United Nations panel says U.S. owes reparations for slavery, mass incarceration

[Belize]

I was making a joke. Sorry that didn't come across well enough.

*pat on back* I got it buddy, it's not everyone that's gifted with understanding things, don't worry about it

[May90]

The comparison was to slavery though, see post #142.

I mean, when we are talking about how Jews are better off now than in the past as a result of Holocaust, it makes sense to consider the Holocaust as starting point, that is ~80 years ago. With slavery, it would be more like ~150 years ago - but again, many slaves didn't live long enough to give birth to their "successors", so it would be quite unethical to appeal to the final result for those who lived to see it: many didn't, and their final result was death on a plantation.

[Narwal]

Hi Sodapoppin, The You En said today that as a straight white male you must give all of your donations to Nick the black, tee hee

In all seriousness, if I take a black person out for lunch is that enough reparations?

[Feltima]

If any of you understood what the legacy of slavery actually is, maybe you'd feel different about it. It's not about White America giving Black America money because of shit their ancestors did hundreds of years ago. Anyone with a brain can acknowledge that no white person living today, nor their grandparents owe anyone on a personal level. It's the country, the hegemony itself that owes Black America. The US would not be the economic superpower it is today if it weren't for slavery. The wealth of this country is literally born from the blood and suffering of my ancestors. After slavery ended, our strongest/brightest men(not the woman, not the weak, the boys and men who were clearly paragons among their peers) to keep Black America in place. It took an entire century before we could properly vote, and not be seen as second class citizens. Even then, we still continued to suffer through systemic destruction of black business(Black Wall Street anyone?) as well as the assassination of our leaders whether it was MLK JR. or Huey Newton.

Mainstream America is always talking about how blacks needs to do X to come up, and when we do that, our neighborhoods get destroyed, and our leaders killed. All that black on black crime that you all have to ask about everytime BLM wants to protest? That's a problem created by white america. I come from South Shore, which is the nexus of all the crime you hear about in Chicago. Back in 01, South Shore was BOOMING with black business, it was amazing and seems almost like a dream. The city decided to tear down cabrini green, and displaced all those people into our neighborhood, with the city knowing full well that Cabrini green was full of four corner hustlers while peaceful South Shore has always been Black P. Stone. So, before any of you want to espouse what's wrong with Black America get your facts straight first. It's not about blaming white folks today, it's about addressing the systemic destruction of our race every single time we try and get our shit together.

Every single generation of Black America has been traumatized by injustices inflicted upon our ancestors, and directly against us ourselves, that's a legacy you can't just pull yourself up by your bootstraps from. There's research that makes it very clear that environmental factors such as centuries of slavery and the legacy that followed can have a profound impact on genes.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/da...n-through-dna/

America has literally been torturing and bloodletting Black America since it ever existed. It's not about money, it's about acknowledging that Black America's suffering and perpetual state of pain is a blight upon the American dream. Until America acknowledges the pain it's brothers and sisters have gone through, there is nothing but the American nightmare for Black America.

[Beazy]

America has literally been torturing and bloodletting Black America since it ever existed. It's not about money, it's about acknowledging that Black America's suffering and perpetual state of pain is a blight upon the American dream. Until America acknowledges the pain it's brothers and sisters have gone through, there is nothing but the American nightmare for Black America.

/rollseyes

This professional/perpetual victim shit is getting old.

[cubby]

If any of you understood what the legacy of slavery actually is, maybe you'd feel different about it. It's not about White America giving Black America money because of shit their ancestors did hundreds of years ago. Anyone with a brain can acknowledge that no white person living today, nor their grandparents owe anyone on a personal level. It's the country, the hegemony itself that owes Black America. The US would not be the economic superpower it is today if it weren't for slavery. The wealth of this country is literally born from the blood and suffering of my ancestors. After slavery ended, our strongest/brightest men(not the woman, not the weak, the boys and men who were clearly paragons among their peers) to keep Black America in place. It took an entire century before we could properly vote, and not be seen as second class citizens. Even then, we still continued to suffer through systemic destruction of black business(Black Wall Street anyone?) as well as the assassination of our leaders whether it was MLK JR. or Huey Newton.

Mainstream America is always talking about how blacks needs to do X to come up, and when we do that, our neighborhoods get destroyed, and our leaders killed. All that black on black crime that you all have to ask about everytime BLM wants to protest? That's a problem created by white america. I come from South Shore, which is the nexus of all the crime you hear about in Chicago. Back in 01, South Shore was BOOMING with black business, it was amazing and seems almost like a dream. The city decided to tear down cabrini green, and displaced all those people into our neighborhood, with the city knowing full well that Cabrini green was full of four corner hustlers while peaceful South Shore has always been Black P. Stone. So, before any of you want to espouse what's wrong with Black America get your facts straight first. It's not about blaming white folks today, it's about addressing the systemic destruction of our race every single time we try and get our shit together.

