The new developer Q&A makes no sense

[kamuimac]

"

Uhhhhhhhhh hello? Do you know there's this spec called outlaw rogues? Yea that one spec which 99% of the rogues were playing, then got nerfed into oblivion. Remember that? What about their effort in the artifact and gear? Fuck them?

yes f.. them just like their compltly f... DHs

[Glorious Leader]

You're running raids either way, not really a grind.

Assuming you raid. The entire game at lvl 110 is a grind and thats okay so im kinda curious why grinds are bad for legendaries but okay for everything else.

[melodramocracy]

beta is not for balancing specs.

"I just tried the PTR for 7.0, and my class sucks!"

"relax, it will be fixed in beta"

"Beta's over, and my class still sucks"

"relax, you need to wait till you're max level and have the artifact going, it changes everything"

"I'm at 110 and my class still sucks"

"you should have rolled something else then, didn't you listen to beta feedback?"

"head on desk"

[Traveler Voltin]

Did my daily heroic not 20 mins ago, havoc DH, Destro Warlock and Outlaw Rogue, all 850+ and pushing near 300k dps singletarget.


There is so much bullshit doomsaying on this forum.

In a dungeon sure.
The complaints are about raiding

[Nize]

OP, that's what Ion was trying to say. There might not be a big gap in dps between Outlaw and Assassination. Assassination is on top, sure, but it might not be that far ahead Outlaw. The reason why it looks like that in sites such as Warcraftlogs is due to good players always shooting for the best spec, leaving the worst players to play things like Outlaw, thus it looks like there's this huge gap between the two.

[Ielenia]

"The legendary items could be sold by a vendor and require some currency, but it would just feel like a long grind. You would feel relief when you are finally done, not excitement"

So then why the fuck did you add a grind to upgrade them?

There is no "grind", because you'll be doing the exact same thing you have already been doing: killing raid bosses. It can't really be called a 'grind' if it's not asking you to do anything more than what you're already doing, right?

Why the fuck did you add an artifact weapon to the game as a... wait for it.. LONG GRIND?

Same basic answer as above.

[Requiem94]

Well, whats new.

If your spec isn't the best spec in the game, it's instantly garbage and Blizzard sucks at balancing.

The whole Warlock/DK/Fury "controversy" is so fucking stupid because none of those is really terrible, just mediocre.

But there have to be mediocre specs.

I just want my warlock to feel good mechanically and visually as it states that is not the case for all three of the specs. I would be okay with shit numbers if the specs felt good in practice...but they don't. And the real yells from the warlock community are mechanical based with others just saying give us number buffs. As it stands aff needs almost a full rework along with 1 or 2 new gold traits, demo needs to have DE removed from the rotation, and destro needs to get back the passives that were baseline in the spec for the last 2+ xpacks as making them talents is uncreative and shameful of devs.

I'm not even going to begin to speak for DK's or fury warriors but I'm sure their gripes are real.

[Makorus]

I just want my warlock to feel good mechanically and visually as it states that is not the case for all three of the specs. I would be okay with shit numbers if the specs felt good in practice...but they don't. And the real yells from the warlock community are mechanical based with others just saying give us number buffs. As it stands aff needs almost a full rework along with 1 or 2 new gold traits, demo needs to have DE removed from the rotation, and destro needs to get back the passives that were baseline in the spec for the last 2+ xpacks as making them talents is uncreative and shameful of devs.

I'm not even going to begin to speak for DK's or fury warriors but I'm sure their gripes are real.

Really, I give you Aff, which is a design disaster in every single way.

But Demo and Destro? Completely fine. You might not like them, but they are completely fine.

[Berndorf]

I really do get the impression that players who play mages are on some kind of strange pedestal at Bliz because they are always using them as the example for why they don't want to nerf a class/spec and have those players mad at them. It also reminds me of something GC said a month or so ago when asked why frost mages remained semi op for pvp for so long and his reply was that it was the most popular class for devs and further said there was always some dev who would defend them so it seems he wasn't just joking. Bliz honestly just seems afraid to nerf mages at all and with them its 'we'll bring the other specs slowly up' while other classes don't get that luxury.

[Requiem94]

Really, I give you Aff, which is a design disaster in every single way.

But Demo and Destro? Completely fine. You might not like them, but they are completely fine.

Alot of people dislike DE as it makes you feel like a demon babysitter and not some commander of minions. It's not terrible, but it can be removed and demons be made to actually feel strong instead of walking dots.

And seriously destro's mastery isn't terrible but it's uninspiring and rng is not needed. Devs state they want to get rid of all the classes feeling the same and want to make each spec feel unique but they make all three warlocks use soulshards. Burning embers worked so much better for destro thematically. But let's be real here taking passives like backdraft and making them talents and then saying "choose" is uninspiring and lacking in creative design.

[Deleted]

Uhhhhhhhhh hello? Do you know there's this spec called outlaw rogues? Yea that one spec which 99% of the rogues were playing, then got nerfed into oblivion. Remember that? What about their effort in the artifact and gear? Fuck them?

I think Ion is speaking about mages and not rogues because of this:

Parse numbers Heroic Emerald Nightmare ( https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/10#difficulty=4 )

Rogue ...... 176,776

Assassination 84,253 ... 47.7%
Outlaw ...... 80,950 ... 45.8%
Subtlety .... 11,573 .... 6.5%

Mage ....... 268,635

Arcane ...... 11,630 .... 4.3%
Fire ....... 252,843 ... 94.1%
Frost ........ 4,162 .... 1.5%

[Khain]

Clearly you have no idea what you are talking about

People don't understand that they have many things to test in beta like zones, quests, bosses, bugs. Class balance is low priority, it is something they do in the end of the beta and something that needs a lot more data than you might think. Most players don't care if frost dk is 7% below unholy, people who care about this stuff are the 1% mythic raiders.

