Berkeley Protesters harrass students and disrupt campus

[Slant]

It might seem pointless but if you never tell them they're wrong and push back they'll walk all over you.

Oh, I didn't say it was pointless. I'd argue the fuck out of them, because I think they're funny. But apart from a little argumentative stimulus, they have little to offer in terms of thinking ability. At some point, I'd just walk through them. What are they gonna do? Punch me? rofl

[Slant]

Well, those who actually do that, yeah, I guess an action should be taken against them.

To me it looked like it was the whole mob, the few that there were.

[Polyxo]

If you're going to have fun go at it, but don't bother educating or debating them because that won't work. Seems like a bad idea that goes against how we make up our minds on like, everything.

Really you should debate and educate them, they won't change their mind there but they will when they're on their own thinking about it.

It kinda just seems like you're trying to avoid criticism of the shit they're pulling.



Again, these college students are not great for your theory here.

1. It's not theory.
2. Their status as college students is irrelevant.

[May90]

To me it looked like it was the whole mob, the few that there were.

Action against all participants, when only some of them were blocking students from passing actively, is really not the road I would take. Those that are seen doing that on the video, I'm pretty sure, were violating the code of honor though.

[Post]

They will see push back when they enter a world of competition. Children are sheltered from the world of competition and then they must grow up and face inequality of competition.

I thought uni was a place to grow up and experience competition.

If you listen to people like Sam Harris, or Dave Rubin who talk about the SJW, and the "regressive left" that is how you change opinions. Showing them their own hypocrisy, or clear delusion. But not directly fighting or antagonizing the other side. As I mentioned, reason usually wins in the end.

I agree, but you said not to educate or debate them. That is what the people you listed do. I'm not agreeing to try to shout them down, but you can't just let their ideas go unchallenged. Having a group of people try to establish areas you can't go though, that is oppression.

Oh, I didn't say it was pointless. I'd argue the fuck out of them, because I think they're funny. But apart from a little argumentative stimulus, they have little to offer in terms of thinking ability. At some point, I'd just walk through them. What are they gonna do? Punch me? rofl

I fully support walking through them.

1. It's not theory.
2. Their status as college students is irrelevant.

Being able to attend a top university and freely protest for racial segregation is a pretty clear sign you aren't oppressed.

[PC2]

I am against them. I am not concerned about their feelings, I am concerned that the way the conflict is happening is only going to make both sides escalate.

Dave Rubin and Sam Harris are doing it the right way. Twitter wars are just going to reinforce beliefs. Especially in the echo chambers we now have setup for both sides.

If they do crazy stuff every day, we laugh and criticize them everyday. If right wingers do that, then make threads and do the same thing to them everyday. That's a good thing, it means you have a society that has different ideas.

[Slant]

Action against all participants, when only some of them were blocking students from passing actively, is really not the road I would take.

Oh, no... not against "the mob". I thought more like looking at the video, identifying the people and expelling them or something. Since they're clearly not at uni to study, they might as well fuck off to the next trailer park and think about their choices for the rest of their lives. *shrug*

[Polyxo]

That problem is easy to solve. Find a new realtor and send the discriminatory/racist realtor to the curb.

This is the difference between how young adults think vs matured adults. The young adults want to force equality while the mature adult realizes you can't never have equality and must be more pragmatic about solving problems.

The black community didn't wait for Jim Crow laws to be eliminated, and Civil Rights to become a reality to build universities, and institutions. It is possible to multi task by fighting for more rights while still being pragmatic for progression in life.

Most problems are far too widespread to just 'find another vendor'. Frankly, I have no problem with the idea of forcing one's way towards something closer to equality, even while breaking a few eggs.

[Post]

I did say that you cannot educate them in the way that is being done. There are ways, but even if you try to do it the right way, some people will still see you as the bully.

Not really a reason not to though.

Debate with people that already made up their mind is usually fruitless. One side may "win" but the person being debated, and who lost, will not "switch" sides.

Just like most people do not switch political affiliation from debate. Unless they were already looking to have their mind changed.

Again, they won't change their mind. Their defense mechanisms won't let them be wrong in front of their people, but on their own when they have time to think about it not under pressure they will.

[Polyxo]

I thought uni was a place to grow up and experience competition.



I agree, but you said not to educate or debate them. That is what the people you listed do. I'm not agreeing to try to shout them down, but you can't just let their ideas go unchallenged. Having a group of people try to establish areas you can't go though, that is oppression.



I fully support walking through them.



Being able to attend a top university and freely protest for racial segregation is a pretty clear sign you aren't oppressed.

Nope, it's not. Being able to attend a top university and protest has nothing to do with the multiple forms of discrimination minorities in the US are subject to.

