Help with Restoration.

[Deleted]

Hello guys.

I'd like some input as to what my resto druid seems to be doing wrong. We're currently progressing on cenarius and the logs are as follows:
warcraftlogs.com/reports/9r71hQ6kGbaZLV4c#boss=1877&wipes=1&start=9313793&end=12066230

Karp is an off-spec healer, most of the fight he's dealing damage and comes into action on the 2nd wave. I'm talking mostly about vakama here.

Any help is appreciated, thanks a lot guys! <3

[healzforu]

well on just a quick look on that log, what stands out easily is his lifebloom, generally you want to keep lifebloom up as close to 100% as possible, he's sitting at 45%, which is killing his healing, another thing is his spec, not sure why he is using tree of life here..Cenarion ward and cultivation is superior on this fight, i personally ran inner vs germination, but i suppose germination is fine, i prefer the 2 min tranq's on this fight personally. Thats what i got with a quick glance, i did not look at every log, just the 1 you linked, but that's a quick view anyway.

[Alltat]

The core problem seems to be that he/she runs out of mana two minutes into the fight on almost every pull. Improved Lifebloom uptime would help a bit with this, as would making sure that all Clearcasting procs are actually used. But mainly, Regrowth use has to go down. If that means people die then so be it, because right now people are dying because all his mana was wasted on Regrowth spam. If you can't keep everyone up without Regrowth spam, you can't keep everyone up period. Swiftmend should be used more instead - it's a better spell in every way. Especially with the Prosperity talent, there's no excuse for having Swiftmend sit off cooldown for over a minute and casting Regrowths during that time.

Cooldown use could be better, especially early on. The artifact ability has a 90 second cooldown, but was almost never used in the first 90 seconds of the fight. On some 3+ minute attempts it wasn't used at all. Using it more would help with mana. Flourish use is much worse (13 casts in 35 attempts). It should be used more or less on cooldown on an AoE-heavy fight like Cenarius. Since Flourish is free, this should also help.

Efflorescence use is very low, considering the number of melee. Looking at the replay, you're not moving around much and he could easily have a mushroom down most of the time. If the mana cost is a concern then use it during Innervate.


Talent choices are questionable overall. Prosperity is underwhelming without Soul of the Forest. Incarnation is an odd choice on a fight that has fairly steady incoming damage (Cultivation should be more useful). Germination doesn't seem all that useful here; both other options in the tier should be more valuable. Finally, Flourish use is almost nonexistent, to the point where the talent point is basically wasted. There are no better options in the tier, however, and learning and remembering to use Flourish is just something that he'll have to work on.

[Deleted]

I'm taking another approach. I'm going to be quite harsh. At the moment this guy is dead weight. Looking through his logs in overall he seems to be stuck in WOD. He's runnning prosperity, incarnation and germination on almost every fight. He has performed below average on every fight over mutiple occasions (20 kills seen over 6 bosses) in mythic. The same goes for heroic. I would confront him and ask him if he's actually done any research regarding talent choices/cooldown usage or why he think his playstyle is the most optimal one (looking over his logs it clearly isn't the case but would love to hear his reasoning).

And just to comment on something that Alltat wrote. I looked at one Ursoc log. He has casted 33 regrowths, like holy shit. I put a lot of the blame in my previous section on Vakama himself. But I don't know how you coordinate cooldowns/other assigments in your guild. Or how the synergy within your healimg team is. But if your in a group with decent people you shouldn't have to cast 33 regrowths. Just so you get an idea. I killed Ursoc 4 times and casted 30 regrowths during those 4 kills.. He also only casted 1 tranq during this kill. It was a 4:10 kill and he didn't have Inner peace talented but still.

Your priest Tiksu on the other hand is doing great and your other healers around average Vakama is really underperforming.

