa.

[ticktock19]

Guys you should stop believe to calcs which cant proven before the raids are starting.
Go use booth specs on mythic runs, try it out on training dummys for atleast 5 minutes.
Then say again outlaw outperforming assa.

Sims are run thousands of times to get an accurate result that excludes RNG, you should trust those results far more than one mythic run or 5 minutes on a training dummy. And even then, Outlaw wins in both situations. Nobody is stopping you from playing the spec you like, even if it isn't the current king of numbers.

[Gilor]

Guys you should stop believe to calcs which cant proven before the raids are starting.
Go use booth specs on mythic runs, try it out on training dummys for atleast 5 minutes.
Then say again outlaw outperforming assa.

Okay, Outlaw is outperforming Sin.

What do you want people to do - the evidence is out there in sims/dummy testing and mythics (and I'm a Sin fan.) I'm handily beating Sin as outlaw in any content I try. The only time a Sin rogue can get ahead is when you go into one of those low RTB runs. Since I'm moved on with my Outlaw weapon now I can no longer test them side by side but back when I only had them both at 13 traits Sin was only ahead on parses that averaged 1.4 buffs, any more than that and it dropped away quickly. Of course almost by definition the Sin players I'm seeing in dungeons are probably not the best players so it's hard to genuinely evaluate on live but I feel like if the sims, own testing and live observation aren't enough, you just need to play what you want and stop trying to justify it on any other level.

[elfporn]

Guys you should stop believe to calcs which cant proven before the raids are starting.
Go use booth specs on mythic runs, try it out on training dummys for atleast 5 minutes.
Then say again outlaw outperforming assa.

Done. Ive run mythics against similarly geard guildies(843, 845, 845ilvl) for the last two lockouts and outlaw performs better, no matter which on of us is ass.

Before you ask, we lumped same armor tpes together for guild runs, we ran 8 groups.

[Florena]

I think I'm just going to go assassination unless the gap turns out to be bigger than I realize, and there's also a chance outlaw will be tweaked down some in 7.1 as well when they do a balancing pass.

[FenrizZJ]

it is a pretty simple answer no? if you want to do the best dps you can, go Outlaw and play it correctly. if you think it doesn't matter and you will play what you want, then go sub or assassination.

[alchemykillr]

Hoping Assassination can become a more viable spec and shine with ST a bit more than it does, and a lot of others agree. I proposed some changes that could help us out a bit if you guys could comment and thumb up my post over on the wow forums /forums/en/wow/topic/20748936368?page=1

[pies1]

We'll first things first. New sims I checked show outlaw outperforming assasination in 840 ilvl (Link:[I cannot post links but its just simcraft results.)

I

It'sworth bearing in mind that said sim is for patchwerk and patchwerk fights don't exist in T19. The actual consideration here is which has better target switching and burst.

[Eazy]

There's currently no reason to play Assassination if you're going to progress as best as possible. Assassination is the best spec for me in this game(in terms of lore/fun), but Outlaw is best in PvE right now.

Arguments like:
Outlaw will be nerfed soon - are baseless.

It's like saying - Life if not worth to live - we're still going to die, so why not just kill ourselves now to stop that miserable thinking?

EVEN if Outlaw is going to be nerfed, I'm 99% sure Blizzard won't nerf it as much to be worse than Sub/Sin, because it's probably spec which had biggest overhaul in Legion.

[Deleted]

EVEN if Outlaw is going to be nerfed, I'm 99% sure Blizzard won't nerf it as much to be worse than Sub/Sin, because it's probably spec which had biggest overhaul in Legion.

I'm also hoping that they don't nerf it because the RNG of RtB is a high factor. It's a risky spec while the others are consistent in their damage, Outlaw can have problems in certain cases.
For me that is a good thing, because it adds some kind of spice to the PvE aspect where you can't plan for everything. It may be frustrating at times, but I can deal with it and I love it when you have a 3 or 6 procc.

[Florena]

I'm also hoping that they don't nerf it because the RNG of RtB is a high factor. It's a risky spec while the others are consistent in their damage, Outlaw can have problems in certain cases.
For me that is a good thing, because it adds some kind of spice to the PvE aspect where you can't plan for everything. It may be frustrating at times, but I can deal with it and I love it when you have a 3 or 6 procc.

I don't think they'll nerf it into the ground, but I wouldn't mind seeing a few tweaks to make sure that the specs are fairly close or at least all have different, roughly equal situational strengths. It just sucks seeing 'Outlaw is THE progression spec and outshines the other specs in pretty much every way.'