NH released and new hotfix live, anyone feel stronger?

[TonyGuinzo]

Been sitting here waiting for hotfix patch notes and I remembered that in their blue post they mentioned that the new buffs would go live with reset, so I guess no notes? How do you guys feel? I know 8% for MM isn't much, but I want to know. BM? Do you guys see considerable damage with the CS buff or 10% to KC?

[Dobby3939]

To be honest you'll have to wait until tomorrow to get a 24 hour look at all the logs. That should provide a pretty good idea of what the hotfix did and what talents are being used most effectively on the various encounters. Personally, I've noticed a small increase obviously, but again, the biggest issues relating to the mechanics are still glaringly obvious...

[cLax0n]

Basically the buffs to all three specs increased damage by about 8% across all specs believe it or not. With the nerfs to other specs that were outperforming, we should see ourselves relatively closer. I cannot look at the warcraftlogs and determine how the change has affected the performance because like someone said before, a full 24hours has to pass. But the simcraft (take these lightly) have been updated to reflect the change, and it is showing MM in a favorable position.

[Khrux]

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T19M.html

Take from that what you want.

I don't personally understand how they can buff Marks and BM the same amount yet Sims have marks in top 5 and BM bottom 3, when both were bottom 3 to begin with...

I also don't see how assassination can be bottom 3, something is very wrong.

[construkt]

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T19M.html

Take from that what you want.

I don't personally understand how they can buff Marks and BM the same amount yet Sims have marks in top 5 and BM bottom 3, when both were bottom 3 to begin with...

I also don't see how assassination can be bottom 3, something is very wrong.

Did you look at the talents? Some of them are retarded. Like Spriest being simmed with shadow crash rather than LotV.

[Mavick]

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T19M.html

Take from that what you want.

I don't personally understand how they can buff Marks and BM the same amount yet Sims have marks in top 5 and BM bottom 3, when both were bottom 3 to begin with...

I also don't see how assassination can be bottom 3, something is very wrong.

These lists are always absurdly inaccurate in places, I really wish people would stop linking them. This is not me saying BM might not be that low, but just because that list says so doesn't make it so.

[Deleted]

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T19M.html

Take from that what you want.

I don't personally understand how they can buff Marks and BM the same amount yet Sims have marks in top 5 and BM bottom 3, when both were bottom 3 to begin with...

I also don't see how assassination can be bottom 3, something is very wrong.

is there aboss where you can stay all the combat and just dps? no, then this is not reliable

[construkt]

is there aboss where you can stay all the combat and just dps? no, then this is not reliable

it gives you a solid idea of what your single target damage is and if you have abilities that can cleave without costing you damage on your single target, then you can extrapolate from there.

So as long as the gearing, rotations, and talents are set up right for the profile, simcraft results are very reliable.

Like you see Marksman damage up high, but you have to deduct for any target switching or movement, while other classes aren't penalized so highly. So yeah the MM ranking is in a bubble in which you will definitely need to reduce around 20% from for a real situation (so long as there is no trick shot cleave). While shadow priests are artificially low because they're being simmed with shadow crash which is a terrible single target talent. So long as you know the class, these sims are very useful.

[Tehterokkar]

http://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/Raid_T19M.html

Take from that what you want.

I don't personally understand how they can buff Marks and BM the same amount yet Sims have marks in top 5 and BM bottom 3, when both were bottom 3 to begin with...

I also don't see how assassination can be bottom 3, something is very wrong.

The Marksman APL is doing some inhumane things though. It plays like a robot, and does things a regular human cannot do when it comes to Aimed shot timings.

In reality it's impossible to do this kind of damage ST.

Edit: correction: It's not possible to do that kind of ST damage under normalized RNG. High RNG variance still plagues this spec, which makes it even more annoying to play.

[Deleted]

it gives you a solid idea of what your single target damage is and if you have abilities that can cleave without costing you damage on your single target, then you can extrapolate from there.