[Deleted]

Agree with all the general criticism except if you're assigned to keep the tanks alive spamming a bunch of regrowths on Ursoc isn't bad at all.
Here I was a tank healer for instance: warcraftlogs.com/reports/LNAGjg6bBWdq3p1w#fight=7&type=healing&source=19
While here raidhealing: warcraftlogs.com/reports/jyn1xNXc6ZBqAmrL#fight=6&type=healing&source=15

You see that Vakama is doing most healing on tanks on their last Ursoc M. They had a holy pala so it doesn't make much sense but it's all up to how you divide roles.

[Alltat]

But if your in a group with decent people you shouldn't have to cast 33 regrowths.

Well, you do if you do. If you're constantly using GCDs to spot heal people who drop low, you're going to drop being on overall healing and need to do even more spot healing as people drop low from you failing to keep up. And then you run out of mana and can't do anything at all and the raid wipes. The only solution is to not be so spot heal happy, at least not when Swiftmend is on cooldown. Going for Cultivation would also help, as it's basically an extra smart heal. Cenarion Ward would also be useful if you need to stabilize people who drop low; it heals for more and costs less than Regrowth.

He also only casted 1 tranq during this kill. It was a 4:10 kill and he didn't have Inner peace talented but still.

That sounds like a failure of healing coordination. If he's casting at 04:10, he should also be casting early on to save everyone a bit of mana.

Agree with all the general criticism except if you're assigned to keep the tanks alive spamming a bunch of regrowths on Ursoc isn't bad at all.

Half the reason you had to cast so many Regrowths is because you forgot to cast Cenarion Ward, using it only once in five minutes. You also cast Regrowth when Swiftmend had recently come off cooldown almost every time. At one point you had three RG casts in a row while Swiftmend was available. Meanwhile, your co-healers aren't even keeping HoTs up on the tanks, which contributes to you having to do far more tank healing than is really necessary. So it's not really a log that shows what anyone should be doing.

[Deleted]

Well, you do if you do. If you're constantly using GCDs to spot heal people who drop low, you're going to drop being on overall healing and need to do even more spot healing as people drop low from you failing to keep up. And then you run out of mana and can't do anything at all and the raid wipes. The only solution is to not be so spot heal happy, at least not when Swiftmend is on cooldown. Going for Cultivation would also help, as it's basically an extra smart heal. Cenarion Ward would also be useful if you need to stabilize people who drop low; it heals for more and costs less than Regrowth.


That sounds like a failure of healing coordination. If he's casting at 04:10, he should also be casting early on to save everyone a bit of mana.



Half the reason you had to cast so many Regrowths is because you forgot to cast Cenarion Ward, using it only once in five minutes. You also cast Regrowth when Swiftmend had recently come off cooldown almost every time. At one point you had three RG casts in a row while Swiftmend was available. Meanwhile, your co-healers aren't even keeping HoTs up on the tanks, which contributes to you having to do far more tank healing than is really necessary. So it's not really a log that shows what anyone should be doing.

You're right on CW I just specced into CW/germ/Stonebark after tanks kept dying when I was focusing on raid and actually forgot to put it on my hotbar (must've used the keybind once without even realizing). But the only point I was trying to make was the regrowths, I would've cast many of them either way without getting into any mana problems.
Without sotf/prosp I like to save swiftmend for tricky moments or emergencies, when someone is low as a charge comes in or on a tank that drops a bit too much, or to have a good instant as i'm moving out of the miasma and rend is ticking etc. Seems safer than using it on cd for mana efficiency/output maximizing if there's no need to push that.

[st33l]

You're right on CW I just specced into CW/germ/Stonebark after tanks kept dying when I was focusing on raid and actually forgot to put it on my hotbar (must've used the keybind once without even realizing). But the only point I was trying to make was the regrowths, I would've cast many of them either way without getting into any mana problems.
Without sotf/prosp I like to save swiftmend for tricky moments or emergencies, when someone is low as a charge comes in or on a tank that drops a bit too much, or to have a good instant as i'm moving out of the miasma and rend is ticking etc. Seems safer than using it on cd for mana efficiency/output maximizing if there's no need to push that.