Every single generation of Black America has been traumatized by injustices inflicted upon our ancestors, and directly against us ourselves, that's a legacy you can't just pull yourself up by your bootstraps from. There's research that makes it very clear that environmental factors such as centuries of slavery and the legacy that followed can have a profound impact on genes.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/da...n-through-dna/

America has literally been torturing and bloodletting Black America since it ever existed. It's not about money, it's about acknowledging that Black America's suffering and perpetual state of pain is a blight upon the American dream. Until America acknowledges the pain it's brothers and sisters have gone through, there is nothing but the American nightmare for Black America.

I have to say I've never seen the issue framed this way before. Definitely something to consider and rethink my position. Thank you for the posting.

- - - Updated - - -

/rollseyes

This professional/perpetual victim shit is getting old.

He wasn't kidding about the scientific data pointing to trama inflicted upon one and extending to another purely through genes. I laughed at the idea until my wife brought home a study demonstrating that very thing (she works in foster care and the study was about children of victimized parents showing signs of victimization even though to the grandchildren stage, when they had not been victimized - this is a horrible summary of the study, apologies - I will find it if I can and post it - nvm, he has one in his post).

[Underverse]

If any of you understood what the legacy of slavery actually is, maybe you'd feel different about it. It's not about White America giving Black America money because of shit their ancestors did hundreds of years ago. Anyone with a brain can acknowledge that no white person living today, nor their grandparents owe anyone on a personal level. It's the country, the hegemony itself that owes Black America. The US would not be the economic superpower it is today if it weren't for slavery. The wealth of this country is literally born from the blood and suffering of my ancestors. After slavery ended, our strongest/brightest men(not the woman, not the weak, the boys and men who were clearly paragons among their peers) to keep Black America in place. It took an entire century before we could properly vote, and not be seen as second class citizens. Even then, we still continued to suffer through systemic destruction of black business(Black Wall Street anyone?) as well as the assassination of our leaders whether it was MLK JR. or Huey Newton.

Mainstream America is always talking about how blacks needs to do X to come up, and when we do that, our neighborhoods get destroyed, and our leaders killed. All that black on black crime that you all have to ask about everytime BLM wants to protest? That's a problem created by white america. I come from South Shore, which is the nexus of all the crime you hear about in Chicago. Back in 01, South Shore was BOOMING with black business, it was amazing and seems almost like a dream. The city decided to tear down cabrini green, and displaced all those people into our neighborhood, with the city knowing full well that Cabrini green was full of four corner hustlers while peaceful South Shore has always been Black P. Stone. So, before any of you want to espouse what's wrong with Black America get your facts straight first. It's not about blaming white folks today, it's about addressing the systemic destruction of our race every single time we try and get our shit together.

Every single generation of Black America has been traumatized by injustices inflicted upon our ancestors, and directly against us ourselves, that's a legacy you can't just pull yourself up by your bootstraps from. There's research that makes it very clear that environmental factors such as centuries of slavery and the legacy that followed can have a profound impact on genes.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/da...n-through-dna/

America has literally been torturing and bloodletting Black America since it ever existed. It's not about money, it's about acknowledging that Black America's suffering and perpetual state of pain is a blight upon the American dream. Until America acknowledges the pain it's brothers and sisters have gone through, there is nothing but the American nightmare for Black America.

I doubt the veracity of your claims. A few examples does not a persistent systemic problem make. Nigerian migrants are incredibly successful in the United States; if your claims of systemic and continuing racism against African Americans were true, surely this population would also suffer.

It's more likely that the current state of the post-slavery African American population is an outcome of poor cultural practices, many of which are secondary outcomes of slavery, past racism, and past segregation. But none of these are contemporary effects. The pressure would be lifted, if it weren't maintained by this persistent self-victimization.

Furthermore, America has acknowledged its past failings. That's been done. Slavery, segregation, and racial discrimination are demonized in every history book published in the US. That's called an acknowledgement; and we're not even including government benefits that are disproportionately paid to African Americans, which would be considered by some to be reparations in and of themselves.

- - - Updated - - -

He wasn't kidding about the scientific data pointing to trama inflicted upon one and extending to another purely through genes. I laughed at the idea until my wife brought home a study demonstrating that very thing (she works in foster care and the study was about children of victimized parents showing signs of victimization even though to the grandchildren stage, when they had not been victimized - this is a horrible summary of the study, apologies - I will find it if I can and post it - nvm, he has one in his post).