So as long as the gearing, rotations, and talents are set up right for the profile, simcraft results are very reliable.

Like you see Marksman damage up high, but you have to deduct for any target switching or movement, while other classes aren't penalized so highly. So yeah the MM ranking is in a bubble in which you will definitely need to reduce around 20% from for a real situation (so long as there is no trick shot cleave). While shadow priests are artificially low because they're being simmed with shadow crash which is a terrible single target talent. So long as you know the class, these sims are very useful.

each class is different, if you have to move during the last aimed as hunter mm you are going to lose all your damage in a vulnerable cycle, any other class has to deal with this, when we change target we lose 10 stacks from true aim.... so yes, hunter mm dps on dummy is really high, but this is not reliable for raid because in raid due to movement mechanics we lose too much dmg, much more than any other class because of our mechanic

[Dracodraco]

MM still uses Aran's trinket in the sims. It's clearly not a good indicator of anything.

[Slicer299]

Did you look at the talents? Some of them are retarded. Like Spriest being simmed with shadow crash rather than LotV.

And the gear difference between MM and BM is significant. MM weapon ilvl is 918m vs 903 for BM. Weapon DPS matters a whole hell of a lot more for MM, and they give MM a significant edge by giving it a weapon 15 item levels higher.

[Arrol]

The Marksman APL is doing some inhumane things though. It plays like a robot, and does things a regular human cannot do when it comes to Aimed shot timings.

In reality it's impossible to do this kind of damage ST.

Edit: correction: It's not possible to do that kind of ST damage under normalized RNG. High RNG variance still plagues this spec, which makes it even more annoying to play.

You're talking out of your ass, the MM APL can be done by a human, and simcraft uses huge amounts of iterations to account for RNG

[Araya]

Not going to say using Big Game Hunter was the deciding factor on why BM was simmed so low in that report, but it was probably a good factor in it.

[Feyranna]

The bm one still needs a lot of work. I wish I was good enough at those sort of things to help them because I know they could use a BM main helping out
Not sure if it still is but last I heard it wasn't even calculating Titan's Thunder damage correctly so I'm not going to worry too much on sims.
Plus there is just the fact that BM is going to look lower on a patchwerk sim, we'll probably always get tuned lower to account for 0 movement penalty. As long as that's happening in an environment where we actually excel in movement fights that's fine with me, when it wasn't (EN) then it's a problem.

[Khrux]

Simcraft puts BM @ 408k, using BGH and having variable ilvl on gear, ranging from 880 to 895 and Titanstrike at 903.
Effinhunter's Sims puts BM @ 491k, using Dire Stable and having a static 885 across all gear slots and Titanstrike at 915.

For Marks, you can also see Simcraft is still using Aran's(@860) plus their weapon is 918 and gear slots range from 870 to 885.

There is so much inconsistency between the gear, talents and relic quality used across all classes(not just Hunter) that the simcraft charts appear entirely worthless.

[Kayagurcu]

I am not good at maths, all i know last night i was watching Cdew twitch stream and Idareu was always in top3 as BM close to 500k dps. MM hunters were in the middle of the pack.

[Angrox]

I pretty much cheesed my way to top of meters on 7/8 fights of our normal clear, the exception being a ST fight.
thanks for buffing our Aoe blizz, pretty good/fun for prog. Shame people think it's the end of the world that they tuned our spec for NH, thinking it'll not be viable for a previous raid (EN).

[Banard]

Been sitting here waiting for hotfix patch notes and I remembered that in their blue post they mentioned that the new buffs would go live with reset, so I guess no notes? How do you guys feel? I know 8% for MM isn't much, but I want to know. BM? Do you guys see considerable damage with the CS buff or 10% to KC?

In my little sandbox as BM i felt i am back up to where i was before 7.1.5 compared to every one else. Looking at the logs from last night....it seems we are still falling behind on average.

[Deleted]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/11#sample=1

this isnt meaningful, but take a look at it

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...=1&dataset=100