Make gear great again !

[Deleted]

Hi everyone !

First of all, sorry if my english is bad, i'm not a native speaker

I'm here to talk to you about one of the core aspects of WoW : items. It has been discussed many times, especially in legion with the setting up of the upgrade system and the legendaries.

I'm here with an assesment : looting a new item is not exciting anymore. To qualify this, i would say there is 3 moments where looting a new item feels really nice :

1. New legendary (Prydaz )
2. Crazy titanforged gear
3. In some rare cases, when you have targeted a specific item and it finally drops (occurs mostly for raid gear and trinkets)

I think we can say without great risks that a lot (majority ?) of the players are not very happy with the first category The good point for those is that the gear itself is very cool, with some crazy effects, and it's not just some boring +1000 intell + 1000 enfu +1000 haste +1000 crit.

About the second one, I think the feeling is nice when you get an unexpected titanforging, but the problem is you often need a titanforged proc to make the gear valuable for you. And when you wait for a RNG proc on a RNG loot, it can be pretty annoying And, of course, it doesn't feel very rewarding to loot the same item in M+10 and in M+0 except from the Mythic 10 written at the top

Finally, i think the third one, which I'd like to call the "original" one (or "vanilla", but i know the term is pretty controversial here ), is in my mind the helthiest of the three. Yes it's RNG based, but you can still work towards your item if you really want it.

With this analysis, I'd like to add that in Legion, you're giving a shitload of gears. And more than that, a shitload of different (theoretically) gears. Each donjon boss of Legion drops 12 different items, and the last boss, 18. Knowing that the large majority of all those gears just differs from the secondary stats, do we really need them ? In my opinion, not really.

So, with all those elements, how can we make gear great again ? In a very simple way (i'm only talking here about donjon gear, but it can be easily apply to raid gear) : make an unique loot table for each donjon boss, whatever the difficulty (from regular mythic or mythic + 15, nothing change in the gear, not even the ilvl), and make each gear in this table a legendary-like .

Here, you're calling me crazy, but let me explain.

First, not all the gears dropping from a boss have the same ilvl. Some can be 840, some 855, some 880.

Second, not all the gear dropping from a boss have the same amount of chance to drop. The 840 gear has a high chance of dropping in a regular mythic donjon (let's say 20%), whereas the 880 gear has a very low chance of dropping in regular mythic donjon (let's say 0,1 %). On the contrary, in a mythic +10 donjon, a 840 gear will have a very low droprate (even no chance) wheras a 865 gear will have a droprate of 20%.
In fact, if you look only at ilvl, this change will not change anything. The only change is on the gear itself, because, now every piece of gear is unique. And not only because of his name, but also because of its stats !

Here come the work for Blizzard, make every piece of gear unique ! In fact, Blizzard has already started to do this, with the legendary items, but particularly with trinkets (since always) and with some random piece of gear in Arcway/CoS/Karazhan (like the +10% AA dmg of the ring in CoS, or the +10% healing cape in Karazhan, or the 2 pieces' sets in those donjons). Add if you remember well, back in the days, there were some really nice items, often weapons, with some crazy effects, like Nightfall or the Helm of Fire crafted by the leatherworkers. So i think it's a lot of work, bu not insurmountable for Blizzard

With those new loot tables, I think we can make each loot feeling more rewarding, and more exciting ! And that's not what we all want ? Give us some crazy items Blizz !

[PewPewArrowz]

No no and no, are you people seriously so deluded on item drop chance from previous expansions? Do you honestly not remember when items you needed dropped 6 months after you started farming them?

For fuck sake stop crying like little babies and put in some effort when they are literally farm-able countless times if you choose to do so, at least now you have that option unlike well any other expansion, its as if people just go brain neutral and forget how hard/rare an upgrade dropped previously (Not counting WoD cause trying to erase from memory)

[Coffeh]

No no and no, are you people seriously so deluded on item drop chance from previous expansions? Do you honestly not remember when items you needed dropped 6 months after you started farming them?