Epigenetic changes can alter responses to stress (and metabolic pathways, if the original stressor involved resource acquisition), but that's a far cry from experiencing the trauma of your forbears. These kinds of articles use buzzwords to snare the attention of the scientifically illiterate. I wouldn't extrapolate too far.

[Beazy]

He wasn't kidding about the scientific data pointing to trama inflicted upon one and extending to another purely through genes. I laughed at the idea until my wife brought home a study demonstrating that very thing (she works in foster care and the study was about children of victimized parents showing signs of victimization even though to the grandchildren stage, when they had not been victimized - this is a horrible summary of the study, apologies - I will find it if I can and post it - nvm, he has one in his post).

That's not what I'm referring to. Im referring specifically to "Until America acknowledges the pain it's brothers and sisters have gone through, there is nothing but the American nightmare for Black America." quote.

A white guy saying "I acknowledge that" isn't going to change anything. Not when the problem is 1000 feet deeper than "acknowledgements".

[Kalis]

He wasn't kidding about the scientific data pointing to trama inflicted upon one and extending to another purely through genes. I laughed at the idea until my wife brought home a study demonstrating that very thing (she works in foster care and the study was about children of victimized parents showing signs of victimization even though to the grandchildren stage, when they had not been victimized - this is a horrible summary of the study, apologies - I will find it if I can and post it - nvm, he has one in his post).

My grandfather was in WWII, my great-grandfather in WWI, I must be due a medal for the bravery I have shown in the face of my inherited trauma.

People will latch onto any excuse to not blame themselves for their failings, but grandad having a rough time of it is a new one.

That linked study says it was conducted on only 32 people, hardly conclusive.

[DJ117]

UN do organizes large refugee tent camps in "safe zones" in countries that is in war...think how many more desperate refugees there would be without them.....

I don't care about that. Some parts of the world will forever be shit. It was shit before Western colonies and after. It was only stable when the empires ran it.

[Lady Dragonheart]

Isn't this the same UN that said that the US's wages are the equivalent to slave labor? Does that mean that this is all a big ploy to suggest Basic Income?

[Feltima]

/rollseyes

This professional/perpetual victim shit is getting old.

I'm not a victim, at all. I've made it out of the hood, pay my own bills, and have never received benefits. I regularly rally against a lot of the SJW BS, including BLM. Please, PLEASE don't pain me as a member of the damn victim culture because i'm not. There is a serious problem in relations with Black America, you can't simply coat it as perpetual victim shit because it ain't.

I'm not asking for some white dude to go "sorry", that's not going to solve the problem. I thought I made it really clear it's not about white people feeling bad or any of that BS, it's about acknowledging that there is a multi-generational problem that is getting direly worse as the years go on, and how we begin to address it. You can't expect Black America to suddenly just figure shit out, when the past couple of generations have been blighted by crack, something the US government came up with, or the failed projects that created generations of ineptitude and reliance on a meager check from welfare. It's a complex issue that's goes FAR beyond shit like that. It needs to be acknowledge so that we as a country can address the problem and ensure that future Black America doesn't continue this downward spiral to oblivion.

[Kalis]

I'm not a victim, at all. I've made it out of the hood, pay my own bills, and have never received benefits. I regularly rally against a lot of the SJW BS, including BLM. Please, PLEASE don't pain me as a member of the damn victim culture because i'm not. There is a serious problem in relations with Black America, you can't simply coat it as perpetual victim shit because it ain't.

This leads me to ask "Why not?" in response to...

You can't expect Black America to suddenly just figure shit out...

Are you not a living example that black Americans can figure this shit out? Why are the black Americans I know not also examples?

[Hooked]

I'm not a victim, at all. I've made it out of the hood, pay my own bills, and have never received benefits. I regularly rally against a lot of the SJW BS, including BLM. Please, PLEASE don't pain me as a member of the damn victim culture because i'm not. There is a serious problem in relations with Black America, you can't simply coat it as perpetual victim shit because it ain't.

I'm not asking for some white dude to go "sorry", that's not going to solve the problem. I thought I made it really clear it's not about white people feeling bad or any of that BS, it's about acknowledging that there is a multi-generational problem that is getting direly worse as the years go on, and how we begin to address it. You can't expect Black America to suddenly just figure shit out, when the past couple of generations have been blighted by crack, something the US government came up with, or the failed projects that created generations of ineptitude and reliance on a meager check from welfare. It's a complex issue that's goes FAR beyond shit like that. It needs to be acknowledge so that we as a country can address the problem and ensure that future Black America doesn't continue this downward spiral to oblivion.

As a white person I'm sorry, believe me I'm really sorry about slavery.

