Artifact Knowledge: WHY are they saying its alt-friendly? What am I missing?

[tikcol]

I can't believe they're saying such things. Did they actually lose all touch with reality?

Artifact Power is the most anti alt fascist system ever implemented. It's very sad and I shouldn't have to grind as much. It's almost as putrid as the guild concept.

[Tenjen]

Engage hyperbole! Full speed ahead.

About time to Parody the ridiculous insinuations

[Exeris]

They know it's one of their biggest mistakes in legion, I'm confused why they're still clinging on to this..

At least they are doing something so it will be worth logging in.

[alemaite]

So that means you should park your main in order hall till january too, as anything you do right now is utterly inefficient compared to january.

No, because I have been researching AK on my main since the first week of Legion launch and was therefore able to keep up? I swear some of the arguments on this forum make me lose my faith in humanity sometimes. AK is RELATIVE not ABSOLUTE. If you have been researching since week 1, you are not behind anyone and can keep up. If you leveled an alt and hit 110 today, it would take you well over 1 month just to get a good amount of AP from anything really. That is the whole point of this thread, hello?!

[Mykk]

Hello all.

I play casually and have 5 level 110s now, with one "main" who is ilevel 860, with decent Artifact Knowledge level - can't remember exactly what, but that's beside the point.

Devs and other Community members constantly say that AK system is there to help "alts catch up" quicker on Artifact Power, presumably.

How? Where?

When I switch to a new fresh alt, his AK is zero - how is this alt-friendly, when this whole "knowledge" is only for one toon?

Or does it mean, if I had a second Warrior, with another Arms Artifact, then that alt would start straight away with AK10?

Please explain.

you're kidding me? So you're expecting to get +15 AK instantly for your alts? Do you even realise that those who has maximum AK atm it takes 5 days to research new one. For my DH thats 4 AK's behind has 3 days research time.

While yes true you will start at 0 AK but at the same time your reasearch time is a lot faster.

Also top of that here is news flash for you. Anything you do with your alts does not require capped weapon nor tons of traits.
Letting alts to start AK 10 is yber failure design. With that design i would have literally my alt and main at 34-35 traits. No thanks.

Also your alts are progressing even if you don't play them through AK which is good thing. One of the best things about this expansion is that i don't even have to play on my alts to gain progress for them.

Do you seriously expect to get everything at first day? Why can't you have patience? MMORPG's was never meant so you could get everything in first day. This system is completely fine, but knowing blizzard they will add +10AK catch up mechanic in 7.2 or 7.3. but atm we don't need it.

Also you don't even have time to play with all of your 5 alts so let them gain AK while you're not playing with them. Freaking community that has to get everything right away and cannot get stuff trough overtime

[Deleted]

It's not friendly but it's not unfriendly either. Unfriendly would be having to kill raid bosses or some thing that takes a lot of dedication to weekly.
You just log in and click a button and it goes up over time.
The only thing I would like to change is make whatever level your main is immediately available to alts. Like if I'm 20 on my main my alt can get there in 20 days instead of a few months.

Untrue, you need resources so you need to go out there and do WQ's which are a work of the devil himself (god, I hate WQ's)..

[iky43210]

you're kidding me? So you're expecting to get +15 AK instantly for your alts? Do you even realise that those who has maximum AK atm it takes 5 days to research new one. For my DH thats 3 AK's behind has 3 days research time.

While yes true you will start at 0 AK but at the same time your reasearch time is a lot faster.

Also top of that here is news flash for you. Anything you do with your alts does not require capped weapon nor tons of traits.
Letting alts to start AK 10 is yber failure design. With that design i would have literally my alt and main at 34-35 traits. No thanks.

Also your alts are progressing even if you don't play them through AK which is good thing. One of the best things about this expansion is that i don't even have to play on my alts to gain progress for them.

Do you seriously expect to get everything at first day? Why can't you have patience? MMORPG's was never meant so you could get everything in first day. This system is completely fine, but knowing blizzard they will add +10AK catch up mechanic in 7.2 or 7.3. but atm we don't need it.

Also you don't even have time to play with all of your 5 alts so let them gain AK while you're not playing with them. Freaking community that has to get everything right away and cannot get stuff trough overtime

Yes because the alternative to having AK more alt friendly is getting full set of 880 gear and 35 traits worth of artifact power in your mail on day 1 with a legendary of your choosing. We can drop the hyperbole

[Holofernes]

I can't believe they're saying such things. Did they actually lose all touch with reality?

Artifact Power is the most anti alt fascist system ever implemented. It's very sad and I shouldn't have to grind as much. It's almost as putrid as the guild concept.

Your Alt gets knowledge from doing nothing with it.
I only log on alts every week, do some wqs for order resource for the research and they are 1-2 knowledge levels behind my main. It never was so easy. u get progress on your alt for doing nothing but playing your main.