For fuck sake stop crying like little babies and put in some effort when they are literally farm-able countless times if you choose to do so, at least now you have that option unlike well any other expansion, its as if people just go brain neutral and forget how hard/rare an upgrade dropped previously (Not counting WoD cause trying to erase from memory)

Some people actually like to feel some sort of accomplishment in the game, which Legion has stripped away. Not that I agree with much of anything in the OP, but the current system of loot in Legion is horrible.

[LongTimeCreeper]

I think the game you are looking for is Diablo

[PewPewArrowz]

Some people actually like to feel some sort of accomplishment in the game, which Legion has stripped away. Not that I agree with much of anything in the OP, but the current system of loot in Legion is horrible.

Accomplishment? Tell me how accomplished I felt after farming 4 months for Caster trinket from Council on 3 difficulties and never seeing it drop, at least now I can run it 10 times and maybe it will drop. Only thing I'd agree is removing the retard legendaries and keep the "spec" only ones, so you don't end up with 6 legendaries while missing your 2 BiS ones, EVEN then though, people are expecting loot to drop from the sky for them for doing virtually nothing.

The entitlement of most people is so high right now its just mind blowing, put in time, put in effort, get what you want easy as that, there is literally something for everyone to do right now, you don't have time to raid? Cool do LFR, it can proc, do a couple normal mythics, it can drop, do WQ's even they are baseline 845 if you are above 845 ilvl, furthermore if you are a casual player like that whats the point in getting better items if the maximum you want to do is these 3 difficulties? For people that want more, Normal raids, lower bracket of M+ and even Heroic raids, for the extremely dedicated you have higher M+ Mythic raids, not to mention that even if you are a casual player you can STILL get a group to boost your key at least for a weekly 880 item.

If you want a sense of accomplishment do it, don't ask for handouts, you pretty much get them at any level, but to truly get something you HAVE to put effort, this is no different than any other expansion. Or maybe you'd prefer getting a idiotic legendary questline that takes 6 months and is an endless grind of X tokens, oh but hey now we need Y tokens and Z tokens after...cool now that you have it, go grind that one boss 50 times so I can make your ring more powerful, big feeling of accomplishment.

[Coffeh]

Accomplishment? Tell me how accomplished I felt after farming 4 months for Caster trinket from Council on 3 difficulties and never seeing it drop, at least now I can run it 10 times and maybe it will drop. Only thing I'd agree is removing the retard legendaries and keep the "spec" only ones, so you don't end up with 6 legendaries while missing your 2 BiS ones, EVEN then though, people are expecting loot to drop from the sky for them for doing virtually nothing.

The entitlement of most people is so high right now its just mind blowing, put in time, put in effort, get what you want easy as that, there is literally something for everyone to do right now, you don't have time to raid? Cool do LFR, it can proc, do a couple normal mythics, it can drop, do WQ's even they are baseline 845 if you are above 845 ilvl, furthermore if you are a casual player like that whats the point in getting better items if the maximum you want to do is these 3 difficulties? For people that want more, Normal raids, lower bracket of M+ and even Heroic raids, for the extremely dedicated you have higher M+ Mythic raids, not to mention that even if you are a casual player you can STILL get a group to boost your key at least for a weekly 880 item.

If you want a sense of accomplishment do it, don't ask for handouts, you pretty much get them at any level, but to truly get something you HAVE to put effort, this is no different than any other expansion. Or maybe you'd prefer getting a idiotic legendary questline that takes 6 months and is an endless grind of X tokens, oh but hey now we need Y tokens and Z tokens after...cool now that you have it, go grind that one boss 50 times so I can make your ring more powerful, big feeling of accomplishment.

I'm not trying to dictate how you should feel accomplishment. People play for different reasons. Perhaps you should chill out and stop trying to make the argument that everyone should play the game for the same reasons as you.

