Pitt Bulls Violent by Genetics or by Upbringing?

[Allybeboba]

Pitbulls. like many dogs, have a predisposition to protect their owners and property. Unlike many dogs they have the strength to back up their bark with their bite.

Some municipalities have laws against them. In some places you have to have insurance to own them. Now, what those places should have done is instituted laws for people that owned a canine weighing a certain amount as ANY large dog can kill.

[Darsithis]

You don't have the data to make this claim.

Trends do not support your assertion. They don't point to genetic causation either. We don't have enough information to draw these kinds of conclusions. However, we have pretty good information concerning the relative incidence of pit bull attacks, which suggests that this should be a regulated breed. Whether or not this is an owner-specific problem, it's still a problem - the fact that they CAN kill more effectively than other dog breeds, the fact that they DO kill much more often than other dog breeds, and the fact that they are viewed as soft-hearted loveable companions by more people than not, are reasons enough to at least promote an information campaign.

I do have the data to make the claim. There are no studies that prove that pit breeds are genetically violent. In the absence of a genetic reason it comes down a few possibilities: the dog was raised to fight/guard, the dog was abused, or the people involved in the incident failed to recognize what the dog was "saying" when they engaged in interaction with it.

[Zelorra]

Your anecdotal evidence is not sufficient to declare something to be a biological fact.

You and the other pitbull advocates seem to avoid the actual REAL statistics. Check that up, before talking about "anecdotical evidence". These dogs were not banned because there is a conspiracy against them, but because they present a clear danger. It's easy to say "if properly trained", but the vast majority of dog owners are not Cesar the fucking whisperers, and they have not idea how to properly train a dog. Also, if genetics is not a factor, why do they need "proper training" to not fuck everyone up around?

I also encountered only pitbulls that din't bite anyone, but that doesn't mean that looking at the statistics these dogs are fucked up. Even if it's the owners fault to not control them properly, it's their genetics that need controlling.

[Gib Lover]

There's a reason why they are labeled as "guard dogs", they aren't supposed to be pet by anyone, even if they look super cute

I wanted to get a chow chow until I did some reading. Now I just watch them puppies on Instagram )

My grandparents had a chow-something mix that looked exactly like a chow but with none of the temperament issues, I need to get ahold of them and ask what else she was because I'd love a dog just like her.

[Kathandira]

I personally think that pitt bulls simply have violent genetics in them due to selective breeding, and no amount of care and proper upbringing is going to change genetics no matter how much people want it to.

A little of column A, and a little of column B.

When a breed is made to perform a specific task for long enough, it becomes part of their heritage. But not all of them will act on any hereditary aggression. Not all of the breeds blood line has been used for aggressive means. It had only been in the past few decades that Pitbulls were used for fighting and such. They used to be better known as the American Staffordshire, which was considered the typical american family dog for a long time.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Amer...ih=564#imgrc=_

Most breeds are genetically modified to fit certain roles. Now, I don't mean in a laboratory, but through selective breeding. Fortunately, the pitbull has only been breed for aggression recently (in the grand scheme of things) and the damage can be undone by ceasing the use of this breed as a fighter or aggressive dog. It would take a while to "breed it out" but it can be done, and certainly should be done.

[nanook12]

So much BS anecdotal evidence in this thread. My brother <insert why pittbulls are nice here> my friend and his family <insert why pittbulls are nice here>. Here are the statistics. [url]http://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statistics-fatalities-2015.php

[sarahtasher]

I would dare to say that if you buy a pitbull to ''defend yourself'' or because you live in a rough neighborhood, you are the kind of person that would likely get bitten by Lassie.

[Kathandira]

My brothers pitbull we had to put down last week (old age, back legs gave out and he just couldn't even poo by himself anymore) was fantastic with his 3 small children. He never even so much as growled at them even if they got a little rough playing with him. The most threatening thing about him was his farts.

He was a great guard dog. He would naturally patrol the perimeter of any house he stayed at without even being taught just came naturally.

LOL! Pitbulls certainly are known for incredibly offensive flatulence.

[unbound]

I personally think that pitt bulls simply have violent genetics in them due to selective breeding, and no amount of care and proper upbringing is going to change genetics no matter how much people want it to.

So, let's look at some facts around the matter, shall we?

First of all, what is a Pit Bull? It isn't actually a breed (https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...00b_story.html)...

But experts say most dogs commonly referred to as a pit bull are either a mix of other breeds or are pure-bred of a breed often misidentified as a pit bull.

So, that kind of throws out the whole selective breeding as the issue.

How about upbringing? Well, we can look at the scary statistics for those that are "identified" as pit bulls. We find that 82% of deaths caused by dogs are due to "pit bulls". OMG! Panic!

