Titanforging Really Makes Going to Older Raids and Dungeons Worth Continuing

[Niwes]

its definetelly a good thing to keep old content somewhat useful. they way they do it in Legion is ... not... useful. its fukin crap shit.

what i never will get is this: since WoD they have auto generated loot lists. they could scale gear ilvl of drop gear by 1 knob. why they implement fukin RNG stuff when they could just scale old content a little bit up to fill gaps in gear of new content ?

i.e. a while (maybe 3-4 weeks) after new content (nighthold, at the moment) is out, scale old heroic EN gear up to same or 5 ilvls above NH nhc gear. this could also lead to a world where some nhc only guilds do a little bit heroic stuff with a little bit outgearing. full hc guilds will not go back to EN that much. but for some specific slots to fill up and for something todo after id is done, it would be perfect. same goes for XR mythic content. some hc only guilds would love to play EN a little bit in mythic, after its XR, but they never do, bc gear is shit, compared with actual content.

i dont get why blizzard didnt tried this way, instead that horrible RNG nonsense.

[Deleted]

WoD: There's not enough content...QQ
Legion: There's too much content...QQ

There is still not enough content, but now what little we have is run repeatedly ad nauseum so you get sick of it even faster.

Running endless mythics for that 0.00001% legendary or titanforged does not mean there is more dungeon content, we have about as many new dungeons as we had in WoD. As for raids, Nighthold was delayed even more than Blackrock Furnace was. Technically Legion so far has about as many boss/month releases as WoD.
I know they said that we will have an actual third raiding tier since WoD had only two and Argus, but who knows how much will they delay it.

Oh, but what about open world content? No. World quests are literally copy paste of leveling quests. Daily quests are the shittiest form of non-content in MMORPGs and whoever came up with it should be brought to court and legally forbidden from ever designing video games again.

So far we do NOT have more content at all, you're just forced to repeat the same content more times.

[Matthias]

There is still not enough content, but now what little we have is run repeatedly ad nauseum so you get sick of it even faster.

Running endless mythics for that 0.00001% legendary or titanforged does not mean there is more dungeon content, we have about as many new dungeons as we had in WoD. As for raids, Nighthold was delayed even more than Blackrock Furnace was. Technically Legion so far has about as many boss/month releases as WoD.
I know they said that we will have an actual third raiding tier since WoD had only two and Argus, but who knows how much will they delay it.

Oh, but what about open world content? No. World quests are literally copy paste of leveling quests. Daily quests are the shittiest form of non-content in MMORPGs and whoever came up with it should be brought to court and legally forbidden from ever designing video games again.

So far we do NOT have more content at all, you're just forced to repeat the same content more times.

I'm confused....WoW at end game has always been repetetive.

What we have now is your just not able to reach a point where your BiS and just wait for the next tier or expansion. Once again you don't have to grind the old content. I did Heroic EN for like the first time in months. Simply because it was something to do, I had a shot at legendaries or a high roll trinket, and AP. Or I could have opted to do something else or nothing.

[harruin]

I like the loot system for Legion, but blizzard should have done more item quality control on it than they did for the legendaries. For example, Sephuz's Secret should have been removed when they decided they didn't want trinket/item effects to work in PVP.

[Manabomb]

I'd personally like a titan forge system that involves also being able to upgrade to a certain level. A bastard child of obliterium, valor point upgrades and titanforging. It's RNG if it titanforges, but you use X-universal currency (currency that can be gained through multiple forms of content, EG artifact power but not) to upgrade to titanforge cap. Thus keeps the rng element, but no longer punishing you not getting rng.

I guess there's a grind involved, but I'd rather have an assured grind at the chance at RNG than just continuous, back to back RNG.

[ComputerNerd]

And somewhere in all that, "quality" matters as well...you know?

Quality by what arbitrary standards.
It sucks if it is not what this player wants, but if they get what they want it will "suck" for someone else.

Well you know, maybe there could have been a middle ground to these two extremes?