As for me...I don't give a shit about the gear I get. I never did. When I saw someone in Vanilla in a bunch of blues I was impressed. When I saw someone in actual tier gear I was in awe. I miss that. Nowadays you can be questing and getting epics. Then you get a piece of blue gear +1 ilevel above it and it's superior. That makes no sense. Every piece of gear now might as well be purple, or blue or green or grey. The item quality means nothing. It makes absolutely no difference. I do agree with you that the entitlement of players has lead to this travesty of gear. I guess I was one of the rare players who never looked at people with epics with envy or jealousy.

[PewPewArrowz]

I'm not trying to dictate how you should feel accomplishment. People play for different reasons. Perhaps you should chill out and stop trying to make the argument that everyone should play the game for the same reasons as you.

As for me...I don't give a shit about the gear I get. I never did. When I saw someone in Vanilla in a bunch of blues I was impressed. When I saw someone in actual tier gear I was in awe. I miss that. Nowadays you can be questing and getting epics. Then you get a piece of blue gear +1 ilevel above it and it's superior. That makes no sense. Every piece of gear now might as well be purple, or blue or green or grey. The item quality means nothing. It makes absolutely no difference. I do agree with you that the entitlement of players has lead to this travesty of gear. I guess I was one of the rare players who never looked at people with epics with envy or jealousy.

Dunno where you got that, I literally stated there is content for everyone out there depending on time available, skill etc. As far as item quality goes, it means jack shit, and has meant jack shit for quite a while now.

However its still kind of a progress way, 780 green > 820(830 if proc) blue > 840+ Epic. Also the color variants have changed in lettering, Normal > HC > Mythic, when you saw some one with an Epic in Vanila, is the same as you see someone with Mythic gear, actually you should be in even more awe if you see some one in full 880 Raid gear.

[Hotmail]

Dungeons lost a major slice of their identity when Blizzard introduced shared looted tables, which they did because the dungeons with all the good gear were being ran too much while the dungeons with all the meh gear were being largely ignored and we can't have that because Joe's art is just as special as Bob's art.

Blizzard has been unionized by artistic prima donnas GG

[Echocho]

Design one item for each spec with its two best secondary stats, that would leave you with 36 items per slot assuming no two specs share the same armor class and secondary stats and then distribute these items evenly among all the bosses.
And titanforging should really have a much lower cap than it does today. Maybe put it at the same iLvl as the current heroic raid.

[Deleted]

Do you honestly not remember when items you needed dropped 6 months after you started farming them?

Yeah, sure. Spellfire longsword. Flametalon of Alysrazor. White hawkstrider. Of course, if you mean actual battle gear, then no, I don't remember farming anything longer than a month or two tops. If you do, it's high time to move out of your parents' home.

For fuck sake stop crying like little babies and put in some effort

Exactly. Get a job. Get a life. And stop crying like a baby when mom doesn't want to buy you another month of game time.

when they are literally farm-able countless times if you choose to do so,

I don't choose to do so. Generally, people whose average day consists of less than 60% WoW shitfarming, don't choose to do so.

at least now you have that option unlike well any other expansion,

Indeed, unlike every other expansion, the key legendaries needed to be competitive are fully RNG so even if someone is so perfectly bereft of any life outside WoW as you claim to be, they might never see the desired drop.

its as if people just go brain neutral

Not people. Just you.

and forget how hard/rare an upgrade dropped previously (Not counting WoD cause trying to erase from memory)

Not nearly as retardedly hard as now. Especially back in MoP with actually useful rep vendor gear with rep easily farmable in short trash runs, TI drops fasttracking alts to raiding and actually useful crafts.

[thilicen]

Please don't go into game-development OP.

[Deleted]

I think the game you are looking for is Diablo

When the MMO that USED to reward any kind of time and effort put into it, is being compared to D3 you know you fucked up. D3 is the worst piece of shit when it comes to being rewarded for anything. As the loot system is entirely non-existent and PURELY RNG based.