[May90]

Oh, no... not against "the mob". I thought more like looking at the video, identifying the people and expelling them or something. Since they're clearly not at uni to study, they might as well fuck off to the next trailer park and think about their choices for the rest of their lives. *shrug*

That would be fair. But, like I've already said, I don't think it is university's business what students do in their free time, as long as they don't violate the law or the code of honor. If they were doing something illegal/wrong, then let the police handle it. The university shouldn't serve as a law enforcement agency. That's just my stance though.

[Mormolyce]

I sometimes wonder how many of the people commenting on these things never went to university. This kind of protest is basically a daily occurrence.

*sigh*

Why can't this whole thing be over?

What, protests at universities? Hahahaha!

Actually, the same people that voted segregation the first time are the ones asking for it again. Democrats are the party of the KKK, never forget.

The Democrats were the party of the South, but the South now votes Republican. So no, different people.

[Post]

Nope, it's not. Being able to attend a top university and protest has nothing to do with the multiple forms of discrimination minorities in the US are subject to.

I can say "NO!" to things without countering them as well, it doesn't make me right.

[Polyxo]

It is somewhat telling how much people are screaming about this, given that if this were all minorities were subject to, it would be far and away the most benign form of discrimination minorities would have had to handle to date.

[Slant]

That would be fair. But, like I've already said, I don't think it is university's business what students do in their free time, as long as they don't violate the law or the code of honor. If they were doing something illegal/wrong, then let the police handle it. The university shouldn't serve as a law enforcement agency. That's just my stance though.

Hum, the university has a responsibility to provide the right environment for study. Their purpose is not to foster social movements. Their purpose is to help people study. So while they're not a law enforcement agency, they are definitely failing at doing their job.

Also, while it's not the uni's business what students do in their free time, it's absolutely the uni's business what happens on campus. They do not even need any other reason than "it's against uni policy" to forbid these kinds of protests. The fact that most unis in the western world pride themselves in allowing all kinds of social stuff happening is being abused to the max here. And at some point, a uni will start to lose reputation because of this. From the comments I gather that Berkeley, a world renowned university, is already known for these kinds of protests.

[Post]

Only if they were not personally slighted. Because ego takes over at that point. If you do it like Sam Harris, yes, they may change their minds. If you call them a fag, or whatever other name that they get called, as happens on twitter, they will see the other person as "evil" or "bad" and will not concede, because than, in their minds the "evil" person won. Ego driven delusion, and personal attacks keep people believing in all kinds of things for a very long time. Some dying without changing their ideas.

I agree, but I don't consider calling someone a fag debating or educating them.

Isn't that exactly what you are doing in this thread? :P

I'm pointing out something that shows that poster has a very weak argument. They're just saying "no."

So no that's not what I'm doing.

[PC2]

I am not really arguing against this. I am saying that if you want to change their delusions, the way some are doing, by name calling, and antagonistic debate, will not accomplish anything but create escalations on both sides.

The SJW and Anti-SJW just become mutually dependent on each other, and the war never stops. One needs the other to exist, the "good guy" (as both sides see themselves) need the "bad guy" (as they see the other side). And it will be a vicious circle of drama.


If you want a fun debate, or laugh at people, keep doing what you are doing. If you want to fix the root issue, go to the root of the problem, and rationally discuss the issue without name calling, or antagonizing.

If the economy grows a bit and crime isn't going up overall then there really isn't a root issue. It is a bunch of leftist protesters who are trolling their classmates.

[Dextroden]

It is somewhat telling how much people are screaming about this, given that if this were all minorities were subject to, it would be far and away the most benign form of discrimination minorities would have had to handle to date.

Your posts never cease to amaze and inspire me.

[Slant]

Isn't that exactly what you are doing in this thread? :P

But they have the right to protest, whether we like it or not.

Sure, can I go and block a highway because I didn't get a free strawberry ice-cream that I demand each morning? I don't mind them protesting, but romping through a building of study (I am assuming a library of sorts? Classrooms?) is not protesting. It's maliciously fucking everyone's day up. See, I know these kinds of protesters.. I've seen them at my uni. They rarely have an actual interest in what they're doing. They just want an excuse not to study. Thankfully, they usually just take 5 minutes to tell their story and then fuck off.

As I pointed out earlier, the protests that actually grow to 50+ people and block a street? Instant riot police with a water cannon vehicle close behind. Why is it that the US has cops that shoot people for sneezing the wrong way, yet in this particular thing Germany is the hardliner in this comparison? That's so odd...

[Polyxo]

I can say "NO!" to things without countering them as well, it doesn't make me right.

I wouldn't have thought I'd need to do this much hand holding.
So we have minority Berkeley students who are:
1. Still subject to housing discrimination. Their status as students has nothing to do with that.
2. Still subject to discrimination from police. Their status as students has nothing to do with that.
3. Still subject to financial discrimination/redlining. Their status as students has nothing to do with that.
4. Still subject to employment and educational discrimination. Affirmative action is an effort to partially correct discriminatory practices in hiring and acceptance. However, they do not fully correct the discriminatory patterns, as it would upset the majority too much.