Am I the only one finding it increasingly weird to be having weapons like Doomhamer?

[Cirayne24]

Why of all people are we entrusted with this legendary weapon? We're just some random Joe Schmo who acts as a ghost in the general main story.

We aren't some Joe Schom, we are the Champions of the World. We stopped Nefarian in Black Rock Mountain (and again in Depths), we stopped C'thun and Yogg Saron, we toppled the Lich King's reign, we stopped Death Wing, we stopped Garrosh and his Iron Horde and we foiled Guldan once. We are the heroes that the characters of lore need. We are legitimately the strongest characters in the world and the only ones trustworthy enough to get the job done (lore wise).

The MMO part is dilutes the RPG part, but we still are "The Man/Woman" of the Universe.

[Draeth]

The plot of the game is essentially that only one member of each class exists as an important lore figure, and these, the Adventurers, are the same dozen people who have accomplished everything from killing Edwin VanCleef in the Deadmines to Archimonde at the Black Gate, and all that was between.

When you're playing the game, you're one of these 12 people. It's no different than how several million people can play Mass Effect as their own Shepard, but canonically, there is only one.

[Pony Soldier]

A lot of people here are taking me way too seriously and getting mad for no reason. I thought this would've been a light subject to talk about but seeing how I'm on MMO-Champion I forgot being positive was not allowed here and any opinion you express is quickly dismissed as complaining.

Anyway yeah I get that I'm some legendary hero who's done all kinds of amazing things but the game even points out that there is more than one hero. People here are saying that they killed the Lich King and Deathwing and all them but when fighting those bosses they always address us as heroes not hero as in multiple heroes. So those other players aren't really nonexistent as some people say since the game's characters recognizes them. Are we just supposed to dismiss that too? If anything tanks would be the true heroes since they're the ones who protect everyone and take most of the aggro and damage from the bosses themselves and seem to be the most important in a dungeon/raid. None of the victories we've had were because of a single hero but heroes and the game always recognized that.

Like I said it's not a big deal and I'm certainly not complaining about it as some people are accusing me of. I'm fine with wielding Doomhammer and Ashbringer it's just when I seen that picture it made me realize how much of a legendary weapon I and many others are wielding and it just felt a bit strange the more I thought about it how multiple heroes are wielding the same legendary weapon as if they were mass produced.

[D3athsting]

It would be weird if DK would get Frostmourne

[Deleted]

It's no different than how several million people can play Mass Effect as their own Shepard, but canonically, there is only one.

One attempts to immerse you through a single-player RPG campaign; the other through a massively multiplayer RPG campaign; the latter fails at immersing because when you canonically state that there can only be 12 players, and you account for the rest of the playerbase through duplication, that's stupid, and only serves the interests of players who are voraciously anti-social and want no community atmosphere in an MMO.

I forgot being positive was not allowed here and any opinion you express is quickly dismissed as complaining.

I've read the whole thread; every post beside that of the OP is, in your words, 'positive'.

[samwel93]

I literally don't even notice people have these amazing lore weapons even when they are very recognizable like the ashbringer or doom hammer. They are literally just a weapon with a talent tree in my eyes.

[Pony Soldier]

It would be weird if DK would get Frostmourne

Yeah see this is what I'm saying how would it look if you seen 20 DKs running around with the same Frostmourne.

[blackblade]

Thats your big problem? Not the fact that you there are apparently infinite lich kings that you kill each week? Or that everybody is "The Champion"? Or for some odd reason apparently infinite people exist who are more powerful than you but you are the only person to help?

At the end of the day WoW is a game and you need to interpret its gameplay as such. There is only 1 ashbringer. Unless you believe only one person on a server should have one piece of any given gear at any given time (So only one shaman can own Tier 6, one tier 5, etc) i don't understand the complaint you are making.

Hard to explain. Isn't really a lore/ludonarritve dissonance problem, but I'm used to way more diversity in what people have strapped to their backs weapon-wise. Seeing everyone with a shitty vanilla model weapon is bizzare (and will likely fix itself as people start mogging/unlocking new skins).

