[Megathread] Legendary Discussion (Legion)

[Typhoria]

If they cared about it being exciting, instead of the Legendary item drop, a Legendary Token would drop to exchange for an item of power of your choice.

It would go from "shit, Prydaz/Sephuz's" to "Hell yeah! I got a Token."
The whole "At least you got a Legendary" is a terrible argument. Let me spray paint a pile of shit orange and then people who complain about not getting a Legendary can have that.

[runique]

There is no problem.

K. I mean blizzard even thinks there is a problem, as do many casual and hardcore players. But thank you for clearing up the fact that they are all misguided.

[Deleted]

The totem wouldn't give any stats but only the passive effect found on the legendaries, These would still be obtained the same way you obtain legendaries right now (RNG) but you'd recieve your first one of choice after completing your order hall.

So you would be able to chose your first "totem", so everybody would chose the best one and then when others droped by RNG, we would have to delete them because we got the best from the beggining completing our order hall. And as it is an unique "totem" slot having 2 would be useless. Unless you wanted another for an offspec. In this case you would have the same "problem" that the ones who cry about this system have now, your best off "totem" would only come with RNG

Your system needs a second though.

[araine]

The problem i have with legendaries at the moment is the massive difference between players who have zero legendaries and players that have 2-3. The system is plain silly right now.

I have accepted the fate that i will get ZERO legendaries on all my characters in this expansion. already falling very far behind due to the lack of em and it will just get worse

[wtfzerg]

Someone in our raid got 2 in heroic tonight lol.

[FertsBlert]

and people still seriously think that is going to be true? like i would bet my left testicle that they arnt going to release nighthold content that expects your whole guild to have legendaries to do it without doing some kind of "legendary catch up" mechanic.

i really want to people to link this source where blizzard makes it sound like you will not make any progress through nighthold without a guild full of legendaries.

This is Blizzard we are talking about, you don't remember the many many occasions where they have plowed ahead exactly as planned in the face of conflicting information from the playerbase only to later go "oh yeah oops we got that wrong"?

That also doesn't discount the fact that under an RNG system some people will never see that drop according to the rules of probability, it also doesn't allow for the fact that some of the "Legiondaries" are garbage.

[Deleted]

You have one, you can't really understand the feeling of having 20 DAYS /played and zero legendarys.

Yeah, but the problem is I don't have two! I'm falling so far behind it's silly. Getting rejected from groups and losing my raid spot.
You people wihtout legendaries just can't understand how hard life is with one legendary compared to ALL hardcore raiders who already have 3 at this point!!1111

Blizzard should fix this because it's 180k DPS loss every time I PUG something without second legendary! I'm considering unsubbing.

[Deleted]

Why is it dumb as fuck? It happens, constantly, even on minor guilds. Even on pugs, even on mythic+.

I've been pugging mythic+ since half way through the first week whenever I couldn't find someone in the guild, I've both started and joined groups and not once have I or anyone in the guild been asked if we have a legendary. This forum is fantastic at grossly exaggerating how bad something is. The odd person may be a dick and whisper, yes, but it's so incredibly rare anyone is that much of a twat that mentioning it is more damaging than ignoring it.

However, it's dumb as fuck because A) it doesn't happen very often, see my above point and B) when it does happen, it's dumb as fuck because like I said above a legendary doesn't mean you aren't shit. You could have the best legendary for your class/spec but if you can't move out of shit you'll die and do shit DPS either way.

[Deleted]

There is a better and easier solution, instead of a random legendary just drop a token so you can get whatever legendary you want to, you still get your excitement moment and you will keep doing content just for the maybe i will get a legendary this time.

Blizzard already acknowledged this solution when they introduced the tier tokens many years ago, the current system is just plain nonsense and its causing much more frustration than good.

It is very frustrating when a RNG drop determines if you are competitive enough or bench material, because good Mythic guilds have more than 20 good players, who are able to execute the mechanics of the encounter and are able to use their class to atleast a 90% potential and at that point having a DPS legendary is way too much an advantage for competing for those spots.

And lets not talk about some specs like arms, which having the gloves or the ring makes you go from the bottom of the meters to the top.

You know some of us (and most of the people that i know playing WoW) play games because we like to compete, being unable to compete because the playground is uneven cause of rng is frustrating and bad design.

[Deleted]

IMHO it is just a strange Design. Some Legendaries give serious dps/hps boosts, and some are just complete useless, like my ring with slow on corruption (awesome for raid content, where 99% is immune to that). Don't see the appeal of them.

[Aggrophobic]

i could just imagine this thinking in professional sports.

"welp, im not lebron james, i better just give up and not even bother contributing!"

this is a team game. you arnt competing against guildies, you're actually HOPING they do well.

it amazes me that blizzard adds something that is supposed to be fun and bring "feel good" moments, and a good amount of people treat it like its the worst thing ever. I still dont have a legendary on either of my lvl 110s and i still have that hope after every boss kill and ever world quest chest that something is in it.

But thats not the same thing. The legendary system is more like, you'd let half you team play without one leg. The ones without a leg willl still be able to play but they would stand no cnance against the other players.

If they are lucky they might get an extra leg, but it's might en up being a really short one that you can't really use so you better hope you're lucky and get one of thoes long legs. They are super rare though, so don't count on it.

There are very few "feel good" moments with this system. Mostly it's just frustration. That is bad design.

[Deleted]

The big problem with giving everyone a token, is that everyone goes and buys the same legendary, because there is a general order of power for the legendaries per spec. So every person playing a class then has the same legendary. You might as well make the passive effect baseline at that point.