The problem is any "middle ground" is going to not be what someone else wants.
Blizzard can't satisfy everyone.

Players complain about lack of content, which actually equals lack of relevance to most content.
This adds relevance in a different way to just a generic badge currency.
But because the content can potentially offer something, players complain that they are "forced" to do it.
No, if it only forced when it is a blizzard-dictated requirement for entry into something.

I'd personally like a titan forge system that involves also being able to upgrade to a certain level. A bastard child of obliterium, valor point upgrades and titanforging. It's RNG if it titanforges, but you use X-universal currency (currency that can be gained through multiple forms of content, EG artifact power but not) to upgrade to titanforge cap. Thus keeps the rng element, but no longer punishing you not getting rng.

I guess there's a grind involved, but I'd rather have an assured grind at the chance at RNG than just continuous, back to back RNG.

The problem then is we end up with a repetition of this "number of run" of Maw of Souls, where something simply becomes a grind of the most efficient route.
Unless you are seeking something very specific, there is reason to run a variety.
When there is a generic reward, there isn't.

[styil]

But that's always going to be the case for those who play a lot, right? Legion has demonstrably more content than WoD ever did, but unless Blizz releases a new expansion every WEEK, there will always be repetition for those who want to play for hours every day.

The repitition in Legion is leaps and bounds beyond the repitition in WoD.

[Anastacy]

Quality by what arbitrary standards.
It sucks if it is not what this player wants, but if they get what they want it will "suck" for someone else.

Which is why some people complain, and some people don't.

Are you new to this (life, that is), or something?

[nekobaka]

The rate of which I have ever gotten a potential upgrade from the system has not made me do something I wouldnt have already done. VP was far more of an effective method of getting me to do such. As someone who has never obtained full BS including prior to the system the whole thing is just an added bonus that should not be counted on. I am more likely to get a need upgrade from mythic+ weekly. That said screw not being able to pass off an ilvl upgrade to a friend who could need or better use the item more.

Overall I prefer the more consistent system we had before. Slightly biased as I tend to be on the shit side of RNG. When I was still raiding trying to get 4 piece tier was excruciating. Even Cata with three tier pieces on vendor I was able to get together a 4 piece. Glad I dont need it for mythic+.

[Keashaa]

While the RNG nature of loot this expansion can be frustrating, I have to say I'm never running out of things to do. After Clearing Heroic NH I can do Normal NH for a chance at Titanforge tier, Legendaries and AP. Trinkets in Emerald Nightmare will be BiS if they roll up high enough. It's even worth it for me to do Karazhan for a shot at a high rolled Ring of Collapsing Future.

Just on one character I'm likely never to get all of that done along with my 15 just on my main toon and have little to no time for PvP, Best part is since your relying on a piece dropping and then that same piece rolling high you don't feel compelled to go, but it's certainly something do to instead of just sitting in your order hall.

Legion has a really bad gearing system. Because you NEVER run out of things to do. Everytime someone talks about vanilla the haters complain about the time commitment of classic. Now we have an even worse system and everyone's cheering? So stupid!
I want to raid and of course I have to farm mats and so on. But being forced to farm 4-5 hours / day to maximize my weapon fast? No way!

[Leih]

Yeah I'm sorry but it feels like people who hate on Titanforging are just like "There's too much to do now! I want a period with no content so I can do something else than WoW for a while." That's all well and good, but I bet many of those people are the same people who said WoD was shit because there was "nothing to do."

Which is it?

It's not possible for Blizzard to infinitely generate new content for you to run every single damn week. There's never going to be a new high quality dungeon for you to try every reset. So there's two choices, either they make the content potentially rewarding to complete repeatedly or you get done with it and have to face a wait for the next new thing.