But, wait, there were 34 deaths in 2015, 28 of which were identified as being done by Pit Bulls. But, according to the loose definition of pit bulls, there are about 5 million of them in the US today.

That means that 0.00056% of "pit bulls" caused a death last year. How is 0.00056% a problem with the breed or the upbringing of the animals? Obviously, it isn't a problem. Heck, you literally have much, much better odds of dying in a car crash.

This is nothing more than fear-mongering BS. The same fear-mongering BS that was put out about Doberman Pinschers in the 70s, and German Shepherds in the 80s, and Rottweilers in the 90s.

[Kathandira]

Oh god this again. While Pits may not be the most aggressive dog(the Pomerian I think has that distinction), it is however the most dangerous. When I see parents who take pictures of their toddler laying beside a Pit, I cringe so hard. If that toddler pushes the Pit Bull with its arm for example the Pit could turn around and rip it's face off. A pomerian or Chihuahua however could cause harm but not likely kill the kid.

The whole debate on pits only being bad if the owner is bad is bullshit too. There are so many sources out there to disprove that. From Pits being raised around loving families who one day decide to use its lockjaw to attempt to rip an arm off etc. In the end it's not them being super aggressive. It's just the power they have. I think there are legit Pit Bull owners who can keep them and do great with them. But any of them with a family that has kids? That's putting a loaded gun on the kitchen table. Not worth the risk.

Edit: Please don't post your anecdotal evidence. I'm sure you all have amazing friends or families with Pits who do great around kids. That's great, and it doesn't mean anything.

I would research the bolded. Pitbulls cannot lock their jaw. They have very strong muscles, but there is no locking.

- - - Updated - - -

Pit bulls are more aggressive by nature because of selective breeding. That does not mean that Pit bulls can't be as calm and cuddly as other dogs, it just means that they need training and discipline.

This guy gets it!

[Underverse]

I do have the data to make the claim. There are no studies that prove that pit breeds are genetically violent. In the absence of a genetic reason it comes down a few possibilities: the dog was raised to fight/guard, the dog was abused, or the people involved in the incident failed to recognize what the dog was "saying" when they engaged in interaction with it.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. It's not easy to prove a genetic link to behavior in an organism that isn't really studied at all by biologists. If you have a study that published a negative result, then you would have a stronger case. I haven't seen such a study.

[Kathandira]

Considering how many pits are put down I'd argue that it's hard for them to pass on any bred violent nature.

Unfortunately, the ones which are breeded (basically as brood mothers) are ex fighting dogs. They want to ensure the puppies have the aggressive genes the parents had so they can sell the puppies as potential fighting dogs. So sadly, it is quite the opposite to what you are saying. The selective breeding is in favor of aggression, and needs to be stopped.

[Darsey]

#Threads_that_the_only_comment_in_them_should_be_no

[RuneDK]

I personally think that pitt bulls simply have violent genetics in them due to selective breeding, and no amount of care and proper upbringing is going to change genetics no matter how much people want it to.

And you obviously know nothing about dogs. Pit bulls are first off not a breed, it's a generalization of four different breeds. One of which has pit bull in the name. With that said, they are terriers, and terriers are known to be nursery dogs. The issue is not the dog, but the owners. My parents have a silver lab(technically chocolate lab) who's vicious towards new people. Simply because they don't know how to handle a dog. Do yourself a favor and stay out of pet services as a career.

[Gib Lover]

I would dare to say that if you buy a pitbull to ''defend yourself'' or because you live in a rough neighborhood, you are the kind of person that would likely get bitten by Lassie.

What does a collie have to do with anything

[Zelorra]

I would research the bolded. Pitbulls cannot lock their jaw. They have very strong muscles, but there is no locking.

Indeed that's a myth. I wonder if the origin it Jack London's White Fang novel...

[Alvito]

How many pit bulls have you personally owned?

None. I have also never owned a cobra, but I know they are too dangerous for the average person to own.

[Kathandira]

So much BS anecdotal evidence in this thread. My brother <insert why pittbulls are nice here> my friend and his family <insert why pittbulls are nice here>. Here are the statistics. [url]http://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statistics-fatalities-2015.php

Here are some more facts.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_breeding

Things can be changed. I'd be more inclined to correct the breed, than to watch it become extinct because people fear it.

[ParanoiD84]

Pitbulls/amstaff are a amazing breed and great family dogs if raised properly. It's gangsters and criminals giving it a bad rep they can't raise them for shit and only own them as a trophy for respect.

[Kathandira]

Indeed that's a myth. I wonder if the origin it Jack London's White Fang novel...

#throwback

I remember reading that in like 7th grade, lol.