Trump Pulls The US out of TPP. Hurray!!!

[THE Bigzoman]

Think again. There is already talk in my country to just do the same thing but exclude the US. The next President won't have anyone that will even want to trade with the US.

Nobody will want to trade with the words largest economy? Holy shit, liked pretty hard there.

[Fugus]

I mean it's all right here. The TPP is not as scary as people have been led to believe.

If that is what they were actually going to do and my translation of legalese to English is accurate enough. That part honestly doesn't seem too bad.

Then it comes down the trade deal itself which from what I have read was virtually neutral on GDP and only projected a 0.5% increase and mainly just shuffled between sectors.

Sorry about the long delay, kinda splitting my attention and that was a bit of a read trying to make sure to understand it all and now about to log for now. Later man.

[Barnabas]

You anti-globalization guys don't get it, the way to fight globalization is to embrace it. If people in China and Vietnam are making good wages American companies won't move their factories there. It costs a lot of money to ship from China to the US, so if companies are having to pay high wages in China, the math could work out to move the factory back to the US.

TPP was going to raise wages world wide and jobs would move back to the US.

China has legislation to create a middle economy already. Just force them to sign it and we won't need shitty agreements that just put that off longer.

[Rooflesstoofless]

No sweat. The legal glossary is at the top of each chapter, if you have specific terms you're not sure about. Not saying they'll be covered, but it covers most of the specific terms that are repeated.

Anyway, the TPP isn't some super slam dunk, but it is a net positive and is an important part of strengthening ties with nations and further entrenching our influence. It will help force a more even playing field in a lot of respects, which is one of the ways to decrease job loss to the rest of the world. If people are really worried about workers, I think killing the TPP shouldn't even be on the agenda. We should be looking for ways to move our ex-manufacturers into other lines of work.

"The Trans-Pacific Partnership is a disastrous trade agreement designed to protect the interests of the largest
multi-national corporations at the expense of workers, consumers, the environment and the foundations of
American democracy. It will also negatively impact some of the poorest people in the world.

The TPP is a treaty that has been written behind closed doors by the corporate world. Incredibly, while Wall
Street, the pharmaceutical industry and major media companies have full knowledge as to what is in this treaty,
the American people and members of Congress do not. They have been locked out of the process."
-Bernie Sanders

[Mehrunes]

Yeah, I mean we had something like 30 threads on it here. But I guess since the media wasn't covering it, those don't constitute a chance to discuss and debate it.

Technically speaking, the negotiations were mostly secret. Any threads prior to negotiations being finished were about leaks. And sure, you can still have a debate about it after that, but the only real options left to debate are "ratify it" and "don't ratify it", which isn't as meaningful as suggesting legislative changes during the negotiations.

[Alcsaar]

Globalization will happen with or without the US. If we're sitting at the table at least we can use our considerable weight to make the market more favorable to us.

Isolationism is a dumb policy.

You say this with the assumption that the weight of the US is being put towards the betterment of the average American citizen - but its not. It was being used to support lobbyists and corporations.

There are better ways to enter a globalized market than by constructing a trade agreement which contains very negative impacts on the average person.

[Unholyground]

3D printers will replace every kind of human based factory production within the next 20 years anyways, it will just suck even more until then now.

[paralleluniverse]

Looks like his first day is already productive. Trump has signed an executive order withdrawing the US from TPP. Couldnt have a better start to his new job!

http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/23/politi...y-sources-say/

Fake policy.

The US was never in the TPP.

Congrats for being a dupe.

[paralleluniverse]

The TPP was slated to create jobs, reduce the cost of goods, and help strengthen American influence in the Pacific, but yeah, why would anyone want that?

The TPP was slated to create jobs in the US that amount to less than a rounding error.

The benefits of the TPP mainly flowed to big US corporations, who Trump will reward anyway with massive tax cuts for them, and poor countries like Vietnam.

[Mehrunes]

The US won 100% of all ISDS cases. I dont think its bad for us.

While not an ISDS case, Tuna-Dolphin GATT case had similar mechanics and principles. US lost it. Because trade > environment. Then again that's WTO for you.

To my knowledge that is something currently undetermined. The agreement is still in talks. Only the necessity of an ISDS for the member nations is being debated as of yet, but I would be interested in a source if otherwise. :-)

TPP is waiting for ratification right now. The talks have ended over a year ago.