[Cirayne24]

Yeah see this is what I'm saying how would it look if you seen 20 DKs running around with the same Frostmourne.

You can't have the MMO without the other people. It comes down to the player (you) suspending your disbelief for a few things in order to fit into the RPG part of the game.

[Deleted]

suspending your disbelief for a few things

Seeing your immersion be constantly broken by literally every other level-capped player in the game in the open world, present on the back of every one of those characters, isn't exactly something the player can suspend their disbelief for, as much as it's something the company running an MMORPG could've thought about differently to protect the immersiveness of their own product. Don't dump that responsibility on the players.

[Cirayne24]

Seeing your immersion be constantly broken by literally every other level-capped player in the game in the open world, present on the back of every one of those characters, isn't exactly something the player can suspend their disbelief for, as much as it's something the company running an MMORPG could've thought about differently to protect the immersiveness of their own product. Don't dump that responsibility on the players.

Why can only 10/25 people run an instance? Why doesn't the 100+ Alliance/Horde just run into the city and kill everyone that needs killing? Why are there time/rep gates on content? Why is Alliance still fighting for that crappy stables in Arathi Basin? Why hasn't Horde created a bridge with more archers for Alterac Valley? Why does it take kililng 20 boars to gather 5 liver... do the other 15 not have livers?

If you want to fully immerse yourself, you can't do that in an MMO. No MMO can you the single player feel or it wouldn't be an MMO. Example, SWTOR (way more RPG than WoW) didn't only have 3 Sith Players becoming the Sith Lord and then not let other people play the class.

Bottom line, there is only immersion in SOLO content (ie you getting the weapon), besides that you have to suspend disbelief or you'll just get "upset" at the lack of immersion.

[Brightamethyst]

Anyway yeah I get that I'm some legendary hero who's done all kinds of amazing things but the game even points out that there is more than one hero. People here are saying that they killed the Lich King and Deathwing and all them but when fighting those bosses they always address us as heroes not hero as in multiple heroes. So those other players aren't really nonexistent as some people say since the game's character's recognizes them. Are we just supposed to dismiss that too?

Personally I like the way FFXIV handles it. Canonically you are the Warrior of Light, savior of Eorzea, but the game still acknowledges the existence of other players. Your party members are there in pre/post-dungeon cutscenes, when you get a group or dungeon quest the NPCs often say things like "feel free to bring a few of your adventuring buddies with you", and stuff like that. It makes you feel important without making the existence of other players weird.

[Pony Soldier]

Seeing your immersion be constantly broken by literally every other level-capped player in the game in the open world, present on the back of every one of those characters, isn't exactly something the player can suspend their disbelief for, as much as it's something the company running an MMORPG could've thought about differently to protect the immersiveness of their own product. Don't dump that responsibility on the players.

Looks like someone understands where I'm coming from.

It's MMORPG so Blizzard should've treated it like an MMORPG. You can't just make me the "chosen one", give me some legendary weapon knowing that its only one around and make me feel special about having it and unlocking it's true powers just to throw all that in the garbage once you set foot in Dalaran and see other "heroes" wielding the same thing. It's just not for this kind of game, an MMO. Give me something totally made up like the other classes got and let me choose from the different appearances to make mine look a little more unique from the others. Would've made a lot more sense.

- - - Updated - - -

Personally I like the way FFXIV handles it. Canonically you are the Warrior of Light, savior of Eorzea, but the game still acknowledges the existence of other players. Your party members are there in pre/post-dungeon cutscenes, when you get a group or dungeon quest the NPCs often say things like "feel free to bring a few of your adventuring buddies with you", and stuff like that. It makes you feel important without making the existence of other players weird.

Yeah see and I wish WoW would do a little more of that.

[Lightwysh]

First of all, when you're playing WoW YOU'RE the hero. Those other players lore wise in your game world don't exist, or at the least are just lesser Shamans who don't actually have Doomhammer. Obviously gameplay wise that isn't the case, which creates an awkward paradigm, but when you're playing your character you're the hero. When I play mine, I am, and so on.