This is not what an MMO should be. Get rid of this fucking D3 shit and bring back the MMO that was WoW where you could target shit and grind for it, giving you a sense of certainty and accomplishment when you eventually get there / what you wanted.

[Deleted]

When the MMO that USED to reward any kind of time and effort put into it, is being compared to D3 you know you fucked up. D3 is the worst piece of shit when it comes to being rewarded for anything. As the loot system is entirely non-existent and PURELY RNG based.

This is not what an MMO should be. Get rid of this fucking D3 shit and bring back the MMO that was WoW where you could target shit and grind for it, giving you a sense of certainty and accomplishment when you eventually get there / what you wanted.

Oh, you don't like D3? How quaint. Especially that it is an on-line optionally multiplayer game that rewards you for the time put in with incomparably less RNG than shit games like Legion. Especially with season sets and the simple fact those legendaries and sets just keep dropping and in reasonable time you can actually build a strong character. The error was importing some of D3 awesome ideas on crappy Legion ground.

[Makorus]

Some people actually like to feel some sort of accomplishment in the game, which Legion has stripped away. Not that I agree with much of anything in the OP, but the current system of loot in Legion is horrible.

How is limiting gear drops per boss an "accomplishment"? It's literally what people complain about: timegating. Artificially making content last longer by limiting your power gain through time-based stuff.

[PewPewArrowz]

Bla bla, tears, bla bla, more tears

All I see is QQ. I hear Hello Kitty Island Adventure got an upgrade, try it out. Also do you see me saying I have 2-3-4 legendaries? Hell I got one, granted its a BiS one, BUT I know people that have 4 who have done 10 times less content than myself, RNG is RNG. Now you even have benefits of trading an item to a party/raid member, but still RNG is RNG, and still people will cry about everything, even if Blizzard achieves perfect class balance, the perfect game in absolutely every aspect, people will still complain.

At this point I'm pretty sure if we achieve global peace, end starvation, crime, literally every world issue at the moment, upgrade humanity on every single level, people would still complain.

Also, let me get this straight a billion daily quests in 3-4-5 week period grinding rep for _ONE_ item instead of 10-20 M+ dungeons that rewards you gold, increased chance of legendary drops and possible gear, sounds legit. Go on youtube, check people's reactions on getting Legendaries, even the shit ones, that's pure excitement, only people crying about it are self entitled mommy's boys that had everything served to them on a silver platter.

[IntellectuallyChallenged]

My gear and my 856 item level are comparable to the content that I play regularly. I have no problem with that. I didn't put in the work for more, so I don't deserve more. That's how the real world works. There are millions, possibly billions, of people that would do well to learn the difference between reality and what modern society has become.

[Laqweeta]

I remember when wow used to feel rewarding. I remember running MT about 122 times (Got exalted on both reps lmaoo) and it finally dropped. Thank god that experience is coming back in a few weeks! C:

[PewPewArrowz]

My gear and my 856 item level are comparable to the content that I play regularly. I have no problem with that. I didn't put in the work for more, so I don't deserve more. That's how the real world works. There are millions, possibly billions, of people that would do well to learn the difference between reality and what modern society has become.

Holy fucking shit man, I bow to you, I would literally build you a statue with these words engraved on it if I actually could, hats off to you sir!

[Deleted]

Hey lookie lookie everyone! I can edit BBCode! I'm such a hacker and you all are such shit haha!

Yes, yes, you are, of course. Here, have some nice warm lollipop.

[Deleted]

My gear and my 856 item level are comparable to the content that I play regularly. I have no problem with that. I didn't put in the work for more, so I don't deserve more. That's how the real world works. There are millions, possibly billions, of people that would do well to learn the difference between reality and what modern society has become.

And some people would to well to remember that is not how either the real world or world of warcraft works right now.

The world does not give much about what you deserve, it depends on luck and connections. (and in the real word, the class you were born to)
You could work your ass off, but not get anywhere depending on where and when you were born.