Personally I really appreciate Titanforging. The legendary system needs to see improvements but Titanforging is a really smart idea. It's so great that I can sometimes do lower ilvl content when I'm helping friends or just bored and get a small chance of something nice for it. The chance is low enough that it's NOT worth me sitting there farming the low level shit myself, but when I am doing it anyway on a rare occasion I know I might actually proc something good.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

The repitition in Legion is leaps and bounds beyond the repitition in WoD.

I have to disagree. Endgame outdoor content? One zone (Tanaan) vs. five zones. Dungeons? Seven vs. Eleven. Raids? Three over two years vs. three over six months with at least two more in the works.

Maybe you are playing more and repeating more, but it's not because the options for variety aren't there. If you choose to spam MoS over and over, that's your fault not Blizz's.

[Leih]

The rate of which I have ever gotten a potential upgrade from the system has not made me do something I wouldnt have already done.

That's kind of the point, though. It's not meant to make you feel forced to run low ilvl content over and over again forever (like some others in this thread claim it "forces" you to do) but rather it just gives you a little bit of potential for something cool to drop for you when you happen to be running lower ilvl content (to help a friend or do a daily heroic or because it's an emissary world quest or whatever reason).

[lordzed83]

Like gearing system hate legendary system....

[munkeyinorbit]

Endless things you feel obligated to do that are incredibly repetitive and dull my favourite.

This expansion has the worst gearing system ever designed.

I can't believe they're doubling down on it in 7.2. A thousand more maw of souls 9's...

LoL. Stop pretending that you even need to do it. You would get better results if you just learnt to play your characters properly instead of whining about having to grind to get gear to get good.

[munkeyinorbit]

Legion has a really bad gearing system. Because you NEVER run out of things to do. Everytime someone talks about vanilla the haters complain about the time commitment of classic. Now we have an even worse system and everyone's cheering? So stupid!
I want to raid and of course I have to farm mats and so on. But being forced to farm 4-5 hours / day to maximize my weapon fast? No way!

Anyone who is feeling "forced" is probably terrible at the game. Lol. Get better at the game instead of coming to unofficial forums to complain about having to play the game to get gear to be good.

[Deleted]

Anyone who is feeling "forced" is probably terrible at the game. Lol. Get better at the game instead of coming to unofficial forums to complain about having to play the game to get gear to be good.

I'll wait for you to show us how good you are at the game by linking your armory and your guild that has killed >3 bosses in mythic NH without having maxed artifacts on the majority of the raid.

[Deleted]

"Worth continuing" ? Who even wants that?! Its an excuse for Blizzard to not create items such as relics with BiS traits and people are forced to run their old raids in 2018 if this continues.

[styil]

I have to disagree. Endgame outdoor content? One zone (Tanaan) vs. five zones. Dungeons? Seven vs. Eleven. Raids? Three over two years vs. three over six months with at least two more in the works.

Maybe you are playing more and repeating more, but it's not because the options for variety aren't there. If you choose to spam MoS over and over, that's your fault not Blizz's.

The fact that we're even comparing Legion's content to WoD should be enough of a red flag as is.

[Deleted]

While the RNG nature of loot this expansion can be frustrating, I have to say I'm never running out of things to do. After Clearing Heroic NH I can do Normal NH for a chance at Titanforge tier, Legendaries and AP. Trinkets in Emerald Nightmare will be BiS if they roll up high enough. It's even worth it for me to do Karazhan for a shot at a high rolled Ring of Collapsing Future.

Just on one character I'm likely never to get all of that done along with my 15 just on my main toon and have little to no time for PvP, Best part is since your relying on a piece dropping and then that same piece rolling high you don't feel compelled to go, but it's certainly something do to instead of just sitting in your order hall.

Ya I love how they made the older raids still runnable, it's awesome for both new alts and old toons. I'm a fan of playing alts so I can fill an old raid run in the matter of minutes which is absolutely awesome. Loving the gearing system as a whole at the moment though, it's essentially impossible to achieve full best in slot which actually feels better in my opinion. The second I'd hit BiS in previous expansions I was just completely bored, this adds a new layer to raiding once you have it on farm.