[Barnabas]

Did you listen to any speeches at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland last week? I recommend you read/listen to Xi Jinping's speech. Here's a link to it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOrQOyAPUi4.

Of course I also recommend Christine Lagarde's.

Edit: Whoops, broken link.

Well of course he would try to act all liberal now that he's seen that protectionism hurts his country. I don't need a 24 minute speech to know that. China has an unnatural economy and china needs to move forward with the steps they have in place to have a natural economy. So he either needs to move forward or face more tariffs.

[Mehrunes]

Here's a breakdown (let me know if it needs further simplification); The left isn't opposed to free trade, they'd just prefer that standards were raised rather than relaxed and are wary of increasing privitization of public services. Here's an article that might help.

Technically, a different treaty. Thought there's some major overlap between the two, with TTP having some additional "bonuses" like US forcing its IP laws on all other parties to it.

[NED funded]

While not an ISDS case, Tuna-Dolphin GATT case had similar mechanics and principles. US lost it. Because trade > environment. Then again that's WTO for you.




TPP is waiting for ratification right now. The talks have ended over a year ago.

The WTO ruled in favor of China, when we started to oppose their dumping of steel. I hardly have any respect towards WTO and since the TPP imposes somewhat American standards I doubt this will be an issue.

[NED funded]

Did you listen to any speeches at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland last week? I recommend you read/listen to Xi Jinping's speech. Here's a link to it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOrQOyAPUi4.

Of course I also recommend Christine Lagarde's.

Edit: Whoops, broken link.

He. Fun stuff,although China is trying to liberalize its economy, its also trying to curb capital outflows with the toughest regulations in the world. I dont think China can move the international economy forward, that seems like posturing.

- - - Updated - - -

The TPP was slated to create jobs in the US that amount to less than a rounding error.

The benefits of the TPP mainly flowed to big US corporations, who Trump will reward anyway with massive tax cuts for them, and poor countries like Vietnam.

The TPP is meant to protect American jobs by enforcing IP laws in country that have barely functional IP laws and prevent another "China shock". Wheather you like it, America is moving forward to more abstract work centric economy.

[Barnabas]

TPP is not an overtly protectionist deal, so I'm confused about your intended motivation in crafting that first sentence.

China basically volunteered to replace America as a world leader in advancing the global economy to the next phase of internationalism.. I'm unconvinced you watched the video.

Of course you are confused because you seem to wrap your sense of knowledge about the global economy around wef propaganda videos. China is guilty of everything he discussed. So I don't understand what his real message is? Is china going to be a good boy now? Or is it all smoke with a sense of hope? So business as usual continues as long as a few nutters seem excited at the prospect of China being some type of leader because xi ping spouts some liberal agenda? China had tariffs put on their steel pipe under obama and they felt the brunt of it. No I didn't watch the video. I read the speech.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2017/...economic-forum

[May90]

He-he, the purpose of Trump's actions is exactly to give more power to the internal corporations and guarantee less international control over them - so his own business can thrive without being challenged from overseas. You really think he knows so little about the economy to take the usual "globalism is baaaaaad" scare seriously? He's playing his voters like fools, they've given him everything he's ever desired, so now he will use it to his advantage.

Well played, Donald, well played!

[Aeriedk]

Looks like his first day is already productive. Trump has signed an executive order withdrawing the US from TPP. Couldnt have a better start to his new job!

http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/23/politi...y-sources-say/

Besides other points already made, but it was never ratified by congress. Trump did nothing.

[Mafic]

The worst part of the TPP was that disputes with pricing controls by governments on medicine could be taken to arbitration. No wonder Big pharma was in favor of TPP.

Imagine if a third party told Canada that their pricing controls on medicine should cease? That is a major violation of sovereignty of a nation and why Trump is in favor of pricing controls on medicine in the U.S. aka copying Canada's common sense approach.

[Orlong]

Weird, it keeps wanting to boot me and make me relog about every 5 minutes even if I am actively using it. I can type a response hit send, have it go through and then click to the main menu and it log me out within that 20 second window at times.

Can log back in just fine, but still keeps booting me.

Are you using a VPN? A lot of free ones cause this with websites along with having to do a captcha every so often

[Snes]

The TPP was slated to create jobs, reduce the cost of goods, and help strengthen American influence in the Pacific, but yeah, why would anyone want that?

But when Harper signs the TPP he's the bad guy...