So a couple of points.
(a) You aren't a spot healer. You need to depend on other healers doing the spot healing. If you are going to use up your mana in spot healing, you will do overall less raid healing, forcing other healers to do more healing and them use up their mana. So, stick to your job and trust your other healers.

(looking only at Cenarius - your best attempt, 3m37s)

(b) If you're running out of mana, why the hell are you using Sunfire?
(c) You cast innervate and then didn't cast anything after that at all! WTF? You're supposed to use that time to get in a WG and spam as many rejuvs on the raid as you can. What the was the point of casting that innervate?
(d) You cast rejuv only on 5 targets? Then you cast it 41 times - were you overwriting your rejuvs? Also, why only on 5 targets total?

[Deleted]

So a couple of points.
(a) You aren't a spot healer. You need to depend on other healers doing the spot healing. If you are going to use up your mana in spot healing, you will do overall less raid healing, forcing other healers to do more healing and them use up their mana. So, stick to your job and trust your other healers.

(looking only at Cenarius - your best attempt, 3m37s)

(b) If you're running out of mana, why the hell are you using Sunfire?
(c) You cast innervate and then didn't cast anything after that at all! WTF? You're supposed to use that time to get in a WG and spam as many rejuvs on the raid as you can. What the was the point of casting that innervate?
(d) You cast rejuv only on 5 targets? Then you cast it 41 times - were you overwriting your rejuvs? Also, why only on 5 targets total?

You're not quoting OP there m8, and also you're looking at the wrong resto druid in OP's logs.

[Deleted]

Well, you do if you do. If you're constantly using GCDs to spot heal people who drop low, you're going to drop being on overall healing and need to do even more spot healing as people drop low from you failing to keep up. And then you run out of mana and can't do anything at all and the raid wipes. The only solution is to not be so spot heal happy, at least not when Swiftmend is on cooldown. Going for Cultivation would also help, as it's basically an extra smart heal. Cenarion Ward would also be useful if you need to stabilize people who drop low; it heals for more and costs less than Regrowth.

I looked through 2 Ursoc kills. The majority of the regrowths are casted when the tanks are roughly around 50% hp. And the majority of the regrowths as pointed out before are casted on the tanks. This sounds to me, as you put it, a fail of healing coordination and/or lack of understanding of how the damage of the fight looks like. If the situation calls for a regrowth you should cast it but I think a simple rejuv (and also going cultivation) is enough. There is no need to cast a regrowth on someone that is at 25% hp and won't take any damage for another ~8 seconds.

It's the foundation that is wrong - this is what I'm trying to get through (shouldn't tunnelvision to much on the regrowth useage). If you're lucky you can go on forever playing at a suboptimal level - but there will probably be a time when you can't. Which would have been Cenarius in EN but having an average ilvl of 882.23 in the raid it probalbly won't happen until mythic Odyn.

They have killed Cenarius on mythic now and the spell distribution is looking much better. However he/she only used EoG/cultivation once during 4:05 minutes.

[Dayfer]

If restodruid is forced to hardspam RG tanks, your healer composition is wrong.

Ditch germination for raids (like, for real? this guy is raiding mythic 884 and doesn't even use proper build?).
The go-to build now is Cenarion>Cultivation>Spring Blossoms>Flourish. May tech in Inner peace on certain fights like Ursoc, but all the raid cd's should be assigned.

Lifebloom won't ever top the healing meters but it also gives free regrowths, so consider watching that more.
Efflorescence should always be up under the main group (replace it when raid is switching to adds or moves etc). On 3+ min Cenarius try he didn't even cast it ONCE. What?
Flourish+Artifact usage. Again, just 1 cast of Essence on 3+ min progression fight? No flourish at all?

Feels like he's just overwhelmed with all of the class mechanics, movement and watching raidframes at the same time. I recommend using weakauras to track Lifebloom and Efflorescence by adding decaying bars with timers under the character (or wherever it feels natural for him).
So, basically: 1) Spec properly. 2) Use all the druid kit including Eff, Flourish and Essence. 3) Keep your eye on cooldowns and keep them rolling.