Imagine you would have to do the ap grind you did with your main with your alts too? now just wait one or two month, make one fucking dungeon and get 20 weapon levels from one dungeon. Its so ridicolously cheap and rewarding for alts. You dont have to play them to be on a nearly same level, and people are whining.

[Deleted]

More entitled bullshit right here.

Do you just want Blizzard to mail you a full set of epics in the mail upon hitting 110 too?

- - - Updated - - -



Its just frustrating to see people just fucking expect to be given artifact levels with little to no effort.

People need to fuck off with that mentality. Alts are not just free max level characters with full sets of raid ready gear. They SHOULD still require EFFORT to gear up and get raid ready if that's your (not you @Hcatz, just ppl in general) goal.

Damn, I mean I had 2 characters that I played pretty regularly through TBC. I had a paladin, and a warlock (happend to be named Jaylock) that I raided on both through the game. My paladin was further progressed up to about Tier 5, but then my warlock (as i put in the damn effort) surpassed my paladin and became my main, all the way to beating Kil'Jaeden. I put almost the same amount of time in my warlock as my paladin, but I had the advantage of knowing where i needed to go to progress my character BECAUSE of my experience on my main.

Well, you could also f* off with that "effort" crap.
This is a game, not olympics.
Also, there are also people , rerollers mostly, who really need to get there where ex main is.

[Deleted]

Hello all.

I play casually and have 5 level 110s now, with one "main" who is ilevel 860, with decent Artifact Knowledge level - can't remember exactly what, but that's beside the point.

Devs and other Community members constantly say that AK system is there to help "alts catch up" quicker on Artifact Power, presumably.

How? Where?

When I switch to a new fresh alt, his AK is zero - how is this alt-friendly, when this whole "knowledge" is only for one toon?

Or does it mean, if I had a second Warrior, with another Arms Artifact, then that alt would start straight away with AK10?

Please explain.

faster AK research = quicker artifact power, why presumably? It is what it is. You research AK faster on your alts than on your main. My alt is maybe 2-3 AK levels behind my main and looking at time played compared to AP gained im much faster on my alt. Its a simple math.

Lets be honest though, this is not the problem. The problem is we finally get a system that rewards people who stay subscribed and keep researching AK on their mains and alts. This is why many people hate this whole system, because if they dont buy next month then they slowly fall behind and dont get everything handed to them the moment they come back. People want to play the game for one month, then play something else, then come back for new content patch and expect to be as powerfull as people who stay subbed. I say no thank you.

[Pull My Finger]

It is alt-friendly. My alt doesn't get played NEARLY as much as my main character- nowhere even close - and the traits are coming along real good just because I can collect research without even really doing anything for it. Anyone who whines about this is an idiot.

[Deleted]

Well, you could also f* off with that "effort" crap.
This is a game, not olympics.
Also, there are also people , rerollers mostly, who really need to get there where ex main is.

they will get there maybe 2-3 times faster than we did on our mains...I leveled my alt to max lvl in few hours simply by doing XP missions for a few days, total time required to get to max lvl was maybe 10 times lower, really. My alt is on par with my main when it comes to artifact traits and I spent maybe 10x less playtime to manage that on my alt.

Dont you think its enough? Because these catch up mechanics are crazy when you look at them via playtime required vs. outcome. It really is on the edge of "Do you just want Blizzard to mail you a full set of epics in the mail upon hitting 110 too?" type of argument if you keep pushing this way.

[iky43210]

Your Alt gets knowledge from doing nothing with it.
I only log on alts every week, do some wqs for order resource for the research and they are 1-2 knowledge levels behind my main. It never was so easy. u get progress on your alt for doing nothing but playing your main.

Imagine you would have to do the ap grind you did with your main with your alts too? now just wait one or two month, make one fucking dungeon and get 20 weapon levels from one dungeon. Its so ridicolously cheap and rewarding for alts. You dont have to play them to be on a nearly same level, and people are whining.

So your advice is to not play for a couple months, thanks for the heads up capt.

It's almost guaranteed that there'd be new artifacts to unlock if we ever reached that stage anyway.

- - - Updated - - -

faster AK research = quicker artifact power, why presumably? It is what it is. You research AK faster on your alts than on your main. My alt is maybe 2-3 AK levels behind my main and looking at time played compared to AP gained im much faster on my alt. Its a simple math.

Lets be honest though, this is not the problem. The problem is we finally get a system that rewards people who stay subscribed and keep researching AK on their mains and alts. This is why many people hate this whole system, because if they dont buy next month then they slowly fall behind and dont get everything handed to them the moment they come back. People want to play the game for one month, then play something else, then come back for new content patch and expect to be as powerfull as people who stay subbed. I say no thank you.

I'm sure it took alot of effort and skill to queue up for a work order once a week, you definitely earned that power spike.