[getupkid55]

What is retarded is the number of changes they have to make to balance specs. What are the 10 months alpha/beta for? Don't they have proper simulation?

The alpha/beta is for testing CONTENT and make sure there are no bugs. They do fix any glaring balance issues but it's hard to get a tight balance in a beta where the majority of players are playing classes they don't normally play and there is A LOT less good data.

[Deleted]

People don't understand that they have many things to test in beta like zones, quests, bosses, bugs. Class balance is low priority, it is something they do in the end of the beta and something that needs a lot more data than you might think. Most players don't care if frost dk is 7% below unholy, people who care about this stuff are the 1% mythic raiders.

People do care if they are benched from raids due to broken specs.

[TheRabidDeer]

"If Frost mages were buffed slowly into being the best spec, lots of Fire players will be upset about the effort they already put into their artifact and gear. Those players will also switch to Frost, having it swing far ahead of Fire in logs and making it look very strong."

"The team is trying to avoid wild swings in class balance."

Uhhhhhhhhh hello? Do you know there's this spec called outlaw rogues? Yea that one spec which 99% of the rogues were playing, then got nerfed into oblivion. Remember that? What about their effort in the artifact and gear? Fuck them?

What doesn't make sense? He is talking specifically about frost mage changes. Did you miss the part before that that says, "It is likely that there will be more class balance changes before Patch 7.1 and after Patch 7.1." which means outlaw will probably see buffs

As for people saying they should've adjusted class balance in beta. They did. A lot. But you don't have a big enough sample size to get really accurate balance

[Glorious Leader]

There is no "grind", because you'll be doing the exact same thing you have already been doing: killing raid bosses. It can't really be called a 'grind' if it's not asking you to do anything more than what you're already doing, right?


Same basic answer as above.

Okay so then add the currency to raid bosses and you buy legendaries with them. Of course thats still a grind. So is ap. So is suramar. So is the entire fucking max level experiencr and thats good. Trying to alter the definition of grind doesnt actually stop a grind from being one. Suramar was the definition of feeling relieved but not excited. For the record AP does indeed ask yoi to do things other than raiding as well. The developers are so clueless about their own fucking game.

The contradiction between the lack of an option to grind out for legendaries (cause this is awful apparently) and the rest of the game being a fucming grind should be obvious. Im not complaining about the grind, I just dont see why you couldnt add it for legendaries as well.

[Aggrophobic]

If people had the mindset that damage isn't the sole determining factor to a classes performance threads like this would never appear.

"We could bring this 400k DPS Fire Mage, or this 350k Destro lock with summoning stone, B res, health stones etc."

Only problem right now is too many classes bring zero raid utility, and some bring tons.

Why would you ever take the warlock here?
There are health pots, there is a summoning stone outside and lets get real, if people are late just remove them from the raid team.

If your raid leader picks the warlock here, find another guild.

[l33t]

If people had the mindset that damage isn't the sole determining factor to a classes performance threads like this would never appear.

"We could bring this 400k DPS Fire Mage, or this 350k Destro lock with summoning stone, B res, health stones etc."

Only problem right now is too many classes bring zero raid utility, and some bring tons.

If we were playing Vanilla where support spells are needed to complete content, sure. Nowadays, not so much. You can take a 400k dps fire mage and complete a dungeon 10 minutes faster than you'd do with a destro warlock who not only does 300k dps, but also is slow as fuck and your team of ww monk, veng dh, fire mage and disc priest has to wait for his slow ass to come to boss for minutes.

Time is money, friend. Especially when you're playing with randoms.

[Al Gorefiend]

Why would you ever take the warlock here?
There are health pots, there is a summoning stone outside and lets get real, if people are late just remove them from the raid team.

If your raid leader picks the warlock here, find another guild.

Well, Warlock was probably a bad choice to use for an example, but team comp isn't entirely a choice of highest DPS gets the spot. Instead of comparing Mage and Lock, how about Enhance shaman vs. Fury warrior? Enhance is doing 250k but brings lust, fury does 300k but doesn't bring lust. Would you still pick the fury?

And if the answer is yes, then my point gets across - if Blizzard balanced classes more around buffs and situational abilities than just raw DPS output and the community got behind the mindset I think balancing would be easier, personally

If we were playing Vanilla where support spells are needed to complete content, sure. Nowadays, not so much. You can take a 400k dps fire mage and complete a dungeon 10 minutes faster than you'd do with a destro warlock who not only does 300k dps, but also is slow as fuck and your team of ww monk, veng dh, fire mage and disc priest has to wait for his slow ass to come to boss for minutes.

Time is money, friend. Especially when you're playing with randoms.

Yeah I agree nerfing mobility in Legion is stupid. I don't want to be half as fast as a DH

[Aggrophobic]

Well, Warlock was probably a bad choice to use for an example, but team comp isn't entirely a choice of highest DPS gets the spot. Instead of comparing Mage and Lock, how about Enhance shaman vs. Fury warrior? Enhance is doing 250k but brings lust, fury does 300k but doesn't bring lust. Would you still pick the fury?

And if the answer is yes, then my point gets across - if Blizzard balanced classes more around buffs and situational abilities than just raw DPS output and the community got behind the mindset I think balancing would be easier, personally



Yeah I agree nerfing mobility in Legion is stupid. I don't want to be half as fast as a DH

Yeah, I'd still pick the warrior (these aren't real numbers though, but IF they were). There are other classes that can bring BL.
DPS really is what matters in most cases.

You might bring a rogue for the sick CDs once in a while but in this tier, not so much.