[Tobbie]

I asked my Black Neighbor how are white people racist towards him and he laughed at me. He said he traveled to Africa and said "Thank god for slavery because I would never live in Africa" I guess since he actually gave a shit about school came up from the horrible neighborhood he grew up in and made something of his life he has no reason for the racism card. My neighbor ended our conversation with "If black people want reparations Ill be more than happy to give it to them but it comes with a plane ticket to africa and they can live there"

I think my neighbor is racist. But hes Black so i'm confused.

[Themius]

This leads me to ask "Why not?" in response to...



Are you not a living example that black Americans can figure this shit out? Why are the black Americans I know not also examples?

A person making it isn't the status quo.

- - - Updated - - -

I asked my Black Neighbor how are white people racist towards him and he laughed at me. He said he traveled to Africa and said "Thank god for slavery because I would never live in Africa" I guess since he actually gave a shit about school came up from the horrible neighborhood he grew up in and made something of his life he has no reason for the racism card. My neighbor ended our conversation with "If black people want reparations Ill be more than happy to give it to them but it comes with a plane ticket to africa and they can live there"

I think my neighbor is racist. But hes Black so i'm confused.

Well your neighbor is a dumbass if he isn't going to look at why many African countries have issues today. Also let's recall not all of fucking Africa is third world, it's a continent. Not all of the Americas is shit because we have some third world countries in this hemisphere.

[Asiwassaying]

As a black American. I will pay myself reporations in the form of this milk shake.

[Theinquisition]

If any of you understood what the legacy of slavery actually is, maybe you'd feel different about it. It's not about White America giving Black America money because of shit their ancestors did hundreds of years ago. Anyone with a brain can acknowledge that no white person living today, nor their grandparents owe anyone on a personal level. It's the country, the hegemony itself that owes Black America. The US would not be the economic superpower it is today if it weren't for slavery. The wealth of this country is literally born from the blood and suffering of my ancestors. After slavery ended, our strongest/brightest men(not the woman, not the weak, the boys and men who were clearly paragons among their peers) to keep Black America in place. It took an entire century before we could properly vote, and not be seen as second class citizens. Even then, we still continued to suffer through systemic destruction of black business(Black Wall Street anyone?) as well as the assassination of our leaders whether it was MLK JR. or Huey Newton.

Mainstream America is always talking about how blacks needs to do X to come up, and when we do that, our neighborhoods get destroyed, and our leaders killed. All that black on black crime that you all have to ask about everytime BLM wants to protest? That's a problem created by white america. I come from South Shore, which is the nexus of all the crime you hear about in Chicago. Back in 01, South Shore was BOOMING with black business, it was amazing and seems almost like a dream. The city decided to tear down cabrini green, and displaced all those people into our neighborhood, with the city knowing full well that Cabrini green was full of four corner hustlers while peaceful South Shore has always been Black P. Stone. So, before any of you want to espouse what's wrong with Black America get your facts straight first. It's not about blaming white folks today, it's about addressing the systemic destruction of our race every single time we try and get our shit together.

Every single generation of Black America has been traumatized by injustices inflicted upon our ancestors, and directly against us ourselves, that's a legacy you can't just pull yourself up by your bootstraps from. There's research that makes it very clear that environmental factors such as centuries of slavery and the legacy that followed can have a profound impact on genes.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/da...n-through-dna/

America has literally been torturing and bloodletting Black America since it ever existed. It's not about money, it's about acknowledging that Black America's suffering and perpetual state of pain is a blight upon the American dream. Until America acknowledges the pain it's brothers and sisters have gone through, there is nothing but the American nightmare for Black America.

The primary industry that benefited from slavery was the cotton industry, which was honestly, in decline at the time of the civil war, as far as infrastructure goes, much of it was destroyed during the war.

What wealth exactly was created from slavery that continued past the war?

[NicoWolf]

Ah, but facts get in the way of the "but muh oppression" narrative that makes people who would otherwise be merely average feel relevant and thus, paid attention they would not normally receive. And we all know how good it feels when we get those brief moments when we are the center of attention, no matter how trivial or irrelevant the situation may be.

What I would really enjoy seeing clarified is who in the U.S. is responsible for these reparations and who is entitled to receive them.

Actually, I want to tug this thread a bit more.

Let's assume for even a second that this idea actually gets traction that reaches purely retarded levels of stupid and moves forward. By U.S. Law, it might create a precedent; a "sins of the father" sort of mentality that if your ancestors did something to someone, you might be held responsible for any ongoing suffering even if you have nothing to do with the situation.

This is why the cancerous notion of social justice needs to be purged, violently if necessary, to preserve freedom, equality, and social progression.

[Deleted]

I know one person who is NOT entitled to any reparations and does not share in the history of Black America in any way - that would be Barrack Hussein Obama.

Obama's father was a Kenyan, he was not American. No money for Obama.