Whatever happened to the good old fashion rpg style of getting more powerful by getting better gear? If people are just as powerful as you after quitting for months in gear and artifact power, then you haven't been doing much at all.

[Rotted]

I could be wrong here, feel free to correct if so.

I started a new DH last week, shes 107 now, she has her first gold trait. My next one costs 3k I think. I've only completed one zone for a pillar of creation the rest of the time I've only one dungeons. Which is shit for Artifact power in compassion to quest pre 110. Im pretty sure on my main, I didn't get my first golden trait until 110 and it was a few thousand? I feel like I've got these traits dead quickly on the DH.

Anyways, they also said a new mechanism is coming in to buy up to AK 10

[Noctiphobia]

I could be wrong here, feel free to correct if so.

I started a new DH last week, shes 107 now, she has her first gold trait. My next one costs 3k I think. I've only completed one zone for a pillar of creation the rest of the time I've only one dungeons. Which is shit for Artifact power in compassion to quest pre 110. Im pretty sure on my main, I didn't get my first golden trait until 110 and it was a few thousand? I feel like I've got these traits dead quickly on the DH.

Anyways, they also said a new mechanism is coming in to buy up to AK 10

I definitely got the first gold trait while leveling on both of my characters. You could always get first 13 (or so) traits at a very low cost, and after that it sharply goes up. From like 1.4k to 6k per trait, or something like that.

Now, on topic:
I don't think it's alt unfriendly. What it is really, is reroll unfriendly.
I rerolled more than a month ago, if I remember correctly, from my priest to a mage (mostly due to shadow being unbearable to play in 2v2, especially against competent opponents I started meeting around 2k rating).
While not being in any raiding guild (since I can't raid on a schedule), I got my mage to ilvl 870 (quit my priest on ilvl 860). And I have artifact knowledge at level 11, while my priest is at whatever level is the current maximum (15?). And the research rate slowed down to once every 4 days, so at the current rate I'll need like another month to catch up (assuming I won't slow down to the standard rate while being 2 researches behind, which would make catching up impossible until 25 knowledge).
I just barely passed my priest in terms of artifact power. The priest which I haven't been playing at all ever since I rerolled.
I just wish there was something less retarded than an artificial time gate. I am fine with additional effort needed to quickly catch up, but now it's just impossible.

[iky43210]

I could be wrong here, feel free to correct if so.

I started a new DH last week, shes 107 now, she has her first gold trait. My next one costs 3k I think. I've only completed one zone for a pillar of creation the rest of the time I've only one dungeons. Which is shit for Artifact power in compassion to quest pre 110. Im pretty sure on my main, I didn't get my first golden trait until 110 and it was a few thousand? I feel like I've got these traits dead quickly on the DH.

Anyways, they also said a new mechanism is coming in to buy up to AK 10

Since artifact knowledge is only available for 110 it shouldn't be any catchup mechanics yet for your DH.

[Mykk]

Lol, I'm glad I got some constructive replies before you showed up with your entitlement accusations!

My question was specifically - what Blizzard meant by claiming that AK system is there to make the game more alt-friendly, while I personally haven't seen much of that alt-friendliness yet. Hope it makes sense to you now.

@others,

thanks a lot for your replies and good discussion guys.

its freaking alt friendly. Players are just expecting to get everything in 5minutes of dinging to 110.

Your alts are progressing 100% of the time if you keep your research running while before you had to play with them to progress them. So how exactly thats not alt friendly? I've AK 12 now on my ALT. Once i want to get AP for it do you know how fast i can get +26 traits on weapons? Less than day. Ofc im playing quite lot but still. So how is that bad thing? its not ppl are throwing stupid tantrums over things that they don't understand.

[ItachiZaku]

Please explain.

In theory, when your main hits 110, you can do AK orders that take 5 days and then when an alt hits 110, it should only take 4 days (or shorter time). But I've discovered that is bullshit. I hit my second 110, first hit 110 1 week into expansion, and my alt's timer was 5 full days.

[Deleted]

Again: Why should an alt get their weapon traits easier than your first toon? Your first toon also had low AK in the beginning but the traits do not cost as many points yet. Same for your alt.

13 traits (which includes the first golden for most) cost a bit more than 6.5k AP. At the current AK of most mains, that's 1 normal (not even blue) WQ. 2nd Golden trait is around 18-20 traits, that's between 66k and 128k AP needed. Again, at AK 15, that would take around 3-6 hours played. So, IF AK was account-wide, then it would take a maximum of 6-10 hours played to catch up to the average of the wow (main) population. That same population that has spent 2.5 MONTHS getting there. That sound fair to you?

You can gear yourselves so quickly that it would not take more than a couple of days to be 860+.

The current system of faster AK research will make it so that you will probably need half the time of your main to get to the same level. That sounds reasonable to me.

[Deleted]

What? But not right now? Where would that be?

In 7.1.5 which is likely to be released in December.