It's also frustrating to see legendaries drop when people have played less/characters have been played less. I received my first legendary on an alt, that had been played for 2 days at 110, and had completed one Mythic+ dungeon, and probably two Mythic dungeons, and zero raid content.

I received my second legendary on my main 3 days later. There was very little satisfaction however. Sure, it's cool to get a legendary. The system is far from perfect, the big problem is that fixing it isn't easy.

[Deleted]

Ok, you clearly don't understand how tokens work. That token you just bought with gold, how did it appear on the market? Someone bought it, for real money, and paid more than one month of sub costs. Blizzard makes more money from selling 1 token (even if it's "free" to you) than from selling 1 month of sub.

Sure, but i am playing the game sub free with a minimal effort, i never said blizz does not profit from that, and i do not care.
The game is sub free FOR ME, and that is all i care about and all i said.

[Glorious Leader]

This is shitty system for Casuals. System is fucked because PLAYERS who PLAY the game cant get bis items. RNG is too big in this expansion. RNG is EVERYWHERE in this expansion. Everything is RNG based. God and this awful necks and rings without main stats wtf?

Its shitty for everyone except maybe the devs.

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There are very few "feel good" moments with this system. Mostly it's just frustration. That is bad design.

In the recent q and a they said that if they put the gear on a vendor or for a currency the reaction would be one of relief rather than excitement. I think they will find the opposite is true. The fact that people know these things exist will only lead to the eventual reaction of relief when rng finally rolls in their favor and they win one. I can however state when good gear was available for purchase from a vendor through either rep farm or currency farm i felt alot better about it. You could even say i was excited for it. Or at least eager for it.

[Kreeshak]

Its shitty for everyone except maybe the devs.

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In the recent q and a they said that if they put the gear on a vendor or for a currency the reaction would be one of relief rather than excitement. I think they will find the opposite is true. The fact that people know these things exist will only lead to the eventual reaction of relief when rng finally rolls in their favor and they win one. I can however state when good gear was available for purchase from a vendor through either rep farm or currency farm i felt alot better about it. You could even say i was excited for it. Or at least eager for it.

Agree on the bolded part. Which makes you wonder do the devs, play their own game? Do they connect with the player base?

[Deleted]

The big problem with giving everyone a token, is that everyone goes and buys the same legendary, because there is a general order of power for the legendaries per spec. So every person playing a class then has the same legendary. You might as well make the passive effect baseline at that point.

Well, this will be the outcome for sure if they are "tokemized" but then, the problem is that DPS legendary BiS are too good, blizz should make a decision either nerf the dps legendarys so they are a a minimal dps increase (~30k dps instead of 100+k that they are currently now) or just remove the dps legendarys and make them have unique utility effects like shields, blessing time increased, etc...

The big problem right now is that the DPS legendarys are too good and that they are completely RNG, upsetting not only class balance but guild balance, because as a raidleader (or party leader) you will bring your best performing players (assuming equal skill level) when you are advancing and there is absolutely nothing that you as player can make to change the situation, well you can play a lot (like im doing) but you also have to be lucky (which im not being), and that is something that is completely out of your control, because as a player no matter how much time you spent playing you have to be double lucky, lucky to have a legendary and lucky enough so its a good legendary, and that again is out of our control and that generates frustration, and no matter how much you can love this game in the end, a lot of people will end up quitting because they are not on an even playground to compete and that is bad design.

[Aggrophobic]

Its shitty for everyone except maybe the devs.

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In the recent q and a they said that if they put the gear on a vendor or for a currency the reaction would be one of relief rather than excitement. I think they will find the opposite is true. The fact that people know these things exist will only lead to the eventual reaction of relief when rng finally rolls in their favor and they win one. I can however state when good gear was available for purchase from a vendor through either rep farm or currency farm i felt alot better about it. You could even say i was excited for it. Or at least eager for it.

Of course, I agree.

[impending doom]

I can see 2 main "problems" and possible solutions:

A) People think that a legendary gives you Huge boost. In most cases this is really not true, evidence shows that most legendaries give less than 3% dps boost. As a comparison, the difference between best and worst dps class is over 20%. And the difference caused by Skill can be even bigger.

Solution: If there are some legendaries that give too big (over 10%) boost, then it's probably unintented and needs to be balanced

B) People feel that the drop rate is "too random" and unpredictable. Well there has always been a random element in loot, in past extensions it could've taken many weeks to get that BiS trinket to drop. Having 1 chance/week to get a 20% drop is about as good as having 22 chances/week to get a 1% drop. And the more effort you put in, the more likely you're to get it, so in a way legendaries are Less random than any raid loot that has only 1 chance/week.

Possible solution: Make the drop rates and the "bad luck protection" somehow more visible, so that people can see their odds getting closer and closer to 100% until they get it. This way people can see some progress, but the element of surprise is still included.

[Glorious Leader]

Agree on the bolded part. Which makes you wonder do the devs, play their own game? Do they connect with the player base?

No and i dont think they have for some time maybe never. Thats the problem when you hire the best players to also develop your game.

[Celadir]

If the legendary item(s) started at 850 ilvl and scaled up as you progressed (collect something to turn in for increased power), then the systemic issues would be far less of a problem. However, even that system would have issues if you got a drop late in the game from time needed to "power the legendary up" (you'd then have to scale the drop ilvl with raid tiers via patches). Getting a 895 ilvl anything this early is superior to current drops and that is where I feel the largest problem is.