Regarding the being a no name hero, that isn't the case anymore. At this point your character, your Shaman, has killed Illidan/Lich King/Deathwing etc. He/she is a hero of the Alliance/Horde. It is completely reasonable for you to have a weapon as legendary as Doomhammer. You aren't some schmuck killing boars in Elwynn Forest with it.

Yet we still have to do poop quests and gather 20 bear asses for every faction.

[Jibjub]

According to the story in-game ... we have literally saved Azeroth over and over and have done WAY more for the world than Thrall ever will/could. We die and come back to life. We face the biggest threats (and the smallest). We have killed opposing faction leaders.

We are basically GODS.

Doomhammer isn't worthy of us.

[Paperfox]

In the next exp. your character will be the final boss!

[Pull My Finger]

I find it decreasingly weird. At this point it's just my weapon that I keep yanking artifact power into. I really don't care if it's some legendary lore weapon or "just" some cool unique weapon, it's the same to me. I don't even notice what other people are carrying around at all, it's nothing I pay attention to. My character isn't some "random Joe Shmoe" either. So, yeah, that's that.

[Deleted]

If you want to fully immerse yourself, you can't do that in an MMO.

MMORPGs are the most immersive platform available, when they're actually directed properly; re: 2004-07 WoW. It's not about full frontal, 100% 'Journey' levels of immersion, it's achieving a platform which doesn't jarringly separate you from a charming world, whilst still giving you a ton of QoL, UI featurettes, and adhering to what's technically possible (ie. the limited nature of loot tables, instancing limitations, phasing) etc. WoW once followed that direction, it's a massive reason for the success of the game during that period of time which is vastly underrated; to some extent because a lot of players simply don't understand, or respect the impact that immersive design philosophy has on how you perceive the game, and how it makes you feel getting to interact with both the world and other players at a community level, rather than limiting multiplayer interaction to instanced gameplay.

[Pony Soldier]

Why can only 10/25 people run an instance? Why doesn't the 100+ Alliance/Horde just run into the city and kill everyone that needs killing? Why are there time/rep gates on content? Why is Alliance still fighting for that crappy stables in Arathi Basin? Why hasn't Horde created a bridge with more archers for Alterac Valley? Why does it take kililng 20 boars to gather 5 liver... do the other 15 not have livers?

If you want to fully immerse yourself, you can't do that in an MMO. No MMO can you the single player feel or it wouldn't be an MMO. Example, SWTOR (way more RPG than WoW) didn't only have 3 Sith Players becoming the Sith Lord and then not let other people play the class.

Bottom line, there is only immersion in SOLO content (ie you getting the weapon), besides that you have to suspend disbelief or you'll just get "upset" at the lack of immersion.

See though with those examples you provided it's a lot easier to come up with an explanation for why. It's a lot harder to come up with an explanation as to why there are 10 shamans running around Dalaran with the same Doomhammer when it is an obvious fact that there is only one Doomhammer.

For Alliance/Horde storming a city and killing everyone I could say they're not doing that because well we have demons destroying our world and corrupting things and we can't afford to be starting faction wars at this point (I'm looking at you Genn Greymane).

For the time/rep gates for content I could say it takes time to prepare things like your class hall research projects and missions just as it would in real life and for rep. I could say that you're not trustworthy enough or the rep. isn't familiar with you enough to give you their most valuable things.

The Alliance is still fighting for that crappy stable because for the simple fact that it is their property and they're not going to let the filthy Horde take it over.

As for the bridge not sure what you're talking about there as I don't think that really has anything to do with immersion.

Killing 20 boars and only receiving 5 livers could be because of their condition. One might be sliced in half by your weapon or burned by your spells.

You can't really come up with an explanation for Doomhammer though other than "well the elements forged copies of them" and that's just lame.

[snusrage]

nope not at all i like my huge 10ft steel slab of a weapon for my arms warrior!